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graydog 
Forum Newbie
Joined: August 29 2005
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 10
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 Topic: Sales figures
Posted: August 29 2005 at 08:24 |
So how popular is Prog? Does anybody know or is able to quantify the sales of,for example,
Gentle Giant CDs over the last decade-does anybody care? Incidently my current play list
includes East of Eden, Tractor, If, Help yourself & Delivery.
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gabbel ratchett
Forum Senior Member
Joined: March 20 2005
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 206
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Posted: August 29 2005 at 08:36 |
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Sales figures are closely guarded secrets, no prog labels or artists want anybody to know just how dismal their sales really are. Why do you think Genesis moved on to pop music?
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dead things don't talk too well, they've got a shaky sense of diction.
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maani
Special Collaborator
Founding Moderator
Joined: January 30 2004
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 2632
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Posted: August 29 2005 at 09:03 |
GR:
Bolderdash! Sales of prog albums may be difficult to ascertain, but it is not because they are dismal. May I remind you, for example, that Dark Side spent 20 years on Billboard's Top 200 - a feat achieved by no other album in any genre?
Certainly, sales figures for prog albums in general will be lower than those for "mainstream" albums. However, I'm sure the sales figures for many prog albums - including pre-commercial releases by Yes, Jethro Tull, The Moody Blues, Pink Floyd and, yes, Genesis - are higher than you may believe.
Peace.
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Sean Trane
Special Collaborator
Prog Folk
Joined: April 29 2004
Location: Heart of Europe
Status: Offline
Points: 20240
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Posted: August 29 2005 at 09:07 |
I trhink that Flower Kings , Transatlantic , Spock's Beard , Porc Tree are getting pressed up to 20.000 copies at first pressing worldwide. Re-pressings vary from 5,000 to 10.000 copies.
Those are figures I remember from an interview from Inside Out label man.
This is obviously only valid for these artists as well as Steve Hackett . Dream Theater probably (most likely) top that!
Edited by Sean Trane
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let's just stay above the moral melee
prefer the sink to the gutter
keep our sand-castle virtues
content to be a doer
as well as a thinker,
prefer lifting our pen
rather than un-sheath our sword
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Dick Heath
Special Collaborator
Jazz-Rock Specialist
Joined: April 19 2004
Location: England
Status: Offline
Points: 12812
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Posted: August 29 2005 at 09:51 |
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Caravan got a gold disc for >250,000 sales of Land of Grey & Pink - took over 20 years, but they got there
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Tony R
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator / Retired Admin
Joined: July 16 2004
Location: UK
Status: Offline
Points: 11979
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Posted: August 29 2005 at 10:18 |
Rush,Yes,ELP,Jethro Tull and Genesis have had many multi-platinum albums.
Of those,only Rush can now guarantee a top 10 album chart placing.
TMV might eventually change this situation,who knows?
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MikeEnRegalia
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: April 22 2005
Location: Sweden
Status: Online
Points: 21149
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Posted: August 29 2005 at 10:44 |
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Spock's Beard also sell big numbers of albums ... and the Flower Kings as well. But it's impossible to get exact numbers. Also, they had their peak in the mid 90s ... today I doubt that their albums go platinum any time soon ...
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maani
Special Collaborator
Founding Moderator
Joined: January 30 2004
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 2632
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Posted: August 29 2005 at 11:24 |
Ironically, the only prog band I could find definitive sales figures for was...Genesis:
From Genesis to Revelation: 2,000,000
Trespass: 2,000,000
Nursery Cryme: 3,000,000
Foxtrot: 3,000,000
Selling England: 5,000,000
The Lamb: 4,000,000
Trick: 5,000,000
W&W: 4,000,000
ATTWT: 6,000,000
Duke: 8,000,000
Abacab: 12,000,000 (!)
Genesis: 18,000,000 (!!)
Invisible Touch: 24,000,000 (!!!)
We Cant Dance: 22,000,000
Calling: 2,000,000
Re others: Pink Floyd's sales are well over 100,000,000. Tull's are over 50,000,000. ELP's are over 30,000,000. Rush's are over 50,000,000. Yes' are over 30,000,000.
Figures for newer bands like Spock's Beard and Dream Theater are not available, but my guess would be that DT is probably over 10,000,000, and SB somewhere in the 5,000,000 range.
So who said prog doesn't sell?
Peace.
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MikeEnRegalia
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: April 22 2005
Location: Sweden
Status: Online
Points: 21149
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Posted: August 29 2005 at 11:27 |
Prog sells ... but who's buying?
Prog. Err ... Peace!
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Sean Trane
Special Collaborator
Prog Folk
Joined: April 29 2004
Location: Heart of Europe
Status: Offline
Points: 20240
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Posted: August 29 2005 at 11:42 |
 maani wrote:
Figures for newer bands like Spock's Beard and Dream Theater are not available, but my guess would be that DT is probably over 10,000,000, and SB somewhere in the 5,000,000 range.
So who said prog doesn't sell?
Peace.
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From where would you take your infos
Although I find your estimation of Dream Theater sales maybe correct (my guess would half of that) , but where would you say Spock's Beard sold that many?
I mean Dream Theater fills arena size halls (up to 8,000 ) but Spock's beard once managed to do small theaters (max 1000) in continental Europe, and not even sold-out!
I am naturally no expert at sales , but the gap between them is enormous!
of course concert tickets are not the same as albums sales!
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let's just stay above the moral melee
prefer the sink to the gutter
keep our sand-castle virtues
content to be a doer
as well as a thinker,
prefer lifting our pen
rather than un-sheath our sword
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Dick Heath
Special Collaborator
Jazz-Rock Specialist
Joined: April 19 2004
Location: England
Status: Offline
Points: 12812
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Posted: August 29 2005 at 12:35 |
maani wrote:
From Genesis to Revelation: 2,000,000
Trespass: 2,000,000
Nursery Cryme: 3,000,000
Foxtrot: 3,000,000
Selling England: 5,000,000
The Lamb: 4,000,000
Trick: 5,000,000
W&W: 4,000,000
ATTWT: 6,000,000
Duke: 8,000,000
Abacab: 12,000,000 (!)
Genesis: 18,000,000 (!!)
Invisible Touch: 24,000,000 (!!!)
We Cant Dance: 22,000,000
Calling: 2,000,000 |
Can you really believe 2m for the first album - you sure an extra nought hasn't been added to most of those figures? 
Found one quote on the web suggesting Fleetwood Mac's Rumours by 1997
had sold 25 millions - and what that, the 3 or 4 th best selling album
ever? The local remaindered book shop have been selling a series
of books with the title (approx) the best selling albums of the decade,
(Abacab is included in one but sales figures, if I remember correctly,
are <5million.
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Chris Flynn
Forum Newbie
Joined: August 14 2005
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 13
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Posted: August 29 2005 at 13:13 |
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I have an "inside" connection with one of the major prog bands
with THE prog label.... your typical new release from the prog
world sells approx 50,000 units.
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Tony R
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator / Retired Admin
Joined: July 16 2004
Location: UK
Status: Offline
Points: 11979
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Posted: August 29 2005 at 14:51 |
Chris Flynn wrote:
I have an "inside" connection with one of the major prog bands with THE prog label.... your typical new release from the prog world sells approx 50,000 units. |
I guess that would be in the USA.Sounds about right.
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Dick Heath
Special Collaborator
Jazz-Rock Specialist
Joined: April 19 2004
Location: England
Status: Offline
Points: 12812
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Posted: August 29 2005 at 15:05 |
Chris Flynn wrote:
I have an "inside" connection with one of the major prog bands
with THE prog label.... your typical new release from the prog
world sells approx 50,000 units.
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Somebody I know who'se albums were released by SPV, told me the label
isn't likely to renew contracts unless a minimum of 50k are sold.
Therefore he discovered that self produced albums, made and
packaged privately, will generate enough revenue to survive and make
another album, if 5000 copies minimum are sold per annum - but problems
lies with advertising and therefore there is considerable
reliance of the web and word of mouth. Equally don't believe these
truly indie prog artists can afford to have people pirate their
albums.
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maani
Special Collaborator
Founding Moderator
Joined: January 30 2004
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 2632
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Posted: August 29 2005 at 15:13 |
Sean:
Re Spock's Beard, I was only hazarding a guess. I could easily be off by a factor of two...
Dick:
According to the RIAA, the following are the stats for best-selling albums:
Eagles - Greatest Hits (28,000,000)
Jackson - Thriller (26,000,000)
Floyd - The Wall (23,000,000)
Zep - Zep IV (22,000,000)
B Joel - Greatest Hits Vol I (21,000,000)
The Beatles - White Album (19,000,000)
AC/DC - Back in Black (19,000,000)
Twain - Come on Over (19,000,000)
Fleetwod Mac - Rumors (18,000,000)
Given this, I don't know where the site I found gave figures of 24, 22, and 18 for the three later Genesis albums...
Peace.
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Garion81
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: May 22 2004
Location: So Cal, USA
Status: Offline
Points: 4338
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Posted: August 29 2005 at 19:33 |
Tony R wrote:
Chris Flynn wrote:
I have an "inside" connection with one of the major prog bands with THE prog label.... your typical new release from the prog world sells approx 50,000 units. |
I guess that would be in the USA.Sounds about right.
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Not just USA anymore Tony with internet sales being what they are. Lables such as Inside Out count the world figures into play before they sign an artist or release a CD. I read an artical about Kansas last album Somewhere to Elsewhere (2000) it mentioned that the president of Magna Carta told Kansas they had sold 30,000,000 albums (All releases combined) to date.
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"What are you going to do when that damn thing rusts?"
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stripthesoul
Forum Groupie
Joined: August 26 2005
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 88
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Posted: August 29 2005 at 21:28 |
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Why is it that prog sold so much better in the 70's than it does
now? It's not like Americans were inherently more intelligent or
knew more about music back then. Sure, our popular culture now is
dumbed down, but it was then too in a lot of ways. What changed
and caused prog to become such an underground art form?
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"Feminism is the radical notion that women are human beings." --Cheris Kramerae
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gabbel ratchett
Forum Senior Member
Joined: March 20 2005
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 206
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Posted: August 29 2005 at 22:13 |
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90% of the bands listed in this site would be pleased as punch to move 3000 units of their new release in the first 12 months. Prog is not big bussiness, does not move big money and is not easy to market.
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dead things don't talk too well, they've got a shaky sense of diction.
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Arsillus
Forum Senior Member
Joined: March 26 2005
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 7374
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Posted: August 29 2005 at 22:17 |
MikeEnRegalia wrote:
Prog sells ... but who's buying?
Prog. Err ... Peace!
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floydaholic
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 30 2005
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 240
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Posted: August 30 2005 at 00:15 |
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Darkside is kinda prog and it sold 35 million worldwide.
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I'll see you on the Darkside of the moon...
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