Religion Poll

maani wrote: Goose: If you are interested, there is a cute book called "God Does Not Believe in Atheists."  Indeed, I recommend it for all. James: Although I realize it will only complicate matters (), you put blame for "the deaths of everyone we have ever known or cared about" on only one entity.  Yes, God is responsible for some deaths.  But "the enemy" is responsible for far more of them.  As Verbal Kint says in Usual Suspects: "The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was to convince people that he doesn't exist."  By falling into that trap (...), you end up blaming God for "the devil's work." Peace.

I think I was a little down when I wrote that post. Too much misery in the world. The concept of god is tempting for those looking to place blame as well.

If there was an omnipotent god, incapable of mistakes, then that would satisfy those who need meaning and reason (in times of tragedy especially, but generally as well). Unfortunately, it rarely comes with a truly satisfying explanation; thus the "mysterious ways" concept.

I don't need to understand everything (things like calculus, automatic transmission repair and John Travolta's continuing popularity will always be completely beyond me) but Judeo-Christian religions inevitably taper off into mysteries concerning the divine plan. I can understand where a few deaths might have made the world a better place, but the sheer scale of pointless suffering- for the virtuous as well as the sinful- makes talk about a "loving god" seem hollow.

Even when the blame could be laid at the devil's feet, god is accountable for lack of action and a general lack of intelligible heaven-to-earth communication (if CNN can be unreliable, how about centuries-old interpretations of translations of hearsay! ).

On one hand, one might say that the obstacles we face strengthen us- but honestly, that's equally true and false, like any other easy answer. If god means to make us better people through suffering, the past 2000+ years of Christian growth have not shown much progress in that area. Christian arguments for a benevolent deity have the same ring as the excuses of battered wives.

Human beings have the power to make the world a heaven (we really could, right now), but it seems that we usually have more tendency and success creating the opposite...so I can't really call myself a Humanist. Too much emphasis on reason fails us as utterly as too much emphasis on faith. Of course, I can't say conclusively that there is no god, just as no believer can prove that one exists...but I think we should learn to find our positive motivations in life instead of an after-life. It's just a little harder sometimes to find joy in living rather than in the escapism of mythology.

Sweetnighter wrote: Tony R wrote: maani wrote: Goose: If you are interested, there is a cute book called "God Does Not Believe in Atheists."  Indeed, I recommend it for all. James: Although I realize it will only complicate matters (), you put blame for "the deaths of everyone we have ever known or cared about" on only one entity.  Yes, God is responsible for some deaths.  But "the enemy" is responsible for far more of them.  As Verbal Kint says in Usual Suspects: "The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was to convince people that he doesn't exist."  By falling into that trap (...), you end up blaming God for "the devil's work." Peace. Very interesting that you accept that "God is responsible for some deaths", Would you care to elaborate on this shock admission? Atheism is just a tag that doesnt really make sense IMO.I believe that trees exist but arent God...does that make me a dendroatheist? I dont believe that I can walk through a 5 foot thick steel barrier,is there a name for that? Disbelief in God is a rationale that doesnt need a fancy tag. Whats wrong with the title atheism? It just means "the opposite of theism" or "the opposite in the belief in gods" or "belief that there are no gods". Its not a 'fancy tag', its just a name for a certain kind of philosophy. I don't believe any higher powers exist, so I consider myself an atheist. Really, its a very broad philosophy that emcompasses lots of other philosophies. For instance, communists and objectivists are diametrically opposed on every issue, except that both are atheists (one saying that a belief in gods is irrational, the other saying that the creation of gods is a tool of the bourgeoisie to suppress the masses). Its not a fancy title, just a classification.

There is no problem with there being a title for the non-belief in God per se.I have a problem with people calling themselves atheist or being called atheist.The title makes it sound like a cause to be adhered to. My disbelief in God is linked to my non-belief in ghosts,psychic phenomena,UFO's and all the other "whimsy" that people find it necessary to invest their time and sanity in.

You say:

"Its not a 'fancy tag', its just a name for a certain kind of philosophy."

I say "case proven" in my favour.You cannot even begin to understand how much that statement stinks of intellectual snobbery........and linking Communism and Objectivism through non-belief in God is ..hmmmmm-be nice young noob.

Tony R wrote: Sweetnighter wrote: Tony R wrote: maani wrote: Goose: If you are interested, there is a cute book called "God Does Not Believe in Atheists."  Indeed, I recommend it for all. James: Although I realize it will only complicate matters (), you put blame for "the deaths of everyone we have ever known or cared about" on only one entity.  Yes, God is responsible for some deaths.  But "the enemy" is responsible for far more of them.  As Verbal Kint says in Usual Suspects: "The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was to convince people that he doesn't exist."  By falling into that trap (...), you end up blaming God for "the devil's work." Peace. Very interesting that you accept that "God is responsible for some deaths", Would you care to elaborate on this shock admission? Atheism is just a tag that doesnt really make sense IMO.I believe that trees exist but arent God...does that make me a dendroatheist? I dont believe that I can walk through a 5 foot thick steel barrier,is there a name for that? Disbelief in God is a rationale that doesnt need a fancy tag. Whats wrong with the title atheism? It just means "the opposite of theism" or "the opposite in the belief in gods" or "belief that there are no gods". Its not a 'fancy tag', its just a name for a certain kind of philosophy. I don't believe any higher powers exist, so I consider myself an atheist. Really, its a very broad philosophy that emcompasses lots of other philosophies. For instance, communists and objectivists are diametrically opposed on every issue, except that both are atheists (one saying that a belief in gods is irrational, the other saying that the creation of gods is a tool of the bourgeoisie to suppress the masses). Its not a fancy title, just a classification. There is no problem with there being a title for the non-belief in God per se.I have a problem with people calling themselves atheist or being called atheist.The title makes it sound like a cause to be adhered to. My disbelief in God is linked to my non-belief in ghosts,psychic phenomena,UFO's and all the other "whimsy" that people find it necessary to invest their time and sanity in. You say: "Its not a 'fancy tag', its just a name for a certain kind of philosophy." I say "case proven" in my favour.You cannot even begin to understand how much that statement stinks of intellectual snobbery........and linking Communism and Objectivism through non-belief in God is ..hmmmmm-be nice young noob.

I have to agree with this mouthy little newbie

Why is organised religion more believable than anything else that can not be proven scientifically, and relies on blind faith for survival. My disbelief in God is based on similar reasoning here.

BTW, I cant vote either  Not that I'll lose much sleep over it.

Sweetnighter could reply better if he reads what we have written instead of what he thinks we have written.......

I am saying that "atheism" does not have to be a philosophy,that is all.A religious man like Maani is always conscious of his beliefs,they underpin his spiritual life in the non-spiritual world.I do not walk around wearing a mental badge saying "I do not believe in God",it would be as pointless to me as having to declare that "Peter Gabriel is not a member of Led Zepellin" or "Geddy Lee is a member of Rush"