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James Lee 
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: June 05 2004
Status: Offline
Points: 3525
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 Posted: April 04 2005 at 15:44 |
I'm sorry, but I find that a little ridiculous. If anything, I think people should have sex before marriage, because there's such a thing as sexual incompatibility. Honestly, there are few things as dangerous to a marriage. Of course, a married couple can and should always work at improving their sex life, but there's really no substitute for bringing some practical experience with you (I just don't necessarily want to hear about her experiences too often  ).
And since gays can't marry, I take it you also believe homosexuality is wrong?
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emdiar
Forum Senior Member
Joined: June 05 2004
Location: Netherlands
Status: Offline
Points: 890
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Posted: April 04 2005 at 15:45 |
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Perception is truth, ergo opinion is fact.
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Peter
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: January 31 2004
Location: Canada
Status: Offline
Points: 9669
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Posted: April 04 2005 at 16:22 |
 I'm all for it -- but be careful.
Sex, for me, is connected to actually caring about (if not "loving") the other person.
When single, I did not date ladies I did not first like as people, so I never had sex just for my own sake.
Much....
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"And, has thou slain the Jabberwock?
Come to my arms, my beamish boy!
O frabjous day! Callooh! Callay!'
He chortled in his joy.
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Easy Livin
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator / Retired Admin
Joined: February 21 2004
Location: Scotland
Status: Offline
Points: 15585
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Posted: April 04 2005 at 16:43 |
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Dan Bobrowski
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: February 02 2004
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 5243
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Posted: April 04 2005 at 16:51 |
Sex is great. 
Especially with another person.
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diddy
Prog Reviewer
Joined: March 02 2004
Location: Germany
Status: Offline
Points: 1117
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Posted: April 04 2005 at 16:57 |
 danbo wrote:
Sex is great.
Especially with another person.
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If liberty means anything at all, it means the right to tell people what they do not want to hear...
George Orwell
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Certif1ed
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: April 08 2004
Location: England
Status: Offline
Points: 7559
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Posted: April 04 2005 at 17:00 |
If you've had sex and you still want to marry, there's got to be SOMETHING good there!
If you've then got married and you still want to have sex with each other - that's got to be as near perfect as you're going to get. 
You're a bit stuck if you get married and find out that sex together is nowhere near as good as sex elsewhere...
HOWEVER
Let your HEART be the engine - but let your MIND do the driving...
And remember: Experience is the comb that Mother Nature gives us when we go bald...
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Man With Hat
Collaborator
Jazz-Rock/Fusion/Canterbury Team
Joined: March 12 2005
Location: Neurotica
Status: Offline
Points: 166183
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Posted: April 04 2005 at 17:15 |
danbo wrote:
Sex is great.
Especially with another person.
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Exactly
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Dig me...But don't...Bury me
I'm running still, I shall until, one day, I hope that I'll arrive
Warning: Listening to jazz excessively can cause a laxative effect.
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threefates
Forum Senior Member
Joined: June 30 2004
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 4215
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Posted: April 04 2005 at 18:12 |
Well, since I don't really believe in marriage... and I just adore sex... I guess you know my answer.
Plus, I don't believe that sex is meant to be limited like that... before marriage, in love, etc....
Sex is sex... you can enjoy it in many ways.... Now love and marriage they go together.. but sex is a whole matter all to itself....
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THIS IS ELP
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maani
Special Collaborator
Founding Moderator
Joined: January 30 2004
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 2632
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Posted: April 04 2005 at 18:27 |
James:
I must respectfully disagree with your comment that "If anything, I think people should have sex before marriage, because there's such a thing as sexual incompatibility."
I have a friend who was a "normal" girl through college; not a "sleep-around," but had a boyfriend or two, including sex. She then "re-found" her faith, and chose to remain abstinent until marriage. She found a boyfriend, and they got engaged, planning to be married a year later. Note that they agreed not to have sex until after marriage. (N.B. I think most people equate abstinence with a complete lack of a physical relationship. This is incorrect. Holding hands, hugging and kissing are all permitted; it is only the touching and "engagement" of "private parts" that is forbidden.)
I ask her your exact question: What happens if, when you finally have sex, the sex is bad, or you are simply incompatible? Her answer remains with me to this day: "Ian, if you build a relationship on all the right things - love, trust, honesty, mutual respect and admiration, common ground, etc. - how can the sex be anything but good?"
Although I cannot comment from experience on this, I would have to agree in principle. Indeed, although most marriages that fail (6 out of 10 in the U.S.) do so for reasons having to do with money, I would posit that the second biggest reason is that many marriages are initially based on sex, and when the sex becomes "boring" or otherwise "rote," there is not enough of a true "foundation" - love, trust, honesty, etc. - to sustain the relationship.
Note that this is separate and apart from my beliefs as a Christian.
Peace.
[P.S. to threefates: As one who professes to be a Christian, how do you square your "sex is sex and can be enjoyed in many ways" with the Scripture?"]
Edited by maani
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Garion81
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: May 22 2004
Location: So Cal, USA
Status: Offline
Points: 4338
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Posted: April 04 2005 at 19:11 |
maani wrote:
James:
II ask her your exact question: What happens if, when you finally have sex, the sex is bad, or you are simply incompatible? Her answer remains with me to this day: "Ian, if you build a relationship on all the right things - love, trust, honesty, mutual respect and admiration, common ground, etc. - how can the sex be anything but good?"
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Easy. There are many things that make up a good sexual relationship vs. a good relationship. They are separate animals. We can have all sorts of great relationships with friends that are non-sexual. Great Sexual relationships take time, patience and communication. Some people aren't aroused unless they get specific things that sometimes they don't even know about satisfied. (There have been women I have been with that absolutely swear they will never do something and then turn to find out that is exactly what they wanted) Some people don't know how to talk to their partner. This is when things break down and people are unsatisfied and stray. You could get this information about each other if we were honest enough with a potential partner that this is what we like. Christians especially are subject to this sex is bad condition or anything other than the missionary style “wham bam thank you mam” kind of sex is taboo. If a pastor can get up and tell people sex outside of marriage is wrong, if adultery is wrong if immorality is wrong he better be able to tell them what is right. He can say as Paul did “The marriage bed is undefiled” and mean it. What that says is that you can be different you can try new things and enjoy each other in new ways and you should be open to it if your partner wants to. 50% divorce rates are staggering in this day and age and most of them are about this very subject
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"What are you going to do when that damn thing rusts?"
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Spanky
Forum Senior Member
Joined: April 07 2004
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 389
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Posted: April 04 2005 at 19:40 |
FuzzyDude wrote:
Sex was around way before marriage. I married a
very sexual woman, but not because she was very open, but because she
was such a kind and wonderful person. I don't believe marriage has
anything to do with sex. I think marriage has more to do with trust and
connection with eachother.
On a related note, I am offended by the notion of polygamy. I feel marriage is intended to be a one-on-one affair. |
]
Those are pretty much my thoughts too. I don't see it as cheating
on my future spouse, because for all I know, I have yet to even meet my
future spouse. It's not about sex, that's just a way of showing
affection for the person you love, married or not.
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Coalinga knows how to party.
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gdub411
Forum Senior Member
Joined: August 24 2004
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 3484
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Posted: April 04 2005 at 20:40 |
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I'm gay,.. so yeah.
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threefates
Forum Senior Member
Joined: June 30 2004
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 4215
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Posted: April 04 2005 at 22:24 |
maani wrote:
[P.S. to threefates: As one who professes to be a Christian, how do you square your "sex is sex and can be enjoyed in many ways" with the Scripture?"]
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Because its just sex... when you're not in love. If I was in love with one and having sex with another... or even professing love with one and having sex with another... then I would be wrong... but sex for sex's sake... its just a little pleasure in this world where pleasure is far and few between... a connection, a moment of release...
I see sex as medicinal, which is why I think my boss needs to get laid. I think it would improve her disposition 100%...
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THIS IS ELP
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maani
Special Collaborator
Founding Moderator
Joined: January 30 2004
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 2632
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Posted: April 05 2005 at 00:05 |
Garion:
I'm curious: While it is true that Christians believe that sex outside of (or prior to) marriage is wrong, what makes you say that Christians are not supposed to have anything other than "missionary style" sex? I know of no Scripture, teaching, Papal bull or any other thing that says this. A married Christian couple is permitted to "explore" just as much as a non-Christian married couple. The idea that we are limited to "missionary style" is a myth.
Peace.
threefates:
There are over 100 specific and direct proscriptions against "sex for sex' sake" in the Scriptures - and not one supporting it. I'm not sure you're reading the same Scriptures or practicing the same faith as I am.
Peace.
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threefates
Forum Senior Member
Joined: June 30 2004
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 4215
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Posted: April 05 2005 at 01:06 |
Thats because you translate like a man!!
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THIS IS ELP
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gdub411
Forum Senior Member
Joined: August 24 2004
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 3484
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Posted: April 05 2005 at 02:46 |
What Maani is saying, Linda, is people with questionable lifestyles, such as us , are basicly sinning sexual degenerates.
Edited by gdub411
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Metropolis
Forum Senior Member
Joined: December 20 2004
Location: Scotland
Status: Offline
Points: 760
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Posted: April 05 2005 at 03:35 |
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^Damn
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We Lost the Skyline............
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Radioactive Toy
Forum Senior Member
Joined: March 06 2004
Location: Netherlands
Status: Offline
Points: 953
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Posted: April 05 2005 at 04:03 |
James Lee wrote:
I'm sorry, but I find that a little ridiculous. If anything, I think people should have sex before marriage, because there's such a thing as sexual incompatibility. Honestly, there are few things as dangerous to a marriage. Of course, a married couple can and should always work at improving their sex life, but there's really no substitute for bringing some practical experience with you (I just don't necessarily want to hear about her experiences too often ).
And since gays can't marry, I take it you also believe homosexuality is wrong?
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Gays CAN marry! oh wait a moment.. I live in sinful holland ofcourse!
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Reed's failed joke counter:
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R.I.P. You could have reached infinity....
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Sean Trane
Special Collaborator
Prog Folk
Joined: April 29 2004
Location: Heart of Europe
Status: Offline
Points: 20338
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Posted: April 05 2005 at 04:11 |
You'd better have sex before marriage , because women do not have sex readily after marriage unless for procreation. And they do a lot more things before marriage in order to get married but stop doing those once married.
Nothing wrong at all with sex before marrying (I am 42 , still single , and loving every single second of LIVING IN SIN , getting laid as much as I can) , since this marriage thing is yet another ploy to hold us on psychological leash, stopping us from having fun. This is one of the many reason why I de-christened myself and live completely happily as an atheist and feast like a pagan
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let's just stay above the moral melee
prefer the sink to the gutter
keep our sand-castle virtues
content to be a doer
as well as a thinker,
prefer lifting our pen
rather than un-sheath our sword
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Sex before marriage
