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Jim Garten View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Topic: Bowie does prog
    Posted: November 12 2010 at 07:45
Hmmm - but do they contain Mellotrons?

Jon Lord 1941 - 2012
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 12 2010 at 07:44
Originally posted by Intruder Intruder wrote:

Prog or not prog?  Nonsense to me.....this site has turned me on to some groovy music and the addition/exclusion of bands that may fall into one of the many categories doesn't water things down, it just adds to the possibility that somebody somewhere might happen upon a review, feature or forum discussion that might turn their head in a new direction.

Arguing for inclusion, to me, is just a way of passing something one may believe valuable to another....I don't think ego is involved, just love of music.
Fair enough.
 
 (Bowie is listed on PA, of course.)
 
I love that album, BTW, and i've reviewed it, if you're interested: http://www.progarchives.com/Review.asp?id=279786
 
If you like the rocking Mick Ronson-era early Bowie, then other essential albums are the superb Ziggy Stardust, and the somewhat uneven Aladdin Sane. Hunky Dory is another early must-have.
 
 I have almost all of Bowie's discography -- his albums encompass many styles, and many are gems, while some have only a song or two to recommend them. I'd be happy to help you select more to try, if you like.Smile


Edited by Peter - November 12 2010 at 07:50
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 11 2010 at 23:43

Prog or not prog?  Nonsense to me.....this site has turned me on to some groovy music and the addition/exclusion of bands that may fall into one of the many categories doesn't water things down, it just adds to the possibility that somebody somewhere might happen upon a review, feature or forum discussion that might turn their head in a new direction.

Arguing for inclusion, to me, is just a way of passing something one may believe valuable to another....I don't think ego is involved, just love of music.
I like to feel the suspense when you're certain you know I am there.....
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 11 2010 at 11:06
Originally posted by ExittheLemming ExittheLemming wrote:

Originally posted by Peter Peter wrote:

Bowie does good, intelligent, innovative, ever-changing music -- get over the "prog" label.


 

Seriously, I think this whole "but, for the love of God, IS IT PROG????" business is pretty pointless -- and this site, with its vast range of music styles, has largely made me think that.

The term means less and less (or is that more and more) with every new "sub-genre", "related" category, and far-ranging, or after-the-fact addition.

 

Just something to argue about -- or maybe a way to justify one's taste, or even to feel superior in your fortress of solititude. Geek

 

It's just  MUSIC, folks. Not a valid way to decide upon friendships (or the qualities of women) -- that's kiddy stuff.Stern Smile

 

 

Sorry -- I'll go away again now. Wink
I do empathize with your sentiments here and yes, the never ending search for justification for subjective tastes in pseudo objective 'my Venn diagram says it's Prog' terms is tiresomeBUTUntil such time as the whole raison d'etre of the site is changed by (Max, I guess?) then we will continue to be governed by the stated aims of Progressive ArchivesPerhaps like yourself, I've long held the view now that PA faces something of a crossroads (more likely a roundabout with our membership) Wink and that what started as a strict exclusive policy, has for the reasons you stated re the controversial 'related' additions and proliferation of sub-genres, become so blurred between the incestuous definitions, that we are tantamount to being part of the way towards an inclusive site. This won't be a bad thing in my book but a clear watershed has yet to be established and I wonder if the members of PA would be so opposed to the site becoming an archive where Yes, ELP, Crimson and Genesis would happily rub shoulders with (say Television, Magazine), Bowie, NIN, Robert Plant, Sparks, Sabbath etc and all the other artists whose only common feature is that their music excites the members?Sorry to go off on a tangent Embarrassed


Off at a tangent, possibly, but excellent posts both

Personally, I've always found Bowie's 'Warszawa' to be extremely proggy

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 11 2010 at 10:01
Originally posted by Peter Peter wrote:

Bowie does good, intelligent, innovative, ever-changing music -- get over the "prog" label.
 
Seriously, I think this whole "but, for the love of God, IS IT PROG????" business is pretty pointless -- and this site, with its vast range of music styles, has largely made me think that.
The term means less and less (or is that more and more) with every new "sub-genre", "related" category, and far-ranging, or after-the-fact addition.
 
Just something to argue about -- or maybe a way to justify one's taste, or even to feel superior in your fortress of solititude. Geek
 
It's just  MUSIC, folks. Not a valid way to decide upon friendships (or the qualities of women) -- that's kiddy stuff.Stern Smile
 
 
Sorry -- I'll go away again now. Wink


I do empathize with your sentiments here and yes, the never ending search for justification for subjective tastes in pseudo objective 'my Venn diagram says it's Prog' terms is tiresome

BUT

Until such time as the whole raison d'etre of the site is changed by (Max, I guess?) then we will continue to be governed by the stated aims of Progressive Archives

Perhaps like yourself, I've long held the view now that PA faces something of a crossroads (more likely a roundabout with our membership) Wink and that what started as a strict exclusive policy, has for the reasons you stated re the controversial 'related' additions and proliferation of sub-genres, become so blurred between the incestuous definitions, that we are tantamount to being part of the way towards an inclusive site. This won't be a bad thing in my book but a clear watershed has yet to be established and I wonder if the members of PA would be so opposed to the site becoming an archive where Yes, ELP, Crimson and Genesis would happily rub shoulders with (say Television, Magazine), Bowie, NIN, Robert Plant, Sparks, Sabbath etc and all the other artists whose only common feature is that their music excites the members?

Sorry to go off on a tangent Embarrassed






Edited by ExittheLemming - November 11 2010 at 10:02
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 11 2010 at 07:19
It's interesting how Bowie fans around here seem to fall into two camps: those who like his early stuff, but not much after the 70's and those who like his later 70's stuff and onward better.  I'm in the latter category.
Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 11 2010 at 02:06
Bowie does good, intelligent, innovative, ever-changing music -- get over the "prog" label.
 
Seriously, I think this whole "but, for the love of God, IS IT PROG????" business is pretty pointless -- and this site, with its vast range of music styles, has largely made me think that.
The term means less and less (or is that more and more) with every new "sub-genre", "related" category, and far-ranging, or after-the-fact addition.
 
Just something to argue about -- or maybe a way to justify one's taste, or even to feel superior in your fortress of solititude. Geek
 
It's just  MUSIC, folks. Not a valid way to decide upon friendships (or the qualities of women) -- that's kiddy stuff.Stern Smile
 
 
Sorry -- I'll go away again now. Wink
"And, has thou slain the Jabberwock?
Come to my arms, my beamish boy!
O frabjous day! Callooh! Callay!'
He chortled in his joy.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 03 2010 at 10:33
Originally posted by lucas lucas wrote:

The labum he released in 1995, 'Outside' is rather experimental and mixes a lot of musical genres : indus rock, jazz, techno, pop...This is one of his most outstanding albums.



Yep agreed, probably my favourite Bowie album (but I'm not that keen on anything else apart from bits of Heroes, Scary Monsters and Hunky Dory)
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 03 2010 at 04:56
Bewlay  Brothers, Quicksand, Cygnet Committee, Subterraneans ....pretty much everything he recorded up to and including Scary Monsters is essential.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 02 2010 at 21:48
BTW this was a pretty good book:

http://33third.blogspot.com/2005/08/low.html
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 02 2010 at 21:47
Thumbs Up

One thing I've picked up from this thread is that there's still a lot of Bowie I need to give a listen to.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 02 2010 at 20:49
Bowie is truly progressive music, but not "progressive rock" as a genre. In other words, progressive approach, not prog by style.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 02 2010 at 15:55
Originally posted by Dean Dean wrote:

I would have picked Width Of A Circle as being the more Progressive Rock, then Wild Eye Boy From Freecloud, Cygnet Comittee and Memory of a Free Festival from the previous album were Prog too.

 
This indeed. All the Madmen may be the finest song on the album, but The Width of a Circle is proggier, like the other songs mentioned here.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 02 2010 at 15:48
Originally posted by thechrisl thechrisl wrote:

(thread moved) Guess we know how the admins feel about Bowie & prog...


The thread was moved to the Prog-Related lounge (possibly by me) because Bowie is included in Prog-Related.  I think he has merit for Crossover Prog (especially for the Berlin trilogy), though I'm fine with him in Prog Related, and if he were ever moved to that category, then this would be better suited to the Prog bands/ artists Appreciation lounge. It has to do with how we organise the categories.

I like his Krautrock influenced music.

By the way, a couple of tracks I like muchly off of "Heroes":






Edited by Logan - November 02 2010 at 15:50
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 02 2010 at 13:16
(thread moved) Guess we know how the admins feel about Bowie & prog...
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 01 2010 at 22:00
Originally posted by tarkus1980 tarkus1980 wrote:

"The Man Who Sold the World" (the album, not the song) = Big Fat Ehn.  Half good, half not.



Actually that's a good way to put it.  In fact all the Bowie albums I've heard (even Low, hell, even Let's Dance) contain some really great tracks and some not so great, annoying even. 

I would agree he is generally about as progressive as an artist can get in the most literal terms, touching on various prog styles often along with many other.  But there are 5-6 songs on this album that (given the year, 1970!) could have been just as influential on the big prog wave to come as the bands we always refer to.  Even soon to be A list bands like Queen and Led Zep weren't rockin' this hard and this trippy in 1970.

Soon after, Bowie came to be identified with the glam crowd, which influenced the punk crowd (aka, the whole anti-prog thing).  Probably one reason why he's not often thought of as a "prog" influence.  That is until you start thinking about it.

Anyway, that's what I was trying to say but probably still haven't done a very good job...

 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 01 2010 at 19:32
I had a copy of Heroes, but when I tried Outside, I started to explore his catalog further.
Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 01 2010 at 19:03
The Berlin trilogy of Low, Heroes and Lodger....prog all over the place.  Even in his blue-eyed soul period Bowie was doing proggy stuff....Station to Station also has prog all over it.  Of course, it was the sound of the times and Bowie was definitely a genre jumper....whatever worked (and sold).
I like to feel the suspense when you're certain you know I am there.....
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 01 2010 at 16:09

"The Man Who Sold the World" (the album, not the song) = Big Fat Ehn.  Half good, half not.

"History of Rock Written by the Losers."
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 01 2010 at 15:58

The labum he released in 1995, 'Outside' is rather experimental and mixes a lot of musical genres : indus rock, jazz, techno, pop...This is one of his most outstanding albums.

"Magma was the very first gothic rock band" (Didier Lockwood)
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