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Logan
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Topic: Why add more artists? Posted: November 22 2007 at 13:46 |
If one is trying for the most complete Prog database, then one has to add more bands (as I'm sure must have been said, but this time I'll post before reading the comments).
I've discovered some great bands here that were not reviewed at the time -- not just new additions too. The bio, mp3s if available, and link to the official site has got me into a few bands sans reviews here (some have just had ratings, some not even that). If the bio (and category as I've often searched for bands I don't know in whatever category and country I'm particularly interested in at the time) piques my curiosity, even without reviews or mp3s here, I will try to find more information (clicking on the homepage link if available, or doing a google or myspace search --all if possible). But then I like to discover the more obscure artists and research for myself via search engines (then if I feel like it, have something I want to say, I will try to discuss the band in the forums).
And of course if a band is not here then it cannot be reviewed/ rated (except in the board forums).
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Aristilus
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Posted: November 22 2007 at 05:38 |
Why not. The more the merrier.
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MonkeyphoneAlex
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Posted: November 21 2007 at 10:10 |
I buy as many as my budget allows for.
Edited by Easy Livin - November 21 2007 at 11:00
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"Information is not knowledge. Knowledge is not wisdom. Wisdom is not truth. Truth is not beauty. Beauty is not love. Love is not music. Music is THE BEST."
-FZ
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Padraic
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Posted: November 20 2007 at 20:54 |
I'm continually stunned by the variety and volume of prog artists a lot of folks around here listen to. Do they actually buy that many CDs? They must not have a wife.
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Ivan_Melgar_M
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Posted: November 17 2007 at 22:55 |
aapatsos wrote:
^ agreed, enforcement is not a good way of achieving goals... encourage sounds better I guess... anyway, I believe that albums without reviews need to be minimised I know it's not easy, but with encouragement something can be done and of course you need motivation, nobody can be forced to write a review the list that the Admin Team has set up about unreviewed albums is a great way to do this maybe you need to advertise this list more... just a few suggestions...
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The problem is not advertising, the problem is economic, take for instance:
- I have 2,000 LP's = US$ 18,000
- 1026 single CD's = US$ 26,672 at Peruvian price
- 39 Double CD's = US$ 1,600.00 at Peruvioan Price
- 150 DVD's ? US$ 6,000 at Peruvian Price being conservative.
It makes US$ 52,276.00 not counting cassettes, CDR's, etc.
Where in hell can i get more money to buy rare stuff living in South America?
You can advertise, encourage or even enforce the reviewing of new material, but I don't have the money, I spent too much already, so I have to buy what I'm sure i will like.
Iván
Edited by Ivan_Melgar_M - November 17 2007 at 23:00
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aapatsos
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Posted: November 17 2007 at 21:30 |
^ agreed, enforcement is not a good way of achieving goals... encourage sounds better I guess... anyway, I believe that albums without reviews need to be minimised I know it's not easy, but with encouragement something can be done and of course you need motivation, nobody can be forced to write a review the list that the Admin Team has set up about unreviewed albums is a great way to do this maybe you need to advertise this list more... just a few suggestions...
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Dean
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Posted: November 17 2007 at 21:14 |
^ good point, and many of the people who propose a band to the teams are often the first to write a review anyway, but I don't think we should enforce this as a general policy.
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aapatsos
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Posted: November 17 2007 at 21:12 |
^ thanks for making this clear, fair enough I actually meant that a full demo or album must be heard first so that there is a chance for a review along with the addition of the band in the site
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Dean
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Posted: November 17 2007 at 21:05 |
aapatsos wrote:
I think the answer is somewhere in the middle...
New bands must be added if they are spotted, so that the site remains comprehensive... ...but someone who proposes an addition must be familiar with a band's recordings or even demos... I believe this is a fair way, even if it's somewhat hard to find recorded material for every band
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The genre teams cannot add a band without hearing a fair sample of the music. If a band is so obscure that samples cannot be found then they cannot and will not be added.
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aapatsos
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Posted: November 17 2007 at 20:58 |
I think the answer is somewhere in the middle...
New bands must be added if they are spotted, so that the site remains comprehensive... ...but someone who proposes an addition must be familiar with a band's recordings or even demos... I believe this is a fair way, even if it's somewhat hard to find recorded material for every band
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Vibrationbaby
Forum Senior Member
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Posted: November 05 2007 at 10:40 |
Peter is right, I was lucky to have had access to so many second hand shops in Montréal where I found most of my albums back in the seventies. We also had a Sam The Record Man here in Montréal but it was not quite as comprehensive as the Toronto store. I`d always start there when in TO and then go to a second hand store a bit further down on Yonge called "The Incredible Record Store ", or something like that. It was owned by a guy by the name of Jonathan Lipsin, I also used to haul some goodies out of there as well. I understand what you`re saying about $$$$$$$$$$ and CDs. I just bought Moonlight Whispers by Larry Coryell at HMV here in Montréal and it cost me over $40 ( If a particular someone found out I would be crucified ). As for scarcity I actually find that a lot of previously hard-to-find-stuff has become recently available on labels such as Revisited Records and Wounded Bird Records which are readily available through big retailers such as HMV as special orders. While the Revisited Records titles can be a little on the pricey side, the Wounded Bird releases are much more reasonable as low as $19.99 which is what I paid for Jan Akkerman`s Tabernakel.
Edited by Vibrationbaby - November 05 2007 at 10:41
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Peter
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Posted: November 04 2007 at 17:39 |
Peace Vibe, ol' comrade in prog -- and keep reviewing those obscurities. A river can start with a trickle....
But sorry I cannot join in -- when I was first getting into prog, and in my circle, my explorations of non-English prog bands like PFM, Can, Amon Duul II and Triumvirat -- even Nektar -- were forays into the "obscure." We simply did not have any way to hear of -- let alone buy -- stuff that was any less "mainstream." (In prog fan circles, that is.)
(You grew up in Montreal, no? A more cosmopolitan place than my home, then or now.)
BTW, I just bought some CDs during a trip to Toronto. 4 discs, & not a prog one among them (unless you count the Beatles - Revolver). I was looking for IQ, Subterranea, but no luck (though the store had "Ever"). 2 of the 3 major downtown music stores had closed, including the iconic Sam the Record Man. Draw your own conclusions re the health of the industry.  Even on Amazon.ca, prog other than that from the biggest acts can be hard to find, or afford. The last time I checked, Caravan's In the Land of Grey and Pink was an expen$ive import that (in my experience with the company) might take months to ship.
It's one thing to review the lesser-known stuff which you may own, but quite another for most folks to be able to find it, or even afford it. 
Edited by Peter - November 04 2007 at 17:40
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"And, has thou slain the Jabberwock? Come to my arms, my beamish boy! O frabjous day! Callooh! Callay!' He chortled in his joy.
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Prog-jester
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Posted: November 04 2007 at 03:41 |
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Vibrationbaby
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Posted: November 03 2007 at 10:59 |
Both the Kostarev Group`s two phenomenal albums can be heard for free through the RAIG wesite. Similarily , other bands from The Russian Federation make available their recordings available through their RAIG supported wesites or their own myspace.
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jikai55
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Posted: November 02 2007 at 22:37 |
I applaud your post, Peter.
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I like cheese and I like metal! --Mikael Åkerfeldt
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andu
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Location: Romania
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Posted: November 02 2007 at 17:55 |
Seeing your review on the homepage Vbaby lets me know the answer for the question "why did Igor add Kostarev?" 
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Vibrationbaby
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Posted: November 02 2007 at 14:58 |
I also think maybe the reason why some guys come to this site is to find a starting point for these lesser known bands ( I wouldn`t call them obscure )`both new and old. When I started back in the `70s it was the record shops and that was it. My starting point was with many of the lesser known bands particularily from continental Europe as well as Eastern Europe. While the textbook bands like Yes, King Crimson, Genesis are all great there`s so much more out there to discover, not because theyre obscure but because they`re damn good bands.
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Vibrationbaby
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Posted: November 02 2007 at 10:30 |
My point really was that we don`t need 15 million reviews of Dark Side Of The Moon, Foxtrot or Tubular Bells ( although I reviewed it for the hell of it because someone asked me to ).
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Peter
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Posted: November 01 2007 at 20:03 |
Again (this should be obvious): people can't review albums they don't have.
Obscure albums are obscure because, by definition, few people own copies of them. Of those who do, most will likely NOT be members here, and of those people who do access this site, I'd wager that most don't write reviews.
I review the stuff I own -- sorry if it's not rare or out of print enough for you, but guess what: I've never HEARD of that stuff. Send me some free obscure, unreviewed CDs and I'll review them (but I'll be damned if I'm going to spend my limited music dollars on stuff I know nothing about, just to please some smug stranger  who has a bunch of obscure stuff in his ginormous collection).
Music and music reviews are a hobby of mine -- not a job. This is a FAN site. Archives reviewers are unpaid. They review their OWN albums because those are all they CAN review. (Again, that's also why most of our reviews tend to be favourable: people tend to buy stuff from artists they like, or can expect to like, based upon a listen via radio, or a well done professional -- thus likely more neutral -- review.
We often hear folk say here that such and such a band is "just as good as Genesis, Yes, etc, but they never get mentioned." Duh! Genesis and Yes, et al, are FAMOUS. That's like complaining because the local guy who sells his self-published book from the back of his car isn't as famous as Steven King. Not all artists can be famous (assuming they even deserve to be).
It's easier to get people to talk about Coors Lite than that tasty, not-for-everyone stout from that little craft brewery, because many more people have heard of Coors Lite via its huge advertising budget, have ready access to it via its huge marketing & distribution system, and have tried it.
Go ahead: review that little-talked-of, barely-sold gem from your collection, but don't expect me or many others to follow suit. We just don't own a copy! Sorry!
(And we likely won't buy it, if it turns out to be a fifty dollar import that will take 6 months to ship.)
This seems too obvious to have to point out again. What do you expect from a FAN site? Justly or not (that's not the issue) obscure bands have few fans. Few fans = few (or no) reviews. 
Those "no one ever talks about (or reviews) X" posts really irk me. People simply can't talk about topics which they know nothing about -- unless of course the subject is God, or the afterlife. Then they'll go on forever, and likely kill you if you disagree with their version of "the Truth" (as "revealed" to some ancient schizophrenic). 
Edited by Peter - November 04 2007 at 22:14
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"And, has thou slain the Jabberwock? Come to my arms, my beamish boy! O frabjous day! Callooh! Callay!' He chortled in his joy.
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Dean
Special Collaborator
Retired Admin and Amateur Layabout
Joined: May 13 2007
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Posted: November 01 2007 at 16:42 |
I think there's something like 50 people involved in adding bands and potentially 15,860 forum members reviewing a total of 16,217 releases...
okay, the maths doesn't quite add up, 357 of you guys are going to have to review more than one album...
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