The Prog-Metal controversy

rushfan4 wrote: rushfan4 wrote: Didn't you just describe Iron Maiden?     On the Tribute to the Gods they perform 2 Iron Maiden cover songs.  To me their follow-up album The Glorious Burden, which I recommended, has a Maiden-type vibe to it.  I think that the older stuff that Toolis mentioned is probably more in the power metal vein that you were describing.  For what it is worth, AllMusic describes them as "combining 80's thrash influences with the classic metal approach of Iron Maiden".   I suppose that I should mention that the singer on this album was "Ripper" Owens, who was the guy who replaced Rob Halford in Judas Priest.

Well .... Oh alright you got me !
I sound like those here at PA who say all prog metal outfits sound the same. As if Prog Metal was as limited in sonic scope as Krautrock (wink wink nudge nudge).
With Judas Priest, I find that some of the early stuff would sound better if Halford had put a bit more grit into the vocal, as he started doing with British Steel.
And as for the bands mentioned Iced Earth et al, it's likely more the fact that the songs & samples I've heard have not made much of an impression on me (so far). But you never know. The first time I noticed that Dun was Zeuhl, was after getting the album & re-reading their bio here at PA.

Didn't you just describe Iron Maiden?  

toolis wrote: rushfan4 wrote: Another band that springs to mind, although more retro heavy metal than prog metal is Iced Earth.  This is a band that I think would definitely appeal to a fan of Iron Maiden or Blue Oyster Cult.  If you haven't heard them I would recommend starting out with their most recent releases.  Also, they do a covers album called Tribute to the Gods, where they perform covers of Iron Maiden, Blue Oyster Cult, and Judas Priest songs among others.  I very highly recommend this covers album.  The Glorious Burden is an absolutely awesome epic album covering the American revolution and early American history.  The bonus disc includes the awesome epic Gettysburg regarding the American civil war.  Many PA people have probably already heard of Iced Earth, but if you haven't I highly recommend them if you are a fan of Iron Maiden-type heavy metal. really? i prefer Burnt Offerings, Dark Saga and the Days Of Purgatory compilation...

Edited by rushfan4 - October 21 2007 at 21:36

rushfan4 wrote: Another band that springs to mind, although more retro heavy metal than prog metal is Iced Earth.  This is a band that I think would definitely appeal to a fan of Iron Maiden or Blue Oyster Cult.  If you haven't heard them I would recommend starting out with their most recent releases.  Also, they do a covers album called Tribute to the Gods, where they perform covers of Iron Maiden, Blue Oyster Cult, and Judas Priest songs among others.  I very highly recommend this covers album.  The Glorious Burden is an absolutely awesome epic album covering the American revolution and early American history.  The bonus disc includes the awesome epic Gettysburg regarding the American civil war.  Many PA people have probably already heard of Iced Earth, but if you haven't I highly recommend them if you are a fan of Iron Maiden-type heavy metal.

really? i prefer Burnt Offerings, Dark Saga and the Days Of Purgatory compilation...

Another prog metal band that I was listening to last night and this morning is Royal Hunt.  They are led by keyboardist Andre Andersen who is a virtuoso keyboard player.  They have gone through multiple vocalist through the years including D. C. Cooper, from Silent Force and most recently with Amaran's Plight.  I think they might be more Symphonic Metal or Heavy Prog than Prog metal, but they have all the elements.  They do have some similarities in sound with Dream Theater but may be a band that people who dislike James LaBrie's voice may like.  You may want to try their Myspace page for some samples.  Also, on Andre Andersen's MySpace page he has an instrumental piano piece called The Autumn Song that is absolutely beautiful (but not metal).

I am sorry you misunderstood my post which quoted yours. I just took that sentence out of context to say that my intent had not been fully grasped - not by you, but by other people. I know very well you're not opposed to any genre in its entirety - the people I was referring to were others, who have been on PA longer than you, and who have always been vocal in their opposition to PM. Unfortunately, the medium we are using to communicate is very much prone to being misinterpreted.

Ghost Rider wrote: Easy Money wrote: chamberry wrote: I think we're getting a bit out of the conversation here.  Good, the prog-metal thing was wore out. Unfortunately it wasn't... What I hoped from this thread was for those who are so much against Prog-Metal and don't consider it Prog to come out of the woodwork and explain why it is so. I wanted a debate - civilised, yes, but a REAL debate. However, it seems far too many people are just content with bashing the subgenre without coming forward and illustrating the real reasons of their dislike.

The main think, why prog lovers do not fit the metal sounds to be the part of prog is because of 'heavy' and bold distorsi from PM sounds.
And sometimes also because of the presence of 'scream' sound from the vocalist of several PM band.
But for me, PM is the most 'request' Prog sub Genres in these recent years.

I think the most 'interesting side' of PM is their high skill musicianship. And for myself, the presence of solo between Guitar and Synth being the reason for me to love PM.
Outside their musicianship performance, i think ability to make 'fabulous' lyric especially the concept album created by PM's band could be another reason to love PM.
Briefly, symphonic nuance being the main part of Metal band to be the group of PM.
Correct me if i'm wrong  

chamberry wrote: Debrewguy, it depends on what you would call "progressive". I wouldn't call it Progressive Rap. Not everything that sounds unique from its roots has to be prog. That's how I see it.

No, no. I just meant that , in the same way that some are unable to see anything related to metal as being progressive rock; they won't see that other genres may have their "progressive" wings. I checked the samples from Dalek as a previous post suggested. And you know, while it is limited exposure, they do incorporate some prog elements. I wouldn't be the one to argue the point, but it would be interesting to see what the rest of their music sounds like. I guess the best example I can give that refers to a genre already accepted at PA is Prog-Folk. For me, folk music is traditional & very set in its' ways. But then I have a few albums from the genre & can see why they are included here & why the genre itself is a legitimate sub-sect of the prog scene.
Maybe it's just that metal is too often seen as a puerile, immature, adolescent male based type of music that just cannot be taken seriously on an artistic level. Yet, the stereotype hides the fact that some, but not all metal is written & played by very serious musicians.