Black Sabbath

Ghost Rider wrote: The T wrote:   At last some justice..... Of the bands that truly influenced progressive-metal, only one's still missing from here.... they were rejected by the owners so I won't push for their inclusion any further... But I'm very happy about Sabbath finally here in PROG RELATED WHICH MEANS THEY'RE NOT PROG..... What if we had a banner put on the home page that said exactly those same words?

The T wrote:   At last some justice..... Of the bands that truly influenced progressive-metal, only one's still missing from here.... they were rejected by the owners so I won't push for their inclusion any further... But I'm very happy about Sabbath finally here in PROG RELATED WHICH MEANS THEY'RE NOT PROG.....

What if we had a banner put on the home page that said exactly those same words?

Ghost Rider wrote: Hugues, did you get my PM? I tried to come up with an argumentation, but perhaps that wasn't good enough....

Ivan_Melgar_M wrote: Easy Livin wrote: OK, time to light the blue touch paper.   Black Sabbath have been approved for addition as Prog related. This is a decision of the site owners (M@x), and at his specific request.   The admin team realise that this will be a controversial addition, indeed some members of that team do not support the inclusion. We are committed as a team though to ensuring that the addition does not result in any inappropriate posts, especially those which contravene the site rules on civility.   I can only emphasise again, for those who have difficulty with the concept, that this does not mean the site is saying Black Sabbath were a prog band. They are being added as prog related. Please check the definition of that category if you are unsure of it.   Inevitably, when the albums are added, there will be a flurry of initial reviews. These will quickly work themselves through though, and the front page will return to its familiar look.   I say again though, PLEASE KEEP FUTURE DISCUSSIONS ON THIS ADDITION FRIENDLY AND CIVIL. Please also respect the right of the site owner, without whom there would be no site, to take the final decision on this.   I still don't agree at all, but when the captain gives an order, the sailor has to obey, M@X surely knows what he wants for the site.   Iván

Edited by Sean Trane - October 08 2007 at 05:25

yup

Easy Livin wrote: OK, time to light the blue touch paper.   Black Sabbath have been approved for addition as Prog related. This is a decision of the site owners (M@x), and at his specific request.   The admin team realise that this will be a controversial addition, indeed some members of that team do not support the inclusion. We are committed as a team though to ensuring that the addition does not result in any inappropriate posts, especially those which contravene the site rules on civility.   I can only emphasise again, for those who have difficulty with the concept, that this does not mean the site is saying Black Sabbath were a prog band. They are being added as prog related. Please check the definition of that category if you are unsure of it.   Inevitably, when the albums are added, there will be a flurry of initial reviews. These will quickly work themselves through though, and the front page will return to its familiar look.   I say again though, PLEASE KEEP FUTURE DISCUSSIONS ON THIS ADDITION FRIENDLY AND CIVIL. Please also respect the right of the site owner, without whom there would be no site, to take the final decision on this.

Atavachron wrote: yes, very good post Bob.. and if people have problems, maybe they'll think twice about attacking the site if they know it was the owner's decision

Maybe they'll bother to remember that it was "controversial" even within the admin team, and that in the final analysis, the request for complainers to revisit the definition of Prog-Related should be taken to heart before any whining about Sabbath not being prog.

Hey, maybe if Sabbath were German & spoke in oblique terms with pseudo-literary & "artiste"-like touches of snobbishness, then some would feel superior to others by reversing themselves & declaring their love for such a maligned group.

 

not for the addition of course ( ) but for your post Bob... 


Edited by micky - October 07 2007 at 15:02

Sean Trane wrote: Barla wrote: Undoubtely, Black Sabbath influenced the whole metal and heavy rock scene, and that includes Heavy Prog and Prog Metal. So, they could be here as Proto Prog. They're not considered progressive, but the huge influence is obvious!   from a historical perspective, Sabbath can only be Prog Related. >> first album in 70   I think that the addition of Zeppelin (I was against it) changed a few things perspective-wise on this site.   But from a historical AND musical perpective, it would be wiser to have Purple and The Who changed to Prog Related. I always thought The Who  (I would've voted against their inclusion if Zep had not gotten the inclusion before) was absurd in Proto, since Tommy is 69 (as is Crimson's ITCOTCK) and the prog era was 70's and not 60's.  As for Purple, it is only logical that their inclusion gets changed to prog related if both Zep and Sabbath are in (and all indications points that they will be in).

A gree    dddde !
If the Who are Proto, then how about Pretty Things & S.F. Sorrow ?  Ol' Petey admits that the album  moved him along the way to Tommy.  But  even without that comparison, at best the Who  &  Purple  are prog related.  DP's early stuff  did include some  mixing with classical music, but apart from April & the Concerto, the rest fitted in with some psych bands that liked to throw in the kitchen sink when it came to composition.
The one curveball with DP though, is that their career started before Prog (i.e. ITCOTCK) hit their creative peak during the initial prog heyday when there was such a rock critic construct known as progressive music, and continued successfully (define it as you will) until today.
Oh, and as for Sabbath, if you read enough reviews of the early 70s smaller stature groups, you will find enough references to Sab gloom, Sab dirge, Sab Dark, etc to make you wonder how they could put out a sound so identifiable and not be related to prog when our reviewers use them that often.