What happened to TOP 100??? |
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Desoc
Forum Senior Member Joined: December 12 2006 Location: Oslo, Norway Status: Offline Points: 216 |
Topic: What happened to TOP 100??? Posted: July 23 2007 at 15:45 |
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And country of origin, as I have suggested earlier... It would be interesting to see what bands from specific countries are getting noticed in the international prog community. Mostly for the fun of it, of course, but also as a tool for those of us who are arranging concerts and festivals - you know, are there any new efforts from Sweden that I should be aware of this year? What about the other countries in the "neighbourhood"? I understand that the albums aren't linked to specific countries, only the bands are. Should be possible to make such a link, though... However: I've been reading through this thread trying to find a sensible explanation to how this new rating system practically functions, but I remain unenlightened. If anybody cares to give an answer, read my post here: http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=8462&PID=2580620#2580620 |
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MikeEnRegalia
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: April 22 2005 Location: Sweden Status: Offline Points: 21162 |
Posted: July 19 2007 at 10:34 | |
^ in principle I'm using the same calculations - but I'm offering the visitor a choice which algorithm to apply, there are many more rating steps, and I extend the rating mechanism down to the track level.
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explodingjosh
Forum Senior Member Joined: February 10 2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 507 |
Posted: July 19 2007 at 10:27 | |
^^^^^ Yep. And also if a ratings system like yours was applied to the reviews and data at PA... the massive amount of info would do justice to a great system like that. For example, if I'm reading the info correctly on your site, FoaBP only has 14 reviews! and Ziltoid the Omniscent only 2! Man, to combine the relevance of your ranking system with PA's reviews data would be very cool.
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MikeEnRegalia
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: April 22 2005 Location: Sweden Status: Offline Points: 21162 |
Posted: July 19 2007 at 01:28 | |
"ratingfreak.com (a.k.a. progtology.com) is way ahead of me on this
one... I'm now wondering why this hasn't already been done... It would
be rrrrrrreally interesting to me to see how a ranking system like that
one would arrange albums using the massive amount of reviews we have
here at PA"
Well, submitting ratings doesn't take much time at my website ... and if only a hundred users rated their top 100 albums there ... Edited by MikeEnRegalia - July 19 2007 at 01:29 |
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explodingjosh
Forum Senior Member Joined: February 10 2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 507 |
Posted: July 18 2007 at 20:42 | |
Why can't we have a (is this a word?...) customize-able chart?
The current chart or the previous chart will still be shown on the home page and will remain as the default, but when you click on the link to see the list, you can "customize" it by selecting a function (weighted, non-weighted, weight on popularity, weight on rating) that will change the chart to your preference. Of course, you could also select a year range, genre, albums that are your favorite color and what not. If I want to see a top 100 list of obscure bands with great ratings, I will choose the appropriate function (which would be the current one used). If I want to see a top 100 list based on a mix of popularity and ratings..... if I want to see a top 100 list based solely on popularity..... It seems that about half of the complaints about the new list are based in one's interpretation of the rankings, and not the actual list and the function behind it. This is what happens when you let an extremely objective mathematical function tell people which prog-rock albums (which some of us hold very dear to our hearts) rank in what position. If the list was custom, not as many people would complain.... "what! SFoM is number 99! this list is stupid!" "dude. just change the function to weight on popularity, and quit b*tchin!" ratingfreak.com (a.k.a. progtology.com) is way ahead of me on this one... I'm now wondering why this hasn't already been done... It would be rrrrrrreally interesting to me to see how a ranking system like that one would arrange albums using the massive amount of reviews we have here at PA. Edited by explodingjosh - July 18 2007 at 21:19 |
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The T
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: October 16 2006 Location: FL, USA Status: Offline Points: 17493 |
Posted: July 17 2007 at 14:06 | |
I already did in my BIO...
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Sckxyss
Forum Senior Member Joined: May 05 2007 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 1319 |
Posted: July 17 2007 at 04:17 | |
Hey, the thing I was complaining about before regarding how the albums with one review were getting weird ratings was fixed!
Looking at the top 100 now, it seems like the order is fairly accurate to the average ratings of the albums. I like the algorythm. It gives the more obscure albums a better chance to get on the list, which I personally approve of.
My only issue with the list now, as with the consensus so far, is the inclusion of live albums and PP/PR albums. Fix it! (please )
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MikeEnRegalia
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: April 22 2005 Location: Sweden Status: Offline Points: 21162 |
Posted: July 16 2007 at 16:49 | |
^ Actually I have implemented something along the lines of what you suggest: The playlist service. You simply tell the system which albums you listened to recently (and how you like them), and from that the system can generate a chart of the albums which you currently like.
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Dean
Special Collaborator Retired Admin and Amateur Layabout Joined: May 13 2007 Location: Europe Status: Offline Points: 37575 |
Posted: July 16 2007 at 16:33 | |
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What?
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StyLaZyn
Forum Senior Member Joined: November 22 2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 4079 |
Posted: July 16 2007 at 16:16 | |
While the idea sounds reasonable, my top ten change regularly.
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MikeEnRegalia
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: April 22 2005 Location: Sweden Status: Offline Points: 21162 |
Posted: July 16 2007 at 16:10 | |
Well, one major problem is that I like a lot more than 10 albums ... But I really, really like the idea of personal top 10/100/etc ... that's why I made sure that on my website every user has his/her own page with their personal charts. Edited by MikeEnRegalia - July 16 2007 at 16:20 |
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progismylife
Forum Senior Member Joined: October 19 2006 Location: ibreathehelium Status: Offline Points: 15535 |
Posted: July 16 2007 at 15:53 | |
I think that is a great idea darqdean
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bluetailfly
Forum Senior Member Joined: January 28 2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 1383 |
Posted: July 16 2007 at 13:46 | |
That is a really good idea.
I think if this plan were implemented, you'd see a few bands at the top drop a few notches (I'm not going to name any names, but I think one band in particular would drop down a few notches). Again, not that I care. I realize the top 100 list is a meaningless amalgam of irrationality. And furthermore, I'm not personally invested in seeing THAT BAND drop down. But, it would be entertaining Edited by bluetailfly - July 16 2007 at 13:56 |
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"The red polygon's only desire / is to get to the blue triangle."
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Trademark
Forum Senior Member Joined: November 21 2006 Location: oHIo Status: Offline Points: 1009 |
Posted: July 16 2007 at 13:33 | |
^^ This is without a doubt the BEST top 100 idea anyone has had in this thread; all the benefits and fewer of the drawbacks of the current system.
The only difficulty would be keeping it up to date where new releases and such are concerned; i.e. making our "top ten" one that can be easily updated and the update factored into the overall rating. I'm all for this! |
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Dean
Special Collaborator Retired Admin and Amateur Layabout Joined: May 13 2007 Location: Europe Status: Offline Points: 37575 |
Posted: July 16 2007 at 12:48 | |
Perhaps a more representative chart of our most popular titles would be one computed from our personal top 10's. That is, if we could list our top ten favorite albums in our profiles (rated 10 down to 1), with the one (and only) proviso was that they had to be listed in the PA. The chart would then be made from those scores - with no weightings. This would benefit three fold: |
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What?
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Easy Livin
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator / Retired Admin Joined: February 21 2004 Location: Scotland Status: Offline Points: 15585 |
Posted: July 16 2007 at 04:08 | |
As this thread is in the "Help us improve the site" section, could you stick to discussing the mechanics of the Top 100 here.
Discussions about the merits, longevity etc. of the music are better placed in the music sections.
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Tales
Forum Groupie Joined: December 29 2005 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 98 |
Posted: July 15 2007 at 23:19 | |
Emerson was using keyboards light years ahead of his contempories, as was Palmer with his electronic drum kit.
It's bands like Magma & ealry Genesis that sounds very, very dated, both musically and production.
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Tales
Forum Groupie Joined: December 29 2005 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 98 |
Posted: July 15 2007 at 23:15 | |
Brain Salad Surgery was critically said to be the greatest prog album of all time in a recent edition of the very respectable US collectors mag 'Goldmine'.
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Atavachron
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: September 30 2006 Location: Pearland Status: Online Points: 65255 |
Posted: July 15 2007 at 22:59 | |
^ completely agree with both your posts.. nice work
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bluetailfly
Forum Senior Member Joined: January 28 2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 1383 |
Posted: July 15 2007 at 22:56 | |
Wow, I completely disagree with this. Having just gone through a mini-ELP phase (due to the fact that I am reading Macan's "Endless Enigma" (excellent ELP critical assessment, btw), I have been listening to their LPs again.
And I am blown away by how fresh and exciting they still sound sound. Aside from the awesome performances by ELP, even the production values are excellent and still sound excellent today.
Granted, if one is not used to keyboard centered prog, it will take a bit of getting used to. When their albums came out in the seventies (I'm thinking of the debut), I remember being rather taken aback at how challenging and offputting some of their pieces were at first (e.g., Three Fates), but the more you listened to it, the more it paid off.
To me, ELP are one of the founding fathers of prog. Like Yes, Genesis, Crimson, Floyd (and maybe Tull, I don't know, I have personal issues that I'm wrestling with regarding Tull), their music is the best prog ever recorded, bar none.
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"The red polygon's only desire / is to get to the blue triangle."
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