"Lo-fi" appreciation thread - Progressive Rock Music Forum

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andu

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Topic: "Lo-fi" appreciation thread
Posted: October 20 2006 at 10:54

"Digital strikes back" is in post-production.

Eetu Pellonpaa View Drop Down

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Posted: October 20 2006 at 10:32

Review episodes: "The Return of the Analog"

MikeEnRegalia View Drop Down

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Posted: October 20 2006 at 10:21

^ with episodes like:

"The Digital Menace"
"The Revenge of the Objectivists"
"The Subjectivists Strike Back"
"The Return of the Analog"
...

LOL

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mystic fred View Drop Down

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Posted: October 20 2006 at 05:39

Originally posted by Easy Livin

Any more of that type of thing Oliver and you can expect to hear from me. Please keep it civil and friendly.

.....we should rename this section "tech wars"

Edited by mystic fred - October 20 2006 at 05:40

Prog Archives Tour Van

MikeEnRegalia View Drop Down

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Posted: October 20 2006 at 02:49

Solo wrote:

MikeEnRegalia wrote:

^ *You* don't know what you're saying - CD is vastly superior in dynamics (undisputable fact), and 30khz ... well, if you believe in astrology you might also believe that the human ear can hear such high frequencies. But I'm sure that it cannot, and that the tape decks could *not* reproduce such frequencies reliably. Why should they - there are no sources which contain these frequencies!

I don't know how a cassette could possibly replay at 30khz.

I have a half inch 8 track that records at 15 IPS and still can only get to about 21khz.

That being said, you're wrong. In the 70's the worlds best 2" 30 ips machines could capture frequencies well into 48khz. Caputring frequencies that high is absolutely essential in creating something known as the hypersonic effect, which adds much missing detail and prestine quality which is missing from today's technology.

I'm NOT partial to analog machine JUST because it's 70's : keep in mind the very first compact disc as we know it was unveiled in 1979 - obivously a technology that had been in the works for many years prior.

CD's fail. Analog wins. That's all there is to it.

Why do you have to be so absolute about this? If you believe that adding inaudible frequencies enhances the audible quality of a recording, then you're free to do so ... but please don't expect me to adopt that theory.

BTW: SACD/DVD-Audio can reproduce frequencies in that range ... if this feature is responsible for the "analog effect", then how do you explain that audiophiles still don't accept that format?

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cuncuna

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Posted: October 19 2006 at 20:42

I appreciate Lo - fi as music genre. Low Barlow and the bunch. Sky presents different colour to different species. I like concepts behind art forms, since art is made out of that. Format, unless it is really really cheap, I don't care much about.

Edited by cuncuna - October 19 2006 at 20:51

¡Beware of the Bee!

Solo

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Posted: October 19 2006 at 20:36

I don't know how a cassette could possibly replay at 30khz.

I have a half inch 8 track that records at 15 IPS and still can only get to about 21khz.

CD's fail. Analog wins. That's all there is to it.

Easy Livin View Drop Down

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Posted: October 16 2006 at 11:14

oliverstoned wrote:

I don't care about your smoky THEORIES. The fact that your play 3 notes of NOISE with a bunch of friends doesn't mean nothing, if it's in the same vein that the craps you add to the site. You should not be here on this adult site, but rather on a teenage forum for "metal heads".

Any more of that type of thing Oliver and you can expect to hear from me. Please keep it civil and friendly.

MikeEnRegalia View Drop Down

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Posted: October 16 2006 at 08:36

A couple of things:

You're confusing scientific fact with theory.
There's nothing "smoky" about these facts - rather the reverse.
"3 notes" ... thanks for confirming that you don't know much about music theory or notation to start with ... the correct term is "3 chords".
We had a proper home studio which back then (1993) cost more than 12,000 EUR, with state of the art equipment (expensive microphones, 24 channel Soundcraft mixer, ALESIS ADAT recorder, Tannoy monitor speakers etc. ).
Let's not return to the "who added what" debate ...
Do you even know how old I am? I'm 10 years older than philippe for example ... go figure.

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Neil

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Posted: October 16 2006 at 08:29

Not sure if I'm right here but I always found that descent into insults and threats indicated that someone was losing the arguement.

When people get lost in thought it's often because it's unfamiliar territory.

Eetu Pellonpaa View Drop Down

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Posted: October 16 2006 at 07:56

Please, gentelmen. I think this thread is running off topic and towards hostilities.

Heavyfreight wrote:

I expect that the producer puts far too much compression and low frequency and high frequency emphasis on to make them sound louder. You know how rock musicians like everything turned to 11. It might work ok with your instrument amp but never with the PA or mixing desk.

As I recorded tracks from my CREAM "Farewell concert 1968" DVD, and also from their BBC sessions to make a compilation to my car, the soundwaves did't have curves, but the whole thing was a solid bar filling all frequence levels. I think that this made the CD to sound very violent, as I listen it with max vol in my car it realy locks my ears, so I can't hear anything for awhile after leaving the car.

There's also lots of echo in the live recording form the Albert Hall acoustics, I believe.

We have reached bit similar sound in our rehearshal room, by putting the record level of our Telefunken magnetofone as too high, and we have taken off the softening acoustic elements from the wall. We have also thought of making a recording in the staircase to get big echoes!

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Posted: October 16 2006 at 07:34

I don't care about your smoky THEORIES. The fact that your play 3 notes of NOISE with a bunch of friends doesn't mean nothing, if it's in the same vein that the craps you add to the site. You should not be here on this adult site, but rather on a teenage forum for "metal heads".

Jim Garten View Drop Down

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Posted: October 16 2006 at 07:27

MikeEnRegalia wrote:

...you're only making a fool of yourself with your childish ignorance of facts. You might as well say that the sky is green.

Ah yes - but with modern digital manipulation of images, the sky can be green; in the old days, you had to depend on unreliable & illegal chemical stimuli to see a green sky...

Sorry - different argument for a different thread - pray continue.

Jon Lord 1941 - 2012

Eetu Pellonpaa View Drop Down

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Posted: October 16 2006 at 06:55

MikeEnRegalia wrote:

...and 30khz ... well, if you believe in astrology you might also believe that the human ear can hear such high frequencies. But I'm sure that it cannot, and that the tape decks could *not* reproduce such frequencies reliably.

I heard somewhere, that there would be some kind of "joke" in the end of some BEATLES album, that being a high pitched volume beyond human ears, but which some animals like dogs could hear. I'm not sure if this true. I'm a bit deaf and I don't often even hear proprely what people speak!

"WHAT!"

Eetu Pellonpaa View Drop Down

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Posted: October 16 2006 at 06:52

Fitzcarraldo wrote:

A brand new Sound Burger sold on eBay yesterday - it was still wrapped in its original plastic bag. Not cheap, though. The last time I looked the price was $250.

If ancient but working grammophones cost ca. 40€, I wouldn't buy such fragile plastic player with more than 50$ absolute, and it would be better to function properly. I believe that such Sound Burgers were manufactured in smaller quantities. Neat looking device though, but some people try to ask unbeliable prices of anything in these web auctions. It's ofcourse possible, that at customer who has millions of dollars money, spots such and wants it immetiadly, without caring about the cost.

MikeEnRegalia View Drop Down

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Posted: October 16 2006 at 06:12

oliverstoned wrote:

You're a dwarf in music and you have never heard nothing.

I have heard a lot and in fact I can play a lot - I played in a band and I even recorded an album. My ears are working perfectly fine, and I can hear all the subtleties that trained ears are supposed to hear.

oliverstoned wrote:

Numeric can't reproduce ANY frequency correctly because of the gaps and it even adds supersonic noise.

you didn't even bother to read the article which heavyfreight added to his post - it explains in detail why even vinyl has problems like quantisation. And the supersonic noise - it is filtered out and converted to white noise, again much like what happens when playing vinyls (thermic/electro-mechanic effects).

Resistance is really futile here ... you're only making a fool of yourself with your childish ignorance of facts. You might as well say that the sky is green!

oliverstoned wrote:

So, one time for all, please SHUT UP!!!!!

Sorry, but I will continue to post my opinion here - as you will too.

Edited by MikeEnRegalia - October 16 2006 at 06:22

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oliverstoned View Drop Down

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Posted: October 16 2006 at 05:52

You're a dwarf in music and you have never heard nothing.
Numeric can't reproduce ANY frequency correctly because of the gaps and it even adds supersonic noise.

So, one time for all, please SHUT UP!!!!!

Fitzcarraldo View Drop Down

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Posted: October 16 2006 at 05:46

Philéas wrote:

Wow... I want a Sound Burger so bad! Not that I expect the audio quality to be very good, but it would be an awesome thing to have...

You can have one... there's one for sale on eBay now:

http://cgi.ebay.com/SOUND-BURGER-PORTABLE-TURNTABLE_W0QQitemZ280037010581QQihZ018QQcategoryZ3281QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

A brand new Sound Burger sold on eBay yesterday - it was still wrapped in its original plastic bag. Not cheap, though. The last time I looked the price was $250.

Several manufacturers made micro-portable record players; here's another model, this one from 1961:

The Wondergram Record Player, weighing in at less than 2 lbs. Transistorised, and ran on 1.5 V batteries.

Read reviews by Fitzcarraldo

MikeEnRegalia View Drop Down

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Posted: October 16 2006 at 05:42

^ *You* don't know what you're saying - CD is vastly superior in dynamics (undisputable fact), and 30khz ... well, if you believe in astrology you might also believe that the human ear can hear such high frequencies. But I'm sure that it cannot, and that the tape decks could *not* reproduce such frequencies reliably. Why should they - there are no sources which contain these frequencies!

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oliverstoned View Drop Down

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Posted: October 16 2006 at 05:35

You don't know what you say. Big Nakas explode all the Cd sources you have heard. It goes at 30khz and is far more dynamic!