Forum Home Forum Home > Other music related lounges > General Music Discussions
  New Posts New Posts RSS Feed - Musicians Who Admit They Aren't Good
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Events   Register Register  Login Login

Musicians Who Admit They Aren't Good

 Post Reply Post Reply Page  12>
Author
Message Reverse Sort Order
Gordy View Drop Down
Special Collaborator
Special Collaborator
Avatar
Folk/Eclectic/PSIKE/Metal/Post/Math Team

Joined: January 25 2007
Location: US
Status: Online
Points: 4258
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gordy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Musicians Who Admit They Aren't Good
    Posted: May 23 2022 at 10:33
Back to Top
The Anders View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: January 02 2019
Location: Denmark
Status: Offline
Points: 3535
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote The Anders Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 23 2022 at 08:49
In general, expression means more to me than technique. What made Jimi Hendrix stand out wasn't so much his ability to move fast on the fingerboard, it was his originality. Many fast guitarists bore me (Eddie Van Halen, Slash, Steve Vai, Joe Satriani etc.).

Of course, if you can use good technical skills in a creative and interesting way, everything is fine, and indeed it requires more techniques to play music like Toto than to play f.e. Beatles type of music. But then, some of these big virtuosos might suck at playing like the Beatles because they don't have the right feel.
Back to Top
Davesax1965 View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: May 23 2013
Location: UK
Status: Offline
Points: 2839
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Davesax1965 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 23 2022 at 08:47
Originally posted by The Anders The Anders wrote:

I can't play fast, so I assume I am not an idiot Smile


Anders, you are definitely no idiot. ;-) 

Back to Top
Davesax1965 View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: May 23 2013
Location: UK
Status: Offline
Points: 2839
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Davesax1965 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 23 2022 at 08:46
Incidentally. ;-) 

This is on another thread somewhere on PA, but I've just finished building this Partscaster. Yep, Seymour Duncan SS-1's and an SS-5 in the bridge with a mod switch to get extra tones out of it in position 1 and 2 - it's a Dave Gilmour copy. 

Again, someone with great technique but "not very good" if you measure him in notes per second or the use of different scales. But. What's the measure of "good", anyway ? 



Back to Top
The Anders View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: January 02 2019
Location: Denmark
Status: Offline
Points: 3535
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (2) Thanks(2)   Quote The Anders Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 23 2022 at 08:40
I can't play fast, so I assume I am not an idiot Smile
Back to Top
Davesax1965 View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: May 23 2013
Location: UK
Status: Offline
Points: 2839
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Davesax1965 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 23 2022 at 08:38
"Good" at guitar sadly got equated to "fast at guitar" in the 80's. And any idiot can play fast. 

Back to Top
MortSahlFan View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member


Joined: March 01 2018
Location: US
Status: Offline
Points: 3050
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MortSahlFan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 23 2022 at 06:24
Some are humble, or know they're capable of better, but then sometimes it's simply a matter of timing. Guys grow up together, suddenly get big, and don't have the heart to kick one guy out who isn't great. But sometimes bringing in a bass player ruins the chemistry. I've seen bands where the ones who don't write might focus on other things, like making sure they aren't being ripped off, the one who talks to the "suits", has good ideas for the band, etc..

Personally, the older I get, the technical stuff (or how difficult something is) means nothing to me if it doesn't sound good. And most of the things that do sound good are easy to play. A guy like David Gilmour might not have great technique, so he uses those economic notes for emotion, and I think he's probably my favorite along with Jimmy Page, who had technique (although very sloppy live by the mid-70s)
https://www.youtube.com/c/LoyalOpposition

https://www.scribd.com/document/382737647/MortSahlFan-Song-List
Back to Top
Atavachron View Drop Down
Special Collaborator
Special Collaborator
Avatar
Honorary Collaborator

Joined: September 30 2006
Location: Pearland
Status: Online
Points: 65522
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Atavachron Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 22 2022 at 19:47
^ And he'd be right---  Belew's an artist, and does exactly what he's supposed to.  The Edge, too, for that matter. (consummate professionals, of course.  You don't rise to the top of the rock food chain without totally knowing you're sh*t.)


"Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought."   -- John F. Kennedy
Back to Top
Mirakaze View Drop Down
Special Collaborator
Special Collaborator
Avatar
Eclectic, JRF/Canterbury, Avant/Zeuhl

Joined: December 17 2019
Location: (redacted)
Status: Offline
Points: 4195
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mirakaze Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 22 2022 at 06:49
I can't find it anymore but I seem to remember an interview with Adrian Belew where he states that he doesn't see himself as a very good guitar player and that his reliance on effects pedals and guitar synths stems from his desire to hide his supposed lack of skill.
Back to Top
Davesax1965 View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: May 23 2013
Location: UK
Status: Offline
Points: 2839
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Davesax1965 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 21 2022 at 03:19
I'll fully admit I'm not a good musician. Because if you don't, you never get better. 

Music isn't an exam, there is no pass / fail. It takes you a lifetime to learn, you stop learning when the lid gets screwed down on the big pine box. Once you start thinking you're good at music, someone will come along with more experience and wipe the floor with you. 

I went into work on Friday. The boss is in a band. He's an amateur musician, nice bloke. I do a setup on his bass, he's really pleased with it. To test it, I play some Jaco on it - he says "You're putting me to shame". 

"No, honestly", I said, "I've got no kids, I don't work all the hours God sends like you do, it's not a competition, you're doing great, don't worry about it." 

"Good" is relative where music is concerned. It's a dangerous concept as well. "Good enough for what you do" might be a bit safer. 

The number of arrogant, impatient "good" musicians I have met... who are utterly intolerant of anyone who's not up to *their* superior standard. 

Edited by Davesax1965 - May 21 2022 at 03:21

Back to Top
cstack3 View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar
VIP Member

Joined: July 20 2009
Location: Tucson, AZ USA
Status: Offline
Points: 7402
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cstack3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 20 2022 at 23:14
I'm also a Holdsworth fan-boy, but let's move on! 

I was surprised to read Mike Rutherford of "Genesis" say that he didn't think he was very good, comparing himself to his peers in the 70's!  Personally, I thought he was God-like on the bass guitar!  
I am not a Robot, I'm a FREE MAN!!
Back to Top
Atavachron View Drop Down
Special Collaborator
Special Collaborator
Avatar
Honorary Collaborator

Joined: September 30 2006
Location: Pearland
Status: Online
Points: 65522
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Atavachron Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 20 2022 at 19:02
Originally posted by Grumpyprogfan Grumpyprogfan wrote:

Cool that this has morphed into a Holdswoth appreciation thread.

buncha Holdsworth thugs we are--  I'm sure the OP would like to see someone else mentioned.

Let's see...yeah I got nothing.   I know Roger W. and Keith E. and Peter G. and Eddie VH were not thrilled with the sound of certain records, but that's different.   And I'm sure many musicians felt an album performance was poor and we just never heard their thoughts.   The urge is to apologize but maybe it's better to say nothing and do better next time.





Edited by Atavachron - May 20 2022 at 19:04
"Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought."   -- John F. Kennedy
Back to Top
Atavachron View Drop Down
Special Collaborator
Special Collaborator
Avatar
Honorary Collaborator

Joined: September 30 2006
Location: Pearland
Status: Online
Points: 65522
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Atavachron Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 20 2022 at 18:55
^ I'd say that's rare... at least to fully appreciate his music and not just a dazzling lead break.
"Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought."   -- John F. Kennedy
Back to Top
Grumpyprogfan View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: July 09 2019
Location: Kansas City
Status: Offline
Points: 12253
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Grumpyprogfan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 20 2022 at 18:35
^ For some, maybe. I was hooked on his first note as a solo artist.

Cool that this has morphed into a Holdswoth appreciation thread.
Back to Top
Atavachron View Drop Down
Special Collaborator
Special Collaborator
Avatar
Honorary Collaborator

Joined: September 30 2006
Location: Pearland
Status: Online
Points: 65522
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Atavachron Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 20 2022 at 18:19
It can be a long road to Holdsworth as a solo artist.   Bleu cheese smells and sometimes tastes like a dead man's feet.   It's also delicious & complex once you get past that.

"Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought."   -- John F. Kennedy
Back to Top
Grumpyprogfan View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: July 09 2019
Location: Kansas City
Status: Offline
Points: 12253
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Grumpyprogfan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 20 2022 at 18:07
^ Execellent description! Allan sounded and played like no one else. It's a shame his work as a hired hand gets more praise then his solo work on PA.
Back to Top
Atavachron View Drop Down
Special Collaborator
Special Collaborator
Avatar
Honorary Collaborator

Joined: September 30 2006
Location: Pearland
Status: Online
Points: 65522
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Atavachron Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 20 2022 at 17:33
You absolutely hear where he was impacted by horn players the most.   Sometimes it sounds like he pretended he actually was playing a saxophone, and it must've been a major physical component in how he fretted notes.  

I also think he was one of a handful of musicians who had found a "lost chord", and by that I mean he worked in a very narrow vein of harmony & melody that hadn't been fully explored by anyone, certainly not a guitar player.   His compositions sound like no one else's in the history of recorded music.   That itself is an accomplishment.


"Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought."   -- John F. Kennedy
Back to Top
Jaketejas View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: March 27 2018
Location: USA
Status: Offline
Points: 2074
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jaketejas Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 19 2022 at 21:39
Love his solo with UK on “In the Dead of Night” too. One of the best legato style players ever. So creative. I doubt we’ll ever hear someone like him again in our lifetime.

Every once in a while I get the urge to listen to the Unmerry-Go-Round on Metal Fatigue. The arpeggiated patterns and drop-in volume-controlled chords are hypnotic and haunting. There has to be some back story to that one.
Back to Top
Grumpyprogfan View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: July 09 2019
Location: Kansas City
Status: Offline
Points: 12253
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Grumpyprogfan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 19 2022 at 20:09
^ I love all Allan's solo work. "Hard Hat Area" and "The Sixteen Men of Tain" are outstanding also.

His music resonates with me, and I was lucky to see him live, three times. Miss him.
Back to Top
Atavachron View Drop Down
Special Collaborator
Special Collaborator
Avatar
Honorary Collaborator

Joined: September 30 2006
Location: Pearland
Status: Online
Points: 65522
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Atavachron Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 19 2022 at 19:58
^ both incredible--  I've been a fan since the early 80s and I'm still beginning to appreciate the nuances of his music, complex & subtle rhythms, and the interface of vocals with composition & synthesizer .


"Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought."   -- John F. Kennedy
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  12>

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down



This page was generated in 0.266 seconds.
Donate monthly and keep PA fast-loading and ad-free forever.