10 more progressive metal bands in a poll

nick_h_nz wrote: Cristi wrote: surprised some don't know all these bands, now I don't see the point of making the albums poll, like I did with the first 10 bands.  I’m surprised, too. I’m not even close to being a prog metal fan. I like quite a few bands within the genre, but I’d never call myself a fan of the genre itself. But as I posted on the previous page, I’ve heard of all the bands listed here (even if I’ve listened to only eight of them, and could claim to be truly familiar with only five of them). None are obscure names, and all are names I would have assumed would at least be known by people, even if they’ve never actually listened to them. I wouldn’t be put off doing the album poll. It might provoke some people into listening to the albums. I know I’m always more inclined to listen to a band I’m not familiar with, if directed to a particular album. If someone just suggests a band to me, rather than an album, I’m far less likely to try and find out what they sound like.

surprised some don't know all these bands, now I don't see the point of making the albums poll, like I did with the first 10 bands. 

Vanden Plas

Went with OSI but their songs I like are by no means metal.

Open-mindedness is a topic that I care a lot about, and recognising our biases. I don't care much about genre labels except that they are useful for discovery (and well, genre team members are expected to kind of care for categorisation purposes). If I know an act, then ultimately I don't care much how others classify it other than that might help me to discover similar music. If I want music like Beethoven, it helps not to look in the booty-wave section of the record store which is at the rear end of the store usually, butt I digress.

Ultimately there is bias in the framework even if one can minimise the bias within the parameters. If one is judging how good the performance of a Liszt piano work is, it can be expected that the concert pianist will perform the music more accurately than the three year old beginner, and thus be the "better" performance according to various criteria, but the three year old's parents will likely appreciate their child's performance more while also recognising that it isn't as skilled and recognise that it will take more practice to perform it well (though it might be a "great" attempt for a three year old beginner).

I would say art appreciation is subjective, and it can go so far as to say "what is art?" can be subjective, but of course there are certain standards and accepted definitional values.

It's sad when people readily dismiss music just because it does not conform to their genre expectations (I've seen it happen here at PA). I do think it's good to try to appreciate the music or art for what it is and taken on its own merits. We are always comparing, but then we are pattern seeking animals. And people commonly want a sense order in their lives (so often it can feel like a constant struggle with entropy).

It is so easy to miss out due to those preconceived notions, and to fail to appreciate something due to erroneous expectations. And as a side-not, that which we don't now appreciate we might appreciate at another time (sometimes that does require exposure to similar music, and musical steeping-stones, to be able to get a point where we can "get" or decipher the music, or re-tune our brains so to speak).

I still like to go to used record store places and buy just based on the cover, but then the cover itself sets up certain expectations. People say you can't judge a book based on the cover, and I don't think that is necessarily true, but that's another thing.

Logan wrote: Frenetic Zetetic wrote: Logan wrote: ^ Interesting, I wonder then if I enjoyed Light of Day, Day of Darkness by Green Carnation so much because I haven't fully developed a taste for metal and thus my taste buds (or more aptly ear buds) lack the discernment and sophistication that comes with more knowledge and experience. It's all preference, my friend! Every band on this list makes me want to listen to something else instead lol. Some preferences can carry more weight for me when they come from a place of greater knowledge and understanding. So sure, but I am much more ignorant when it comes to this than many others and therefore lack the kind of knowledge that would lead to more discernment (tastes commonly become more refined the more you become acquainted with a genre and of course one becomes more adept at making good comparisons and judging greatness the more one knows). Not all opinions are equal or as valid, some are more informed and better thought out than others. That is the only album I have heard out all of these, so I can't even compare it to other Green Carnation albums -- I don't know how the band is overall, I can only judge this album and not in a very knowledgeable way where I can compare it to lots of similar ones to judge the quality comparatively. I was wondering about something similar earlier when I posted my first message in this topic but opted not to type it out. As I am not a Prog Metal fan, I would rather expect that those albums I would like in Prog Metal would not be as likely to be considered great albums by the Prog Metal cognoscente than albums chosen by those who have much greater knowledge and experience when it comes to such musical avenues. Mine is very uncultured and uninformed opinion. There's lots of music where I know too little of its ilk to even venture an opinion on the merits of the music. Recently I watched a crime-drama film which I loved and I read the critics reviews which were mostly lukewarm at best. One of the complaints was that the film was derivative and full of clichés. It's not a style I have watched a lot of, so I wouldn't be comparing it to many others of the ilk. Those who better know that particular filmic species I think would be better able to judge the greatness. There is music and film that I know is not great but I still love, and music I love and dislike where I have no opinion on its greatness within the music pantheon. Might be great for me, but that's just a "I love it" commentary, not an estimation on its intrinsic quality. I have become less concerned about how great music or art generally is and instead it's more about just how much I like it (good or bad, I don't care as much now as long as it's good for me). When I was in film studies I tried to build various models or frameworks for more objective analysis (at least to be more objective within the context of the framework) -- some of that is easy, and the frameworks themselves showed a kind of value bias. For instance, if a historical film, I generally valued an attempt at historical accuracy. Certain aesthetic qualities and standards of workmanship I valued etc. I tended to value a certain professionalism over ineptitude etc.

A Crimson Mellotron wrote: ^Because I can hardly stand many of the modern prog metal bands, surprisingly or not. With the exception of bands like OSI, DT, Haken, Caligula's Horse (for the most part), FW, and some more, I find this one of the most 'regressive' sub-genres of prog.

Frenetic Zetetic wrote: Logan wrote: ^ Interesting, I wonder then if I enjoyed Light of Day, Day of Darkness by Green Carnation so much because I haven't fully developed a taste for metal and thus my taste buds (or more aptly ear buds) lack the discernment and sophistication that comes with more knowledge and experience. It's all preference, my friend! Every band on this list makes me want to listen to something else instead lol.

Some preferences can carry more weight for me when they come from a place of greater knowledge and understanding. So sure, but I am much more ignorant when it comes to this than many others and therefore lack the kind of knowledge that would lead to more discernment (tastes commonly become more refined the more you become acquainted with a genre and of course one becomes more adept at making good comparisons and judging greatness the more one knows). Not all opinions are equal or as valid, some are more informed and better thought out than others. That is the only album I have heard out all of these, so I can't even compare it to other Green Carnation albums -- I don't know how the band is overall, I can only judge this album and not in a very knowledgeable way where I can compare it to lots of similar ones to judge the quality comparatively.

I was wondering about something similar earlier when I posted my first message in this topic but opted not to type it out. As I am not a Prog Metal fan, I would rather expect that those albums I would like in Prog Metal would not be as likely to be considered great albums by the Prog Metal cognoscente than albums chosen by those who have much greater knowledge and experience when it comes to such musical avenues. Mine is very uncultured and uninformed opinion. There's lots of music where I know too little of its ilk to even venture an opinion on the merits of the music.

Recently I watched a crime-drama film which I loved and I read the critics reviews which were mostly lukewarm at best. One of the complaints was that the film was derivative and full of clichés. It's not a style I have watched a lot of, so I wouldn't be comparing it to many others of the ilk. Those who better know that particular filmic species I think would be better able to judge the greatness. There is music and film that I know is not great but I still love, and music I love and dislike where I have no opinion on its greatness within the music pantheon. Might be great for me, but that's just a "I love it" commentary, not an estimation on its intrinsic quality.

I have become less concerned about how great music or art generally is and instead it's more about just how much I like it (good or bad, I don't care as much now as long as it's good for me). When I was in film studies I tried to build various models or frameworks for more objective analysis (at least to be more objective within the context of the framework) -- some of that is easy, and the frameworks themselves showed a kind of value bias. For instance, if a historical film, I generally valued an attempt at historical accuracy. Certain aesthetic qualities and standards of workmanship I valued etc. I tended to value a certain professionalism over ineptitude etc.

Edited by Logan - March 02 2021 at 01:03

^Because I can hardly stand many of the modern prog metal bands, surprisingly or not. With the exception of bands like OSI, DT, Haken, Caligula's Horse (for the most part), FW, and some more, I find this one of the most 'regressive' sub-genres of prog.


Edited by A Crimson Mellotron - March 02 2021 at 00:53

OSI is a no-brainer out of these. (I don't know all)