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Languages you speak, are trying to learn/ improve |
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MortSahlFan ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() Joined: March 01 2018 Location: US Status: Offline Points: 3075 |
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Outside of music, movies, stand-up comedy, and interviews, I love language. Origins of words, cognates, how they were influenced, all that. Native (American) English speaker. I took Spanish and German in school, and I spent college working with Mexicans, so I learned even more. I knew people who lived in Greece for a few years, so I asked if they could write the alphabet for me, and learned some basics. I spent a huge chunk of my 20s and early 30s (I'm still in my 30s) traveling overseas and learned a lot that way, when you're forced to talk, as opposed to just reading a book, or a few dictionaries I have. I can speak Aramaic well. My uncle married a Syrian woman, so I learned some Arabic. I've been to The Netherlands 6 times, so I learned some Dutch, but have a tendency to get German/Dutch confused, which is what happened after I started to learn Italian, getting it mixed up with Spanish. I also love (older) foreign movies, but I just had someone say "We don't use that word anymore, except my grandpa", but it helps... When I was in Australia, I remember drinking a bottle of wine, and then being able to speak the best German in a conversation with friends I made in the hostel. I think its about inhibition, not overthinking or worrying about making mistakes... You can learn a lot just by listening, too, especially if you know the gist of the sentence, and basically filling in the blank, especially with the heavy influences of Latin and Greek. It's a great thing to learn. For example, if you learn Spanish, you can communicate with a billion new people you couldn't speak with beforehand.
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https://www.youtube.com/c/LoyalOpposition
https://www.scribd.com/document/382737647/MortSahlFan-Song-List |
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Shadowyzard ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() Joined: February 24 2020 Location: Davutlar Status: Offline Points: 4506 |
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This comprehensive article might be of some use for some. Check it out.
https://psyche.co/guides/how-to-approach-the-lifelong-project-of-language-learning |
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Woon Deadn ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: March 30 2010 Location: P Status: Offline Points: 1017 |
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Languages undoubtedly reflect and influence the ways of thinking, ways of comprehension of things.
There're no articles (like a/an/the) in Russian, Ukrainian, Polish, Czech or Serbian. Copula is not usually used in the Present tense in Russian and classic Ukrainian. Thus, "I am an engineer" becomes simply Ya inzhen'Er in Russian. In Russian there're different letters for sounds i like in peel, [ih] like in this and [j] like in boy. And there's no collusion between them. Thus, the donkey named Eeyore in Winnie The Pooh is simply iA-iA (accent falls on a, that is) in Russian - for English-speaking brains it sounds like ya-ya, but for Russians it's just ee-AH ee-AH. There's a well-known Russian band Leningrad with one of their songs called Moi Khui (My d*cks), and the name doesn't read moy khuy (that would be singular, My d*ck). it reads muh-EE khoo-EE. Then, kh doesn't read like k! The Russian sound that is transcribed in English as kh is a voiceless English h, but it's always voiceless and it's produced a bit differently than in English h. But it's evidently h, never k! On a global scale, all these features must symbolize something, reflect some special peculiarities of the people that invented, developed and use that language.
Edited by Woon Deadn - October 19 2020 at 05:11 |
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Favourite Band: Gentle Giant
Favourite Writer: Robert Sheckley Favourite Horror Writer: Jean Ray Favourite Computer Game: Tiny Toon - Buster's Hidden Treasure (Sega Mega Drive/Genesis) |
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lazland ![]() Prog Reviewer ![]() ![]() Joined: October 28 2008 Location: Wales Status: Offline Points: 13795 |
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English as my mother tongue.
I understand a lot of Welsh having lived here for 21 years now, but could not describe myself as fluent. A little bit of Italian, and would love to be better, and I am trying my best to learn Maltese as we would love to at least partly retire to my second country in a few years time. Unfortunately, I find learning languages extremely difficult.
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Enhance your life. Get down to www.lazland.org
Now also broadcasting on www.progzilla.com Every Saturday, 4.00 p.m. UK time! |
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Woon Deadn ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: March 30 2010 Location: P Status: Offline Points: 1017 |
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Usually, the languages of the same language family share much more similarities than people tend to notice.
Not long ago I have noticed that the English word "beneath" may be translated by the Russian word "vnizu", for good example. Also, parallels like tree - derevo, or even road - doroga.
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Favourite Band: Gentle Giant
Favourite Writer: Robert Sheckley Favourite Horror Writer: Jean Ray Favourite Computer Game: Tiny Toon - Buster's Hidden Treasure (Sega Mega Drive/Genesis) |
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Catcher10 ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() VIP Member Joined: December 23 2009 Location: Emerald City Status: Offline Points: 17966 |
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I love it when we can make fun of ourselves....
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Woon Deadn ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: March 30 2010 Location: P Status: Offline Points: 1017 |
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I am from Ukraine, from its northern part. Quite like all Ukrainians who live in Ukraine I can easily speak Ukrainian and Russian. I can speak and write in English. Certainly, my vocabulary is not that large and I have frequent problems with the whole concept of articles. Neither Russian nor Ukrainian have a/an/the-alikes.
I don't think I'd like to learn any other language apart from possibly Latin and Old Greek. Chinese and Japanese are not for my nerves. Even Italian or Spanish - I see no reason to learn them. Great languages indeed - but I personally see no reason to learn them. English, in my opinion, is definitely great for selling/purchasing, for marketing purposes. For writing sharp cute lines - be it Ian Anderson's poetry or my texts here. Nice and powerful language, usually laconic and not so hard to learn the basics of. I have no doubt that the full-power, full-scale English is very rich. Anyway, I prefer Russian and Ukrainian, the languages in which I can speak freely'n'fluently, I must admit.
![]() Edited by Woon Deadn - October 15 2020 at 16:18 |
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Favourite Band: Gentle Giant
Favourite Writer: Robert Sheckley Favourite Horror Writer: Jean Ray Favourite Computer Game: Tiny Toon - Buster's Hidden Treasure (Sega Mega Drive/Genesis) |
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suitkees ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: July 19 2020 Location: France Status: Offline Points: 9050 |
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My native language is Dutch too, but it's evolution is on a relative standstill since I left the country almost 20 years ago (it is actually quite interesting to see the evolution of a language - and its use - over time). I'm fluent in French, English and German, although writing in German would come with many many mistakes. Some basic knowledge of Catalan - after two beers it can become a "decent" conversation... Not really speaking (would need more beer and a couple of days...) but reading and understanding relatively well Spanish, Italian and a tiny bit of Portuguese. I would really like to improve these languages to be able to have normal conversations without having to fall back to French or English. Once one knows different languages from different linguistic families (Germanic, Latin,...) it becomes easier to understand (read) other languages from those families. As such, and thanks to my work in (film) archives and festivals, I discovered I can also read a bit of Romanian, Swedish and Norwegian - Danish is more of challenge - as long as I limit myself to newspapers or festival catalogues (and take my time; no way I would be able to read a novel...). I have also learned to utter some polite words in Japanese (would be nice to learn that language too).
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The razamataz is a pain in the bum |
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Mirakaze ![]() Special Collaborator ![]() ![]() Eclectic, JRF/Canterbury, Avant/Zeuhl Joined: December 17 2019 Location: (redacted) Status: Offline Points: 4236 |
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My native language is Dutch, and I like to believe that I can communicate in English reasonably well. I used to be somewhat decent at German but it's gotten very rusty over the years (I can read German texts just fine but I can barely form coherent sentences myself. Es tut mir leid, daß ich dich enttäuscht habe, großer Bruder)
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AFlowerKingCrimson ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: October 02 2016 Location: Philly burbs Status: Offline Points: 18957 |
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Spanish. I've picked up a little bit here and there but never really got very far. I know enough to maybe barely get by if I was in Spain or something but then again maybe not. I know about maybe fifty words in Spanish. Other than English it's the language I know the most by far but that's not saying much.
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JD ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: February 07 2009 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 18446 |
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Sign language...poorly. It's been a very long time. I have but two real regrets in my life. Not applying myself at a young age when I had the opportunity to learn music. Not applying myself at an early age when I had the opportunity to learn French. C'est la vie & que sera,sera (he sings in his most terrible Greg Lake/Doris Day voice)
Edited by JD - October 14 2020 at 20:02 |
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Thank you for supporting independently produced music
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Shadowyzard ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() Joined: February 24 2020 Location: Davutlar Status: Offline Points: 4506 |
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Wow, impressive. Also your last sentence is correct. If you begin to learn a language after the age of 4 or 6 (I cannot exactly remember), it isn't becoming one of your "native languages"; so you're basically becoming a learner like a student. There are many ways of becoming a "native-like" speaker, but I think being a native and native-like has a subtle and profound difference. My case could be strange. My mother is a retired English teacher and I began hearing English lessons inside her, while she was pregnant to me. I never studied English with mom but my English has always been noticeably better than most of my classmates. I wasn't a hardworking student and I wasn't getting the highest marks but I've always had the talent. Perhaps coupled with my musical ear and my singing experiences, my English always makes people surprised. Some are shocked that I've never been abroad, an English (I mean her nationality is English) headmistress of one of the most prominent private shcools in Turkey couldn't believe that I'm Turkish. I learned that she even asked one of my co-workers (teacher) if I had lied about being Turkish, haha. Anyway, I really want to learn Latin. I cannot envision myself speaking French, Arabic, Dutch or German. To my ears, they are not sonorous and they can even be disturbing. But who knows what the future brings... Edited by Shadowyzard - October 14 2020 at 20:45 |
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Lewian ![]() Prog Reviewer ![]() ![]() Joined: August 09 2015 Location: Italy Status: Offline Points: 15153 |
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Yeah, I should have said more precisely that this was about Züritüütsch, the Swiss German they speak in Zuerich. I know people from St Gallen and Appenzell and understanding that stuff works OK but Berner Oberland is a different story indeed. I have heard that in the mountains it happens that people from one valley have a hard time to understand people from the next valley.
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tszirmay ![]() Special Collaborator ![]() ![]() Honorary Collaborator Joined: August 17 2006 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 6673 |
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I couldn"t help giggling about your Swiss german comment! While perfecting my Hoch Deutsch, I was given a taste of it in St-Gallen and Appenzell in the early 70s but what made me laugh even more was that those people could barely understand Berner Oberlander!
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I never post anything anywhere without doing more than basic research, often in depth.
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tszirmay ![]() Special Collaborator ![]() ![]() Honorary Collaborator Joined: August 17 2006 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 6673 |
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My mother tongue is Hungarian, which I can read and write though never having gone to any Hungarian school, French is my education tongue (bacc A), English by neighbourhood in Montreal, all by the age of 5. Then I learnt German every Saturday and Spanish every Sunday for 12 years! Italian and Portuguese came with high schooling in Switzerland. But I must state that there is no talent required, its is a huge misconception! Any child with a musical ear and /or an average IQ can learn up to 11 languages simultaneously , its the power of any young thirsty mind. By the time we reach our early 20s , it becomes harder to store all that information in accessible compartments. Teach your kids multiple tongues when they are toddlers, the brain will sponge it all up.
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I never post anything anywhere without doing more than basic research, often in depth.
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Lewian ![]() Prog Reviewer ![]() ![]() Joined: August 09 2015 Location: Italy Status: Offline Points: 15153 |
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I'm German and this is my native language. I lived in London for 14 years so I'm fine with English, but of course the more you know, the more you know your limits. I'm now living in Italy and my Italian is fluent, but still particularly regarding understanding what people speak or sing without concentrating a lot, writing without truck loads of mistakes, and getting the humour (most difficult thing in any language!) I need to improve a lot! I have learnt French at some point, after I finished university as a hobby, but I don't have contact with people who speak French now, and my Italian has pretty much killed my active French. I can't make a French sentence anymore that doesn't come out at least half Italian. French understanding is also pretty bad, reading is still OK. I am from Hamburg, northern Germany, but I have learnt to understand Swiss German (which is quite something for us flatlanders); I wish I'd have used my time in Switzerland to also learn to speak it - maybe half a year more and it could have worked. For those who don't know: Swiss German is at the same time some kind of German and quite different. People from the north of Germany don't usually understand it. Many Swiss people are not that keen on helping Germans to learn it, because I think they see it as something essential for their identity and it creates a border between them and the Germans that some of them cherish. I worked in Zuerich for two years and was lucky to meet a number of Swiss people who talked to me in Swiss German, although there wasn't much of an incentive to actively learn it because everybody would understand my "normal" German, and Zuerich is full of people who speak German but not Swiss German.
Edited by Lewian - October 14 2020 at 17:37 |
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DamoXt7942 ![]() Special Collaborator ![]() ![]() Joined: October 15 2008 Location: Okayama, Japan Status: Offline Points: 17493 |
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Mine is Japanese of course, and I've learned English ... anyway my EngRish cannot work yet.
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Catcher10 ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() VIP Member Joined: December 23 2009 Location: Emerald City Status: Offline Points: 17966 |
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Cool question for sure.
My native tongue is Spanish, grew up speaking that till about 5 when I entered kindergarten then had to learn English. I read, write speak both fluently. I have dabbled in Portuguese with doing business in Brazil but I can't speak it anymore and only can read most of it that gets me the basic message. Took 3yrs French in HS but never caught on afterward, although it was easy, I can understand some Italian but no speaking it. If spoken slowly I can understand Catalan, but that one is difficult, most think Spanish and Catalan are related.
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Meltdowner ![]() Special Collaborator ![]() ![]() Honorary Collaborator Joined: June 25 2013 Location: Portugal Status: Offline Points: 10279 |
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Good topic and interesting opening post. That explains your broad taste in art. Besides English, I speak both Portuguese and French natively as I was born in France but moved to Portugal at a young age. I tried to learn Italian for a while, because of listening to a lot of RPI, but after returning to France a few days last year I thought it would be better to improve my French. I've been consuming more books/movies/comedy in French to refresh and learn more vocabulary. Besides that I think it's more important to work on my communication skills than to learn a new language, as it doesn't matter how many languages I know if I can't express myself in any of them
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progaardvark ![]() Special Collaborator ![]() ![]() Crossover/Symphonic/RPI Teams Joined: June 14 2007 Location: Sea of Peas Status: Offline Points: 52628 |
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My native language is English (the American variety). I took French in high school and college and I'm not fluent in it. I work in a library and for many years had to translate and transliterate non-English texts for the online catalog just enough to assign subjects to them. I recall doing this for books in Spanish, French, Portuguese, Dutch, German, Danish, Welsh, Polish, Czech, Italian, Romanian, Greek, Russian, Ukrainian, Church Slavic, and Korean (Hangul characters only). Even had a book in the Alsatian dialect that looked like a hybrid of French and German. I can't fluently read or speak any of these languages, but I know enough to be able to get a rough idea of what they are about in a bibliographical sense.
I no longer work with books in this manner because I'm dealing more with metadata harvesting, batch processes with the online catalog, Wikidata, and metadata creation for books that are in the pre-publication phase.
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i'm shopping for a new oil-cured sinus bag that's a happy bag of lettuce this car smells like cartilage nothing beats a good video about fractions |
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