Pain of Salvation

MikeEnRegalia wrote: E-Dub wrote: Pretty smug advice coming from somebody from a country who isn't an easy target. You have the benefit of having 63 years pass. Hey, maybe in 63 years WE'LL be the good guys! Whadd'ya say, guys! When I'm 96 I can start to feel good again. Wooo Hoooo!!! Believe me, if Germany were to get blasted daily because they were a global power it would start to feel like toothpicks under the fingernails. E I didn't say you were the bad guys. All I'm saying is that you can't defend your country by sacrificing what your country stands for. And I know that freedom, liberty and justice (for all) are some of your highest values. Of course it's very possible that I would see this very differently if our country had suffered from such an attack, or if I even was affected personally by it. But my perspective would hardly be more objective, rather the reverse.  Usually victims of crimes aren't the best candidates for investigating those crimes and/or passing sentences ... Let me say it once again: I don't think you're the bad guys, I respect the feelings you express and you also have the right to feel like being stepped on your toes when people from other nations talk about 9.11. But all over Europe people are feeling the repercussions ... in Germany civil rights are also being "revoked", internet connections are being monitored etc.. We may not have suffered the loss you have suffered, but we do feel the climate of fear.

 . . . . . . . .and that is what i meant all along. Besides, rights have been "revoked" in many places, specially Europe and US. Where is the right of the inviolability of your home, of your private affairs? The government is entering the people's home (most time not literally, but they are when monitoring phone calls, internet connections, etc) and that is the 1st step of what could be something dangerous. After all, a totalitarian regime tries to control the hearts and minds of the people. Don't you think that that is somehow close to George Orwell's 1984? I mean,  people manipulating information, prisons far away from the public eye, a war against a invisible and always rejuvenating enemy   . . .

Let's agree in one thing:  "Scarsick" is such a dissapointment that all it causes is non-musical discussions... as the music itself is weak and the lyrics the product of a resented mind... for that is what Gildenlow shows.... you can criticize things but when you sound so bitter like he does in that album, that is resentment... he sounds like a child... like a spoiled swedish brat who has the privilege to whine in public because he chose the path of creating music, which by the way is one of the less effective path to change the world.... (say what you want, good slogans have never changed anything).... As I said in my review, poor little Daniel hates America, hates rappers, hates this, hates that... it's a hate album, no better than any hate album in different genres... and the music is so generic... maybe it's what he intended after all: to show us the "mediocrity of america" by doing mediocre music.... But i  really don't think he went that far in his message... He just was so into biting his blanket and pounding his head against cushioned walls for his hate towards the US that he forgot completely how to create good progressive metal...

E-Dub wrote: Pretty smug advice coming from somebody from a country who isn't an easy target. You have the benefit of having 63 years pass. Hey, maybe in 63 years WE'LL be the good guys! Whadd'ya say, guys! When I'm 96 I can start to feel good again. Wooo Hoooo!!! Believe me, if Germany were to get blasted daily because they were a global power it would start to feel like toothpicks under the fingernails. E

I didn't say you were the bad guys. All I'm saying is that you can't defend your country by sacrificing what your country stands for. And I know that freedom, liberty and justice (for all) are some of your highest values.

Of course it's very possible that I would see this very differently if our country had suffered from such an attack, or if I even was affected personally by it. But my perspective would hardly be more objective, rather the reverse.  Usually victims of crimes aren't the best candidates for investigating those crimes and/or passing sentences ...

Let me say it once again: I don't think you're the bad guys, I respect the feelings you express and you also have the right to feel like being stepped on your toes when people from other nations talk about 9.11. But all over Europe people are feeling the repercussions ... in Germany civil rights are also being "revoked", internet connections are being monitored etc.. We may not have suffered the loss you have suffered, but we do feel the climate of fear.

MikeEnRegalia wrote: E-Dub wrote: MikeEnRegalia wrote: With all due respect, but you're doing much, much more than simply "keeping tabs" on immigrants and visitors. Imagine that 15 years ago someone would have told you that in the late 2000s the United States would introduce laws which make it possible that people (not just "ordinary" people but also U.S. citizens) can be detained by the government in an hermetically sealed prison on a far away island, for unlimited time, without a lawyer ... and without the government having to justify themselves? I'm pretty sure that back then most Americans would have said: "Under no circumstances could this happen here". I'm very sad because of what happened back then, but you should be careful not to let it make you blind to what your government is doing. Yeah, I know. We're so horrible. Blah blah blah blah blah. Everyone can go back to talkin' POS. I allowed the continued US bashing to get the better of me and aided in the hijacking of the thread. I think for that I'll be whisked away from my wife and child and sent to a minimum security prison cell in West Islip, NY where I'll be forced to watch the DVD series of The Nanny looped continuously. Godless American government. NNNNNNOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO <<shakes fist towards the heavens>>>!!!!! E Actually I don't agree with Gildenlöw at all ... I hated Scarsick, and I'm not a fan of Michael Moore, I also didn't like the Borat movie. But some criticism has to be allowed ... it can't be that criticism and free speech become outlawed and "Un-American".

Pretty smug advice coming from somebody from a country who isn't an easy target. You have the benefit of having 63 years pass. Hey, maybe in 63 years WE'LL be the good guys! Whadd'ya say, guys! When I'm 96 I can start to feel good again. Wooo Hoooo!!!

Believe me, if Germany were to get blasted daily because they were a global power it would start to feel like toothpicks under the fingernails.

E

E-Dub wrote: MikeEnRegalia wrote: Atavachron wrote: please don't bully Eric just because of the worst U.S. president in history..  isn't this a PoS thread? I'm not trying to bully anyone ... I just think that posting pics of the burning towers achieves anything in a discussion. I mean, that's exactly how the government used those events to their advantage, and that's a horrible thing to do. And let's get one thing straight...I'm not feeling bullied. Sickened? Yes. Pissed?  Definitely. Bullied? No. And those 'burning towers' were a reality. Not computer generated towers falling or Hollywood stunt doubles falling. Powerful images and real. THAT is why I used them. This thread is really going off topic. Sorry to the original author. E

I don't think it's really that off topic, considering Daniel Gildenlöw's attitude.

But about those towers: Of course they were a reality. But that doesn't mean they can't be used to manipulate people. Didn't you use them to justify taking finger prints of anyone who visits the U.S.? Do you really think that this will prevent terrorism?

^ No, but when you hear or read something that has been repeated ad nauseam, it gets irritating and frustrating.

ON-TOPIC POST:

I really hope the next Pain of Salvation is a huge comeback. Hopefully the rest of the TPE story from "her" point of view will be softer, nicer, not nearly as sarcastic or filthy as the "him" side.

Ghost Rider wrote: but sometimes it can be good to walk for a few yards in someone else's shoes.

EXACTLY!!!! I hope those footprints walk the other way.

E

Atavachron wrote: E-Dub wrote: Atavachron wrote: please don't bully Eric just because of the worst U.S. president in history..  isn't this a PoS thread? You've GOT to remember the Carter administration!!!! E   true, but those were pretty good times

That depends on how much Billy Beer you shotgunned.

E

E-Dub wrote: Atavachron wrote: please don't bully Eric just because of the worst U.S. president in history..  isn't this a PoS thread? You've GOT to remember the Carter administration!!!! E

  true, but those were pretty good times

Atavachron wrote: please don't bully Eric just because of the worst U.S. president in history..  isn't this a PoS thread?

I'm not trying to bully anyone ... I just think that posting pics of the burning towers achieves anything in a discussion. I mean, that's exactly how the government used those events to their advantage, and that's a horrible thing to do.