Special Collaborator
Retired Admin and Amateur Layabout
Joined: May 13 2007
Location: Europe
Status: Offline
Points: 37575
Posted: January 05 2017 at 00:08
... as long as America does take stupid to a whole new level, like by electing a climate change denier to a position of power and influence, we'll be fine...
Joined: April 05 2006
Location: Vancouver, BC
Status: Offline
Points: 37634
Posted: January 04 2017 at 23:51
Blacksword wrote:
Logan wrote:
Of course I felt pretty silly even doing this topic since the evidence is so overwhelming, and I tried to approach it with some humour (of the absurdist kind). There has been some conspiracy when it's come to man induced greenhouse warming deniers.
I would love to move on, but I think humanity must ask itself one very important question, how do we convince Ted Nugent? "Global warming is a fraud. Watch Glenn Beck" (Ted Nugent).
I'd be more concerned about convincing Donald Trump. Nugent was a no one even when he was a 'someone'....
I have to say, though, I'm kind of on George Carlins page regarding "white bourgeois liberals" who want to 'save the planet' The planet is absolutely fine, it's the people who are f***ed.
Brilliant Carlin quote.
And just to pad out my post since I have nothing really to say, most people don't care about global warming, or have different priorities. I'm not really surprised that people could support someone who supports such irrational notions and denies evidence. I mean I am no Hillary fan (not that Duff is that bad), but I'd take her over Ted Nugent any day.
Joined: June 22 2004
Location: England
Status: Offline
Points: 16130
Posted: January 04 2017 at 23:36
Logan wrote:
Of course I felt pretty silly even doing this topic since the evidence is so overwhelming, and I tried to approach it with some humour (of the absurdist kind). There has been some conspiracy when it's come to man induced greenhouse warming deniers.
I would love to move on, but I think humanity must ask itself one very important question, how do we convince Ted Nugent? "Global warming is a fraud. Watch Glenn Beck" (Ted Nugent).
I'd be more concerned about convincing Donald Trump. Nugent was a no one even when he was a 'someone'....
I have to say, though, I'm kind of on George Carlins page regarding "white bourgeois liberals" who want to 'save the planet' The planet is absolutely fine, it's the people who are f***ed.
Joined: April 05 2006
Location: Vancouver, BC
Status: Offline
Points: 37634
Posted: January 04 2017 at 23:29
Of course I felt pretty silly even doing this topic since the evidence is so overwhelming, and I tried to approach it with some humour (of the absurdist kind). There has been some conspiracy when it's come to man induced greenhouse warming deniers. For the next one I might do one that is a little more charged: Is evolution a hoax perpetrated by God?
I would love to move on, but I think humanity must ask itself one very important question, how do we convince Ted Nugent? "Global warming is a fraud. Watch Glenn Beck" (Ted Nugent).
Joined: June 22 2004
Location: England
Status: Offline
Points: 16130
Posted: January 04 2017 at 22:54
It's real. There's no conspiracy. The evidence has been verified and published and this debate is effectivey over. It's only kept alive by people like Alex Jones, Donald Trump and David Icke.
Joined: April 05 2006
Location: Vancouver, BC
Status: Offline
Points: 37634
Posted: January 04 2017 at 21:42
Absolutely there's scientific proof that technology has contributed to global warming and that there are natural climate change patterns. Al Gore is a lawyer and a politician rather than a scientist and I don't know who interpreted the data for him (to be honest, I've never really followed him). Humans have the power to do a lot of damage, and in the case of global warming, if you pump out as much CO2 as we have it's going to contribute to a greenhouse effect -- made worse by increased icemelt so less sunlight is reflected and methane is released in the tundra etc. etc. I think most people, at least here, know the basic science. What worries me is that the process of greenhouse warming can speed up exponentially due to various factors. It is interesting to think that if there were no CO2 in the atmosphere then the earth would freeze.
Yes, there's scientific proof that technological advancements since the industrial age have at least partly caused global warming. There is, however, also a pattern of climate change that the Earth has naturally gone in, so it's not like we've completely altered the atmosphere. To believe humans have the power to do that in such a relatively short time is absurd.
I think one reason so many people don't believe in global warming is because of how blown out of proportion it's been in the past. Just look at how wrong Al Gore's predictions were.
Oh crap, I posted something serious. Better sh*tpost.
Joined: April 05 2006
Location: Vancouver, BC
Status: Offline
Points: 37634
Posted: January 04 2017 at 19:53
Agree that the term climate change is not ideal. As for LA, the introduction of catalytic converters had a big effect on lessening the smog (such technology didn't stop cars from polluting, but it did lessen the impact).
mechanicalflattery wrote:
To be fair, there's a crucial distinction between asserting that climate change is a hoax/conspiracy versus simply asserting it to be bad science. I don't believe either of those, but deniers of man-made climate change don't necessarily have to be conspiracy theorists.
I know, and to be clear the poll and poll question is just a fun accessory to discussion on climate change/ greenhouse warming.
Whatever the skeptic, I'm skeptical about those who deny it. My parents had a friend who invented a fuel cell for hybrid vehicles that was being touted as more environmentally friendly, and I was amazed when speaking to him that he didn't believe that carbon dioxide emissions were causing climate change.
Joined: September 30 2006
Location: Pearland
Status: Online
Points: 65708
Posted: January 04 2017 at 19:34
I would say the term Climate Change is not ideal because the climate does change over time and has nothing to do with man, but that is a somewhat different discussion. Emissions that cause ozone damage do exist and clearly have a marked impact. Pollution in general is a big problem we've always faced, even before the industrial era.
My question is, how did Los Angeles clean up their air? When I was a kid and you'd fly in to L.A. you literally could not see it from the air due to the massive brown cloud that perpetually hung over the city. Now the smog is much less visible except on certain days. De-industrialization? (in SoCal, really?). Fewer cars on the road? (let's be serious). I mean I know they probably had some EPA mandate to do something but it was a pretty impressive clean-up in a fairly short time.
Edited by Atavachron - January 04 2017 at 19:35
"Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought." -- John F. Kennedy
Joined: August 08 2016
Location: Seattle
Status: Offline
Points: 1056
Posted: January 04 2017 at 19:29
To be fair, there's a crucial distinction between asserting that climate change is a hoax/conspiracy versus simply asserting it to be bad science. I don't believe either of those, but deniers of man-made climate change don't necessarily have to be conspiracy theorists.
Joined: April 05 2006
Location: Vancouver, BC
Status: Offline
Points: 37634
Posted: January 04 2017 at 18:59
Read the poll question before voting. I'm amazed at how many people deny the evidence for man-made (or shall I at least say sped up by industrial technology) global (greenhouse) warming, and I'm very skeptical about the motives of many of them when they do. I don't quite like the term man-made, but I think you know what I mean.
"The concept of global warming was created by and for the Chinese in order to make U.S. manufacturing non-competitive" (Donald Trump).
Yes, I do think he's full of hot air. It doesn't make historical sense either, since the concept of greenhouse gasses/ man induced climate change and global warming is such an old one.
I watched this whole debate on youtube earlier, but here's the relevant bit:
Australian Senator Malcolm Roberts has said "It is clear that climate change is a scam" and has said that NASA has corrupted data, there is no empirical evidence that people are causing global warming, and the climate models are wrong.
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