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Dean
Special Collaborator
Retired Admin and Amateur Layabout
Joined: May 13 2007
Location: Europe
Status: Offline
Points: 37575
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Posted: October 03 2007 at 09:57 |
Easy Money wrote:
Since this site claims to be English only, then it seems to me we should use correct English (I know, my spelling is horrendous). Progressive is a real word that is defined in the dictionary so that it can be referenced to clarify things or settle an argument. Making up words like Prog (or prog) and giving them arbitrary definitions is confusing and no help to those who are new to English. Besides, I don't mean to be dramatic, but arbitrarily rewritting definitions seems a bit Orwellian and is an easy way to distort history. It just seems silly to say that prog is anything but short for progressive. |
In as much as I would agree with you semantically. When a word is used to prefix a style of music it's original meaning becomes moot. For example Pop-Music was originally intended to signify Popular Music, Folk-Music has little to do with the dictionalry definition of the world Folk, where is the soul in Soul? and there is nothing classical about modern Classical music. (I'll stop here before we even begin to consider the etymological root of the word Jazz )
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Easy Money
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator / Retired Admin
Joined: August 11 2007
Location: Memphis
Status: Offline
Points: 10669
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Posted: October 03 2007 at 09:49 |
Since this site claims to be English only, then it seems to me we should use correct English (I know, my spelling is horrendous). Progressive is a real word that is defined in the dictionary so that it can be referenced to clarify things or settle an argument.
Making up words like Prog (or prog) and giving them arbitrary definitions is confusing and no help to those who are new to English. Besides, I don't mean to be dramatic, but arbitrarily rewritting definitions seems a bit Orwellian and is an easy way to distort history.
It just seems silly to say that prog is anything but short for progressive.
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Slartibartfast
Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator / In Memoriam
Joined: April 29 2006
Location: Atlantais
Status: Offline
Points: 29630
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Posted: October 03 2007 at 05:55 |
If it weren't for the internet my music collection might be a bit more manageable.
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Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...
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MikeEnRegalia
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: April 22 2005
Location: Sweden
Status: Offline
Points: 21210
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Posted: October 03 2007 at 05:49 |
Here in Germany the big stores stock most of the new prog releases by larger labels like Inside Out ... but only like 1-5 CDs of each new release, and except for some rare exceptions (Porcupine Tree for example) they don't re-order when they're out of stock.
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Slartibartfast
Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator / In Memoriam
Joined: April 29 2006
Location: Atlantais
Status: Offline
Points: 29630
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Posted: October 03 2007 at 05:37 |
Doesn't really matter, my local chain stores don't ever seem to stock what I'm looking for anyway.
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Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...
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MikeEnRegalia
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: April 22 2005
Location: Sweden
Status: Offline
Points: 21210
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Posted: October 03 2007 at 05:16 |
darqdean wrote:
HMV has a section called Metal - 60% of what's in there I do not consider to be Metal at all (when does Green Carnation come just before Green Day in Metal?) - I would not trust HMV to correctly classify anything as Prog for they would have a section in there for Solo Phil Collins and GY!BE would reside alongside Sigor Ros in the Dance section. |
I wish that in record stores they would just sort *all* the artists/bands alphabetically and leave it at that. Not because genres suck, but because they simply don't know the artists well enough.
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Easy Livin
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator / Retired Admin
Joined: February 21 2004
Location: Scotland
Status: Offline
Points: 15585
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Posted: October 03 2007 at 05:16 |
There have been some useful and constructive posts along the way. let's give it a day or two to see if these continue.
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A B Negative
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 02 2006
Location: Methil Republic
Status: Offline
Points: 1594
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Posted: October 03 2007 at 04:02 |
cacha71 wrote:
Vibrationbaby wrote:
no no no you`ve got it all wrong progressive rock is more progressive than progressive rock . But sometimes progressive rock can be more progressive. Sometimes. But only when it`s more progressive. |
Good point. If you didn't know that it was called Prog or progressive, what would you call it? Why don't we all just enjoy the music and not worry too much about what label to attach! |
A rose by any other name would smell as sweet |
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"The disgusting stink of a too-loud electric guitar.... Now, that's my idea of a good time."
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Raff
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: July 29 2005
Location: None
Status: Offline
Points: 24429
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Posted: October 03 2007 at 03:03 |
Well, I suppose my question wasn't clear enough, or, as someone said, I just asked something that had been already discussed a million of times... I thank all those people who tried to answer my question in a constructive way (BTW, great review, Cheesecakemouse! ). However, half of this thread has been taken up by useless banter, which I found just a tad disrespectful. Therefore, I'd be grateful to the Admins if they could close it, at least for the time being.
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cuncuna
Forum Senior Member
Joined: March 29 2005
Location: Chile
Status: Offline
Points: 4318
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Posted: October 03 2007 at 02:32 |
Prog simply doesn't exist as a term for me. In spanish, if I say "prog" I'm saying nothing. The terms here can be "Rock (...) Progresivo" o "Rock sinfónico". Due to society's lack of interest, the subgenres discussed here are nothing but labels for iTunes or winamp that everybody laughs about.
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¡Beware of the Bee!
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Certif1ed
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: April 08 2004
Location: England
Status: Offline
Points: 7559
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Posted: October 03 2007 at 02:27 |
Sckxyss wrote:
I've never, ever heard anyone refer to prog as Prog with a capital P, (...) |
And you've been here since May?
Surely the site's name would have been your introduction to the word "Prog"
Edited by Certif1ed - October 03 2007 at 02:27
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The important thing is not to stop questioning.
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Cheesecakemouse
Forum Senior Member
Joined: April 05 2006
Location: New Zealand
Status: Offline
Points: 1751
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Posted: October 03 2007 at 00:16 |
Check out my Kraftwerk Computerworld review, I asked some of the questions about what is progressive in the forums there in the review.
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Ivan_Melgar_M
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: April 27 2004
Location: Peru
Status: Offline
Points: 19557
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Posted: October 03 2007 at 00:14 |
Sckxyss wrote:
I've never, ever heard anyone refer to prog as Prog with a capital P, now all these definitions are based on whether or not the word is capitalized. It's getting ridiculous! Why can't prog just be a short form for progressive rock?! |
For God's sake, it's simply a matter of grammar
- Progressive Rock is a name of a genre....proper nouns are written with capital letters
- progressive is an adjective...........adjectives use low case
- Prog is an abbreviation of Progressive Rock...Abbreviations follow the same rules for capital letters as complete words do, so if Progressive Rock uses Capital P, then Prog. does too.
As simple as that.
Iván
Edited by Ivan_Melgar_M - October 03 2007 at 00:15
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Sckxyss
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 05 2007
Location: Canada
Status: Offline
Points: 1319
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Posted: October 02 2007 at 23:54 |
I've never, ever heard anyone refer to prog as Prog with a capital P, now all these definitions are based on whether or not the word is capitalized. It's getting ridiculous! Why can't prog just be a short form for progressive rock?!
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Ivan_Melgar_M
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: April 27 2004
Location: Peru
Status: Offline
Points: 19557
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Posted: October 02 2007 at 23:42 |
Yorkie X wrote:
Unfortunately there's another type of "progressive" music getting around its a techno dance type thing and its really starting to steal our title (crap is king and the good don't last long) anyway my point is calling what we like "prog" is the best solution the term progressive has been hijacked by something almost as bad if not worse than punk. I couldn't believe the audacity when I first heard about this progressive dance crap like how dare they ! |
A year agio a kid came and ranted "WTF, no Progressive House bands"
Iván
Edited by Ivan_Melgar_M - October 02 2007 at 23:43
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Atavachron
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: September 30 2006
Location: Pearland
Status: Offline
Points: 65306
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Posted: October 02 2007 at 22:47 |
^ tell that to the good people of Prague
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Easy Money
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator / Retired Admin
Joined: August 11 2007
Location: Memphis
Status: Offline
Points: 10669
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Posted: October 02 2007 at 22:44 |
Prog isn't a real word, it means nothing.
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Yorkie X
Forum Senior Member
Joined: July 04 2007
Status: Offline
Points: 1049
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Posted: October 02 2007 at 22:28 |
Unfortunately there's another type of "progressive" music getting around its a techno dance type thing and its really starting to steal our title (crap is king and the good don't last long) anyway my point is calling what we like "prog" is the best solution the term progressive has been hijacked by something almost as bad if not worse than punk. I couldn't believe the audacity when I first heard about this progressive dance crap like how dare they !
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micky
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: October 02 2005
Location: .
Status: Offline
Points: 46838
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Posted: October 02 2007 at 19:54 |
rushfan4 wrote:
I have Pat Benatar albums, but I draw the line at Barbara Streisand.
Based on that premise that all my albums are prog, I also have a
Paula Abdul and a couple of Samantha Fox CDs that snuck into my
collection in a moment of weakness. Progressive bubblegum??? |
hahahhah.... you could have that crap.... I'll stick with Barbs hahahhaha
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The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip
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Dean
Special Collaborator
Retired Admin and Amateur Layabout
Joined: May 13 2007
Location: Europe
Status: Offline
Points: 37575
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Posted: October 02 2007 at 19:46 |
HMV has a section called Metal - 60% of what's in there I do not consider to be Metal at all (when does Green Carnation come just before Green Day in Metal?) - I would not trust HMV to correctly classify anything as Prog for they would have a section in there for Solo Phil Collins and GY!BE would reside alongside Sigor Ros in the Dance section.
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