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Are RUSH actually Prog?

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Progishness Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 20 2021 at 11:18
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote progaardvark Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 20 2021 at 11:03
Originally posted by The Dark Elf The Dark Elf wrote:

^ This thread has been off-topic since day one. And I'm not sure, after 22 pages of wildly fluctuating subject matter, why anyone would care if it's on-topic. It should be exiled to the "Just For Fun" section of the forum.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SteveG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 20 2021 at 08:16
Falsetto singers usually have a 4 or more octive voice. Frankie Valli has 5. I don't think McCartney is in that class

Edited by SteveG - May 20 2021 at 08:17
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rogerthat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 20 2021 at 07:59
Originally posted by jude111 jude111 wrote:

Originally posted by chopper chopper wrote:

So I thought I clicked on the "Are Rush prog" thread and I find myself reading about Collins, McCartney and falsetto singing! Talk about off-topic.

btw - I'm not sure that McCartney's "screamy" voice as used in Maybe I'm Amazed is actually falsetto. I believe he achieved that by gargling bleach.

He absolutely sings in falsetto: listen at the 1:05 mark (it's not the "screamy" voice section): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=slF3EBxZE6A

I wish some real trained singers would chime in here.

Singers don't always resort to falsetto because they can't hit the note; sometimes it's the tone they desire. Originally someone said that Collins was singing off-key, because he used falsetto at one point. I believe Collins chose to use falsetto; it was an aesthetic choice. He could absolutely hit those notes, as other recordings prove.

Does sound like falsetto to me.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote jude111 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 20 2021 at 07:52
Originally posted by chopper chopper wrote:

So I thought I clicked on the "Are Rush prog" thread and I find myself reading about Collins, McCartney and falsetto singing! Talk about off-topic.

btw - I'm not sure that McCartney's "screamy" voice as used in Maybe I'm Amazed is actually falsetto. I believe he achieved that by gargling bleach.

He absolutely sings in falsetto: listen at the 1:05 mark (it's not the "screamy" voice section): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=slF3EBxZE6A

I wish some real trained singers would chime in here.

Singers don't always resort to falsetto/head voice because they can't hit the note; sometimes it's the tone they desire. Originally someone said that Collins was singing off-key, because he used head voice at one point. I believe Collins chose to use it; it was an aesthetic choice. He could absolutely hit those notes, as other recordings prove.

Talented, well-trained singers can blend between head and chest voice so that you don't even notice the transitions, and blend back and forth between the two seamlessly. But most cannot do this, not without training and instruction.


Edited by jude111 - May 20 2021 at 08:06
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote chopper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 20 2021 at 06:57
Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:

Originally posted by chopper chopper wrote:

So I thought I clicked on the "Are Rush prog" thread and I find myself reading about Collins, McCartney and falsetto singing! Talk about off-topic.

btw - I'm not sure that McCartney's "screamy" voice as used in Maybe I'm Amazed is actually falsetto. I believe he achieved that by gargling bleach.
Yes, the thread's off topic but that didn't stop you from joining in on the falsetto debate.  

Fair point, I thought I might as well join in. It makes a change from going round in a permanent circle of Rush being prog or not prog.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SteveG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 20 2021 at 06:46
Originally posted by The Dark Elf The Dark Elf wrote:

^ This thread has been off-topic since day one. And I'm not sure, after 22 pages of wildly fluctuating subject matter, why anyone would care if it's on-topic. It should be exiled to the "Just For Fun" section of the forum.
Any "is X prog?" thread is just for fun!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The Dark Elf Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 20 2021 at 06:38
^ This thread has been off-topic since day one. And I'm not sure, after 22 pages of wildly fluctuating subject matter, why anyone would care if it's on-topic. It should be exiled to the "Just For Fun" section of the forum.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SteveG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 20 2021 at 06:20
Originally posted by chopper chopper wrote:

So I thought I clicked on the "Are Rush prog" thread and I find myself reading about Collins, McCartney and falsetto singing! Talk about off-topic.

btw - I'm not sure that McCartney's "screamy" voice as used in Maybe I'm Amazed is actually falsetto. I believe he achieved that by gargling bleach.
Yes, the thread's off topic but that didn't stop you from joining in on the falsetto debate. Btw, early Geddy vocals are as close to a hard rock falsetto is one could get.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote chopper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 20 2021 at 02:24
So I thought I clicked on the "Are Rush prog" thread and I find myself reading about Collins, McCartney and falsetto singing! Talk about off-topic.

btw - I'm not sure that McCartney's "screamy" voice as used in Maybe I'm Amazed is actually falsetto. I believe he achieved that by gargling bleach.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Frenetic Zetetic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 19 2021 at 22:56
Well, you guys did it. 

You finally f**king did it. 

This thread has gone back and forth for so many pages it's actually created a parallel timeline where Rush is both and neither prog, like some sort of Schrodinger's Prog Cat bullsh*t. 

I hope you're happy, Prog/Not Prog Archives! Wink

"I am so prog, I listen to concept albums on shuffle." -KMac2021
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AFlowerKingCrimson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 19 2021 at 20:56
Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:

Originally posted by AFlowerKingCrimson AFlowerKingCrimson wrote:

Yep and do you know the real reason why those singers from the sixties sang that way?
Yes.

I do too but most people don't because it's not common knowledge. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The Dark Elf Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 19 2021 at 19:56
Originally posted by jude111 jude111 wrote:

Originally posted by The Dark Elf The Dark Elf wrote:

I don't recall Paul McCartney having to "slip into falsetto a couple times" to hit notes (actually more than a couple). Can you point them out? LOLLOLLOLLOLLOLLOLLOLLOL

I can think of numerous times offhand when McCartney sang in falsetto to reach higher notes - Hey Jude, Maybe I'm Amazed, Check My Machine, My Love, Helter Skelter.

Singers use falsetto all the time. It's actually a quite desirable and pleasant tool to have, although it takes skill and talent to pull off - which both McCartney and Collins were able to do.
Stop it. We are talking about one particular song that did not require falsetto and Phil having to resort to it because it was out of his register. If Phil were to try to sing Hey Jude the way Paul sang it, he'd have to put his nuts in a vice. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SteveG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 19 2021 at 19:50
Originally posted by AFlowerKingCrimson AFlowerKingCrimson wrote:

Yep and do you know the real reason why those singers from the sixties sang that way?
Yes.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AFlowerKingCrimson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 19 2021 at 19:49
Yep and do you know the real reason why those singers from the sixties sang that way?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SteveG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 19 2021 at 19:43
Originally posted by jude111 jude111 wrote:

Originally posted by The Dark Elf The Dark Elf wrote:

I don't recall Paul McCartney having to "slip into falsetto a couple times" to hit notes (actually more than a couple). Can you point them out? LOLLOLLOLLOLLOLLOLLOLLOL


I can think of numerous times offhand when McCartney sang in falsetto to reach higher notes - Hey Jude, Maybe I'm Amazed, Check My Machine, My Love, Helter Skelter.

Singers use falsetto all the time. It's actually a quite desirable and pleasant tool to have, although it takes skill and talent to pull off - which both McCartney and Collins were able to do.



Singing in a higher register and singing in a falsetto are not really the same. Falsetto is more of a a screech. Real falsetto singers are Frankie Valli, Del Shannon and Lou Christie from the 60s, not McCartney

Edited by SteveG - May 19 2021 at 19:49
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SteveG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 19 2021 at 19:38
Originally posted by verslibre verslibre wrote:

Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:

Some Beatles covers can be very good. Did you ever hear the Styx cover of I Am The Walrus?

That's from their covers album, Big Bang Theory. I don't usually go for those, and I'm one of the "no Dennis, no Styx" guys. But one of these days, I will listen to The Mission, because I understand they made a good concept album, and I do like Gowan as a singer.
 


I listened to the whole album and wasn't impressed but the Walrus blew my mind. So, covers are not my thing either.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jude111 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 19 2021 at 19:33
Originally posted by The Dark Elf The Dark Elf wrote:

I don't recall Paul McCartney having to "slip into falsetto a couple times" to hit notes (actually more than a couple). Can you point them out? LOLLOLLOLLOLLOLLOLLOLLOL

I can think of numerous times offhand when McCartney sang in falsetto to reach higher notes - Hey Jude, Maybe I'm Amazed, Check My Machine, My Love, Helter Skelter.

Singers use falsetto all the time. It's actually a quite desirable and pleasant tool to have, although it takes skill and talent to pull off - which both McCartney and Collins were able to do.


Edited by jude111 - May 19 2021 at 19:37
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote verslibre Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 19 2021 at 19:29
Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:

Some Beatles covers can be very good. Did you ever hear the Styx cover of I Am The Walrus?

That's from their covers album, Big Bang Theory. I don't usually go for those, and I'm one of the "no Dennis, no Styx" guys. But one of these days, I will listen to The Mission, because I understand they made a good concept album, and I do like Gowan as a singer.
 


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SteveG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 19 2021 at 19:19
Some Beatles covers can be very good. Did you ever hear the Styx cover of I Am The Walrus?
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