The importance of music theory - Progressive Rock Music Forum

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Svetonio

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Posted: August 26 2014 at 13:18

The T wrote:

I'm of the opinion that learning something always, always helps.

The T

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Posted: August 26 2014 at 12:58

I'm of the opinion that learning something always, always helps.

Progosopher View Drop Down

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Posted: August 26 2014 at 12:40

If you just want to rock as a listener, you don't need any. If you want to rock as a player it helps to know some. If you are going to compose or perform anything reasonably complex or sophisticated, the level of your knowledge will reflect in your work. This does not necessarily require formal training but that can only enhance your control over what you create. As a listener, I have found that the little I know helps me to both appreciate good music of any genre. More study could only enhance my appreciation of jazz and classical. I understand what you mean about how knowledge of theory can interfere with music already enjoyed, but that is only music that is sub-standard. A former girlfriend was really into Green Day until she started to learn guitar. Then she realized they had done nothing that a first year student could not play. A similar thing has happened to me but now I have come full circle and can enjoy something that simply rocks out. Not Green Day, they are a bunch of posers, but I can get into the Ramones, and that music is not complex but boy does it rock.

The world of sound is certainly capable of infinite variety and, were our sense developed, of infinite extensions. -- George Santayana, "The Sense of Beauty"

PrognosticMind View Drop Down

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Posted: August 26 2014 at 11:11

The-Bullet wrote:

Rick Wakeman has said (paraphrasing)that you need to know the rules, before you can break them.

This. This times all the this-es.

Music for me is like cooking. You're absolutely free to experiment with different ingredients and textures, but if you have some sort of pre-knowledge of what constitutes the chemistry of those ingredients, you up your odds of producing something not only edible, but delicious as well.

I used to feel that theory would inhibit creativity because of a certain line of thinking, but now I'm seeing how it actually enhances creativity in the long run. I think the main benefit of understanding theory is the communicative aspect, as someone has already mentioned.

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JJMcBlaze

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Posted: August 26 2014 at 09:02

Though, I agree that music is an 'emotional journey' for the listener, it must be more a more academic process for the musician.

I've learnt (as an engineer and as musician) that immediate knowledge of theory a; saves hours of trying to explain other musicians how to play something, and b; that it helps in understanding what progression or individual chord can conjure the emotional leverage you're looking for.

The levels of theoretical knowledge depend largely on the music one plays. I guess that 'the average grunge band' with three minute/three chord songs require a lot less theoretical knowledge than a jazz-fusion band or a symphonic orchestra.

In the end, though, I am very sure that when one has learned his theory in such a way that it's like second nature, emotional baggage can come from that theoretical freedom,

Regards, Len

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Manuel

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Posted: August 26 2014 at 08:47

The-Bullet wrote:

To me, listening to music is an emotional experience not an analytical one. Improving your music theory knowledge can only have a positive effect, whether listing to or creating music.
Rick Wakeman has said (paraphrasing)that you need to know the rules, before you can break them.

I totally agree with you.Learning theory makes you understand the music structure, in terms of composition, progressions, regressions, orchestration, arrangements, instrumentation, etc. But don't forget about the emotion, feelings, sentiments, etc around the music, that can not be expressed or limited by your knowledge of theory.

HolyMoly

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Posted: August 26 2014 at 08:16

The-Bullet wrote:

Rick Wakeman has said (paraphrasing)that you need to know the rules, before you can break them.

I remember Robert Fripp said something similar - that he spent half his life learning to play the guitar, and the other half unlearning everything he knew. Something like that.

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The-Bullet View Drop Down

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Posted: August 26 2014 at 08:07

To me, listening to music is an emotional experience not an analytical one. Improving your music theory knowledge can only have a positive effect, whether listing to or creating music.
Rick Wakeman has said (paraphrasing)that you need to know the rules, before you can break them.

"Why say it cannot be done.....they'd be better doing pop songs?"

HolyMoly

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Posted: August 26 2014 at 07:40

Toaster Mantis wrote:

.....That has happened to me on a major scale, ....

Nice unintentional pun there LOL

Your question/issue is pretty complex to unravel, but I'll just say that although my music theory knowledge is far from advanced, it has enhanced my enjoyment of music, whether or not the music in question is demonstrative of music theory concepts. Knowing the difference between different types of chords and scales makes a lot of music interesting to me because I'm the sort who likes trying to understand the intent of the composer (note I said "trying to"... I realize the composer's actual intent is something I can't ever really claim to know).

However, on the other hand, lately I've been into a more avant garde type of music, and I really don't know any theory (if there is any) behind it, other than it does something pleasant to my brain. In that case, maybe it's better if I don't try too hard to understand it. So I guess my advice is to seek understanding insomuch as you're genuinely curious, but don't get fanatical about it or dig deeper than you really want, or some of the ineffable magic may be lost. But satisfying your own natural curiosity is almost always a good thing.

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Toaster Mantis View Drop Down

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Posted: August 26 2014 at 05:29

Time for another "issue I've never got really cleared up but mentioned fleetingly in quite a few previous discussions" thread.

I used to play in an orchestra where I had to read sheet music, so I obviously know the basics of music theory. At the same time, much of the more advanced aspects involving things like melodic phrasing, texture, timbre, consonance/dissonance, counterpoint etc. I only have a novice understanding of patched together from music reviews written by people who know more of theory than I do. As a result, I sometimes wonder how much of the compositional content and details regarding performance I'm missing with more "out there" avantgarde/technical music.

On the other hand, I'm also kind of worried that if I learn too much music theory there'll be a lot of music I currently enjoy I no longer will because it no longer matches up to those standards set by the theory. That has happened to me on a major scale, and I've also encountered quite a few people who were really into music theory but couldn't enjoy any music whose songwriting and performance didn't fit into mathematically perfect rhythmic/melodic patterns. Curiously enough, those types I've met tend to find most "classic" progressive rock's approximation of classical/folk/jazz influences incorporated into a rock framework somewhat kitschy but are much more positive towards Beefheart/Zappa-type "avantgarde rock" as well as the Zeuhl and RIO scenes. (often also the more abstract types of extreme metal too)

Again, here I'm going by anecdotal experience but I'm curious to know how much I'm missing out on and how much analyzing music from an overtly formal/theoretical perspective in turn will actually limit your perspective.

"The past is not some static being, it is not a previous present, nor a present that has passed away; the past has its own dynamic being which is constantly renewed and renewing." - Claire Colebrook