Forum Home Forum Home > Site News, Newbies, Help and Improvements > Report abuse here
  New Posts New Posts RSS Feed - List manipulation?
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Events   Register Register  Login Login

Topic ClosedList manipulation?

 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <1 23456 12>
Author
Message Reverse Sort Order
toroddfuglesteg View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar
Retired

Joined: March 04 2008
Location: Retirement Home
Status: Offline
Points: 3658
Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 14 2010 at 02:28

If it is Motorpsycho fans, this matter should not be reported to the Pa Admins. It should rather be reported to the local mental hospitals and the Gandalff's should be taken care off by them.

Get their addresses and send out ambulances. 

Half-joking..........

Back to Top
DisgruntledPorcupine View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: January 16 2010
Location: Thunder Bay CAN
Status: Offline
Points: 4395
Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 13 2010 at 22:19
Originally posted by Epignosis Epignosis wrote:

Originally posted by DisgruntledPorcupine DisgruntledPorcupine wrote:

Originally posted by Epignosis Epignosis wrote:

Originally posted by harmonium.ro harmonium.ro wrote:

Three Gandalf-related LOL accounts are now active trying to push up this album: http://www.progarchives.com/album.asp?id=27414

Here are the suspicious accounts:
Gandalfs Mother
Gandalfino
Gandalff

Can their IPs be checked?


If that's one person manipulating ratings, he's doing a piss-poor job. 

Plus, these three accounts have join dates in three different years.
They aren't manipulating. They're different people.


Yes, we established that nearly 5 months ago.
Woops. Didn't notice date. LOL
Back to Top
Epignosis View Drop Down
Special Collaborator
Special Collaborator
Avatar
Honorary Collaborator

Joined: December 30 2007
Location: Raeford, NC
Status: Offline
Points: 32553
Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 13 2010 at 22:02
Originally posted by DisgruntledPorcupine DisgruntledPorcupine wrote:

Originally posted by Epignosis Epignosis wrote:

Originally posted by harmonium.ro harmonium.ro wrote:

Three Gandalf-related LOL accounts are now active trying to push up this album: http://www.progarchives.com/album.asp?id=27414

Here are the suspicious accounts:
Gandalfs Mother
Gandalfino
Gandalff

Can their IPs be checked?


If that's one person manipulating ratings, he's doing a piss-poor job. 

Plus, these three accounts have join dates in three different years.
They aren't manipulating. They're different people.


Yes, we established that nearly 5 months ago.
Back to Top
DisgruntledPorcupine View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: January 16 2010
Location: Thunder Bay CAN
Status: Offline
Points: 4395
Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 13 2010 at 21:40
Originally posted by Epignosis Epignosis wrote:

Originally posted by harmonium.ro harmonium.ro wrote:

Three Gandalf-related LOL accounts are now active trying to push up this album: http://www.progarchives.com/album.asp?id=27414

Here are the suspicious accounts:
Gandalfs Mother
Gandalfino
Gandalff

Can their IPs be checked?


If that's one person manipulating ratings, he's doing a piss-poor job. 

Plus, these three accounts have join dates in three different years.
They aren't manipulating. They're different people.
Back to Top
Dean View Drop Down
Special Collaborator
Special Collaborator
Avatar
Retired Admin and Amateur Layabout

Joined: May 13 2007
Location: Europe
Status: Offline
Points: 37575
Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 13 2010 at 08:59
Originally posted by Uros Krunic Uros Krunic wrote:

namorthac, tluchies, guisbert, flapmobiel87. These guys have just registered only to give 5 stars to album Excavation Of The Mind by Sky Architect. flapmobiel87  is even giving low ratings to albums that are competition to Excavation Of The Mind.

I've deleted flapmobiel87 & flopmobiel87 as they are obviously the same person - cant really say whether namorthac, tluches or guisbert have done anything wrong.
What?
Back to Top
Uros Krunic View Drop Down
Forum Newbie
Forum Newbie


Joined: June 04 2009
Status: Offline
Points: 13
Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 13 2010 at 08:19
namorthac, tluchies, guisbert, flapmobiel87. These guys have just registered only to give 5 stars to album Excavation Of The Mind by Sky Architect. flapmobiel87  is even giving low ratings to albums that are competition to Excavation Of The Mind.

Back to Top
harmonium.ro View Drop Down
Special Collaborator
Special Collaborator

Honorary Collaborator / Retired Admin

Joined: August 18 2008
Location: Anna Calvi
Status: Offline
Points: 22989
Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 12 2010 at 08:19
I saw that, indeed, but I think it's worth a short check up. Smile
Back to Top
Epignosis View Drop Down
Special Collaborator
Special Collaborator
Avatar
Honorary Collaborator

Joined: December 30 2007
Location: Raeford, NC
Status: Offline
Points: 32553
Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 12 2010 at 08:17
Originally posted by harmonium.ro harmonium.ro wrote:

Three Gandalf-related LOL accounts are now active trying to push up this album: http://www.progarchives.com/album.asp?id=27414

Here are the suspicious accounts:
Gandalfs Mother
Gandalfino
Gandalff

Can their IPs be checked?


If that's one person manipulating ratings, he's doing a piss-poor job. 

Plus, these three accounts have join dates in three different years.
Back to Top
harmonium.ro View Drop Down
Special Collaborator
Special Collaborator

Honorary Collaborator / Retired Admin

Joined: August 18 2008
Location: Anna Calvi
Status: Offline
Points: 22989
Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 12 2010 at 07:58
Three Gandalf-related LOL accounts are now active trying to push up this album: http://www.progarchives.com/album.asp?id=27414

Here are the suspicious accounts:
Gandalfs Mother
Gandalfino
Gandalff

Can their IPs be checked?
Back to Top
harmonium.ro View Drop Down
Special Collaborator
Special Collaborator

Honorary Collaborator / Retired Admin

Joined: August 18 2008
Location: Anna Calvi
Status: Offline
Points: 22989
Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 02 2010 at 10:21
It does, just check the Collab's  Album Of The Year Wink
Back to Top
Slartibartfast View Drop Down
Collaborator
Collaborator
Avatar
Honorary Collaborator / In Memoriam

Joined: April 29 2006
Location: Atlantais
Status: Offline
Points: 29630
Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 02 2010 at 09:49
Originally posted by Zitro Zitro wrote:

And what Logan is saying continues and Magma keeps falling down.
  I though Magma just flows down and burns anything that gets in its way. Tongue


Edited by Slartibartfast - April 02 2010 at 09:51
Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...

Back to Top
Dean View Drop Down
Special Collaborator
Special Collaborator
Avatar
Retired Admin and Amateur Layabout

Joined: May 13 2007
Location: Europe
Status: Offline
Points: 37575
Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 02 2010 at 05:58

Deliberate list manipulation is something that is difficult to prove - if the 1-star and 5-stars are distributed to albums that are "competing" in either the genre chart, the year chart or the top-100 chart then it's a strong suggestion of manipulation, but not absolute proof. If the user has multiple accounts then that is a stronger proof.

As I pointed out in the reviews reporting thread - if ! have 5000 albums in my collection and 5% of those are "masterpieces" in my estimation, then I could award a possible 250 5-star ratings (and probably a  lesser number of 1-star ratings, but still a "fair" number, let's say 25) - so out of only 10 or 20 ratings it would be difficult to say that whether I was manipulating or simply reflecting my tastes,
What?
Back to Top
seventhsojourn View Drop Down
Special Collaborator
Special Collaborator
Avatar
Honorary Collaborator

Joined: December 11 2009
Location: .
Status: Offline
Points: 4006
Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 02 2010 at 05:33
^ Martin,
 
As always, I'm not trying to be confrontational... just seeking clarity/consistency, because I'm old and easily confused Smile
 
So, here we have someone posting mostly 1- and 5-star ratings. Harmonium.ro questions whether this is manipulation or simply not following guidelines. I'm struggling to see the difference between this and someone who has 95% 5-star posts.
 
I don't think that if someone posts 95% 5-star reviews that this is necessarily suspicious or ''fishy''. I would maybe have second thoughts about buying a cd based on their rating, but that's all. What I do wonder is... would someone be considered for promotion to Prog Reviewer if they only posted 5-star reviews?
 
Apologies in advance if anyone thinks I'm out of line here, but that's not my intention. 
Back to Top
harmonium.ro View Drop Down
Special Collaborator
Special Collaborator

Honorary Collaborator / Retired Admin

Joined: August 18 2008
Location: Anna Calvi
Status: Offline
Points: 22989
Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 02 2010 at 05:15
Originally posted by seventhsojourn seventhsojourn wrote:

Originally posted by harmonium.ro harmonium.ro wrote:

Does someone come to PA only to give just one album from a corner of the world a * rating? Really? Maybe it has to do with the fact that the particular album is "too high" in the genre top albums list...

http://www.progarchives.com/Collaborators.asp?id=13267&listreviews=&showall=true#reviews

These guys do manipulation or at least they're not really following the guidelines:

http://www.progarchives.com/Collaborators.asp?id=23134&listreviews=&showall=true#reviews
http://www.progarchives.com/Collaborators.asp?id=11600&listreviews=&showall=true#reviews
http://www.progarchives.com/Collaborators.asp?id=4843&listreviews=&showall=true#reviews
 
We're told we can rate as we see fit. I don't want to re-open any wounds, but I feel as if I'm getting mixed messages here.


No, we are told to put balanced and well thought ratings, avoiding extreme ratings. [8 - Before assigning a star rating to an album, you should ensure you understand what the differing numbers of stars mean. Please use "one" and "five star" ratings very sparingly -- most albums you dislike will have at least some positive qualities, and not every album that you enjoy will be a perfect "masterpiece of prog". ] These guys came here with a vengeance LOL
Back to Top
Marty McFly View Drop Down
Special Collaborator
Special Collaborator
Avatar
Honorary Collaborator

Joined: March 23 2009
Location: Czech Republic
Status: Offline
Points: 3968
Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 02 2010 at 04:19

We can rate as we want to, as long as it makes sense. Having average of 2.5 just from 1 & 5 stars isn't right and certainly breaks the rule about "not everything you like is masterpiece and there's something good on album you want to drown with 1 stars".

So if it looks "normal", there's nothing bad with that. What's normal ? Well, here, admins must use common sense. But I'm glad that mostly, admins investigate it, evaluate results and there are no forced acts, nobody is insisting on deleting them. Mostly. Just in the most "fishy" cases.

There's a point where "avant-garde" and "experimental" becomes "terrible" and "pointless,"

   -Andyman1125 on Lulu







Even my
Back to Top
seventhsojourn View Drop Down
Special Collaborator
Special Collaborator
Avatar
Honorary Collaborator

Joined: December 11 2009
Location: .
Status: Offline
Points: 4006
Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 01 2010 at 17:51
Originally posted by harmonium.ro harmonium.ro wrote:

Does someone come to PA only to give just one album from a corner of the world a * rating? Really? Maybe it has to do with the fact that the particular album is "too high" in the genre top albums list...

http://www.progarchives.com/Collaborators.asp?id=13267&listreviews=&showall=true#reviews

These guys do manipulation or at least they're not really following the guidelines:

http://www.progarchives.com/Collaborators.asp?id=23134&listreviews=&showall=true#reviews
http://www.progarchives.com/Collaborators.asp?id=11600&listreviews=&showall=true#reviews
http://www.progarchives.com/Collaborators.asp?id=4843&listreviews=&showall=true#reviews
 
We're told we can rate as we see fit. I don't want to re-open any wounds, but I feel as if I'm getting mixed messages here.
Back to Top
harmonium.ro View Drop Down
Special Collaborator
Special Collaborator

Honorary Collaborator / Retired Admin

Joined: August 18 2008
Location: Anna Calvi
Status: Offline
Points: 22989
Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 01 2010 at 17:27
Does someone come to PA only to give just one album from a corner of the world a * rating? Really? Maybe it has to do with the fact that the particular album is "too high" in the genre top albums list...

http://www.progarchives.com/Collaborators.asp?id=13267&listreviews=&showall=true#reviews

These guys do manipulation or at least they're not really following the guidelines:

http://www.progarchives.com/Collaborators.asp?id=23134&listreviews=&showall=true#reviews
http://www.progarchives.com/Collaborators.asp?id=11600&listreviews=&showall=true#reviews
http://www.progarchives.com/Collaborators.asp?id=4843&listreviews=&showall=true#reviews
Back to Top
harmonium.ro View Drop Down
Special Collaborator
Special Collaborator

Honorary Collaborator / Retired Admin

Joined: August 18 2008
Location: Anna Calvi
Status: Offline
Points: 22989
Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 17 2009 at 19:16
Wow, The Tangent's album went down from #1 to #17. That means manipulations really can be effective! 
Back to Top
Logan View Drop Down
Forum & Site Admin Group
Forum & Site Admin Group
Avatar
Site Admin

Joined: April 05 2006
Location: Vancouver, BC
Status: Online
Points: 37344
Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 17 2009 at 18:02
In this case I don't believe that it was because of a belief that an album was being too highly rated as purely an attempt to get an album into top position by raising its ratings while knocking down the competition.  I question if E-Re was even listened to.  While at least one five star review was removed, I believe, of Down and Out, that person also rated without reviewing multiple times the same album and then gave multiple lower ratings to E-Re (that one star ratings were being avoided to make it less obvious and because one stars were being deleted before shows some cunning).  Perhaps if said person. or people, had listened to E-Re, then they would have reviewed it to have more of an effect (though I wouldn't put it past such people to plagiarise other people's reviews or BS one's way through a review even if they haven't heard it).

Edited by Logan - December 17 2009 at 18:37
Back to Top
LiquidEternity View Drop Down
Prog Reviewer
Prog Reviewer
Avatar

Joined: December 07 2007
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 900
Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 17 2009 at 17:49
They probably don't even think about it anymore. Just that an album is getting too highly rated for their tastes, so they make an account and try to knock it down a peg. Doesn't mean that they're not idiots, but it also doesn't mean that they're consciously really considering alternatives.
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <1 23456 12>

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down



This page was generated in 0.172 seconds.
Donate monthly and keep PA fast-loading and ad-free forever.