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Favorite Obscure Prog Band?
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starless2112 View Drop Down
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Martin Circus, from France and Tonton Macoute.
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Celeste (especially Principe Di Un Giorno). Probably not as obscure as it should be for this thread. Like a fine wine though, it's subtle and demonstrative of careful, concise craftsmanship.
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Thinking Plague! 
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Originally posted by verslibre verslibre wrote:

Maximum Indifference was a Bay Area heavy prog trio that released two fine albums: a self-titled, and the follow-up The Transmutations Of Supposed Angels Or Beings That Were Once Girls. AFAIK, they played SoCal once, when they opened ProgWest 2001 (which is where I got to see them). 


Hey, thanks, they are really good!! Clap
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Any other fans of This Heat?
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OK, seriously now. Here's a short list.

Wha-ha-ha
Arrigo Barnabé
UR Kaos
Naked City
Zoviet France
Comus
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Maximum Indifference was a Bay Area heavy prog trio that released two fine albums: a self-titled, and the follow-up The Transmutations Of Supposed Angels Or Beings That Were Once Girls. AFAIK, they played SoCal once, when they opened ProgWest 2001 (which is where I got to see them). 
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Circa Survive is a pretty underground band both in general and on this site; all of their albums have under 30 ratings. They're a crossover prog band that sort of mixes post-rock, post-hardcore/emo, indie rock, and prog. They have some beautiful stuff, all with a lot of musical layers. I discovered Juturna a while back, and originally didn't go past their second album, but some of their most incredible songs are on Descensus and The Amulet, plus the song "Birth of the Economic Hit Man" from Violent Waves. Amazing dudes.
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Originally posted by Hrychu Hrychu wrote:

Once and Future Band deserves a much higher exposure and rating on PA IMO.

Absolutely!!!
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Once and Future Band deserves a much higher exposure and rating on PA IMO.
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verslibre View Drop Down
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Points: 18563 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote verslibre Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 05 2018 at 15:40
True. Any post-70s prog band that can crowdfund its new album and is the focus of a weekend convention is ahead of the rest of the pack. They were signed to EMI for a good while, too.
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Points: 18928 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AFlowerKingCrimson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 05 2018 at 14:55
[Yes, it's a relative term. Saga are virtually unknown in the States but if you mention "On The Loose" then a lot of people remember them. Yet Saga maintained avid followings in Germany, Puerto Rico and Canada. So are they "obscure"? Not in those places. In Germany, Michael Sadler even performed Saga songs arranged for big band, if you can believe that.]

Good point. It's true some bands are bigger(much bigger)in some places than in others. Eloy were apparently huge in Germany but mostly a cult band anywhere else. Barclay James Harvest were also huge in Germany but not very well known in the US (except maybe among avid collectors). There are plenty of other examples I'm sure. 

As for Saga, you could probably say the same thing about Marillion although they at least seem to have a pretty big cult following in the US. 
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Points: 18928 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AFlowerKingCrimson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 05 2018 at 14:51
[Age really has nothing to do with it. ]

Sure it does. If you go to enough prog shows and festivals you will see mostly older fans. I'm not saying there aren't any younger prog fans but the majority seem to be of a certain age bracket. It's not the fault of younger people either really. How can they get into a genre of music if they haven't been exposed to it? Fortunately that has started to change a bit over the last few years but I still feel there are age discrepancies when it comes to prog music.
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verslibre View Drop Down
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Originally posted by BaldFriede BaldFriede wrote:

What counts is the music and nothing but the music. Putting artists into a so-called "first tier" just for their commercial success is in my opinion anti-prog; it certainly creates a big dichotomic dilemma. On one hand you praise prog for not going with the flow and rather creating the exceptional, on the other hand you put exactly those who go with the flow (within the category of prog of course) into a so-called "first tier". That's like trying to have and eat your cake.

The only right choice here is in my opinion an out-of-the-box choice which is why I won't support categorizing artists like this at all.

We do need to retire the "Big 3/5/6/10" model. We just keep using it because everyone knows which bands go in there by force of habit (and they're always usually Brit prog bands). 
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Points: 10266 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BaldFriede Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 05 2018 at 11:54
What counts is the music and nothing but the music. Putting artists into a so-called "first tier" just for their commercial success is in my opinion anti-prog; it certainly creates a big dichotomic dilemma. On one hand you praise prog for not going with the flow and rather creating the exceptional, on the other hand you put exactly those who go with the flow (within the category of prog of course) into a so-called "first tier". That's like trying to have and eat your cake.

The only right choice here is in my opinion an out-of-the-box choice which is why I won't support categorizing artists like this at all.


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verslibre View Drop Down
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Originally posted by AFlowerKingCrimson AFlowerKingCrimson wrote:

Well, I'm not saying KC aren't part of the big six but they are definitely the least commercially successful of those bands(which also includes Yes, Genesis, ELP etc). They are also the least popular(although these days they are probably more popular than ELP among prog fans). That doesn't mean they aren't as good just that they aren't as popular. As for your second tier you didn't mention Gentle Giant. Actually Gentle Giant might be the only band who is sort of stuck between first tier and second tier or at the very least are the top band of the second tier(along with Porcupine Tree and Marillion if we can count newer bands and I use the term newer quite liberally with Marillion(actually both now)). As for King Crimson let's face it. Your average music person doesn't necessarily know about them. I think it's mainly musicians, total music fanatics and prog fans. For Gentle Giant and the second tier bands(which GG are but are also sometimes considered first tier believe it or not)would be mostly just prog fans and the occasional obsessive music collector(pretty much the same thing as the aforementioned "total music fanatic"). But yeah I would say King Crimson are not obscure to us(then again neither is GG, VDGG and all the bands you mentioned plus any band on here with say over 300 ratings) but to the average music fan they certainly are. Sorry to burst your bubble but I'm not going to sugar coat it. In fact sometime last year I was talking to some guy, probably in his fifties, who knew Yes and seemed to be a fan but never even heard of King Crimson. To be honest I was a bit surprised. So yeah obviously not everyone knows who KC are and not even people who are technically "old enough to know better." So let's get down to the core here. Are King Crimson obscure? Well, ultimately that's a relative term. Obviously among prog fans they aren't. They are obviously one of the first bands a person will discover and get into(hopefully)if they are a prog fan. Heck I got into them before I got into ELP back in the eighties but then again I had a cousin who was into them plus read about them in a music book. I got lucky though because I mostly just knew about what I heard on the radio at that time. So among prog fans and real music people no not obscure. Among the casual music listener or those who just rely on what is popular or on the radio yes they are. 

Nor did I mention VdGG or Curved Air. I do agree that GG is stuck between the top 2 tiers. There's really no bubble to burst, because many "average" music listeners do exist in a bubble. I've a friend who only knows of prog rock by way of me. He grew up an Asia fan. I said "You've got to hear what John Wetton was doing before Asia. Same for the other guys!" I even lent him Night After Night-Live because I thought he'd love it. He couldn't get into it. So back to his "Wildest Dreams" he went. Age really has nothing to do with it. Some people get into something and they stick with that, and it becomes, for lack of a better term, their "safe" sound. They aren't open to exploration. 

Yes, it's a relative term. Saga are virtually unknown in the States but if you mention "On The Loose" then a lot of people remember them. Yet Saga maintained avid followings in Germany, Puerto Rico and Canada. So are they "obscure"? Not in those places. In Germany, Michael Sadler even performed Saga songs arranged for big band, if you can believe that.
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verslibre View Drop Down
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Delete.


Edited by verslibre - April 05 2018 at 10:58
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Originally posted by micky micky wrote:

as alluded to in another thread.. some of the best obscure stuff has come from the land down under.

One of my favorites....


turn up that bitch.. and blow thy speakers...



The other album of Bakery is much more interesting and completely different (provided you don't have any religious prejudices):


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AFlowerKingCrimson View Drop Down
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Points: 18928 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AFlowerKingCrimson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 04 2018 at 19:46
Originally posted by verslibre verslibre wrote:

Originally posted by AFlowerKingCrimson AFlowerKingCrimson wrote:

Originally posted by verslibre verslibre wrote:

Originally posted by AFlowerKingCrimson AFlowerKingCrimson wrote:

Heck even Gentle Giant is obscure in the "real world." Not sure about King Crimson though. I think most music fans at least know about them regardless if they are prog fans or not. 

King Crimson opened for Tool. No way would I categorize them as obscure.

Yeah so? Most people don't pay much attention to the opening band unless they are already fans. I'm sure it turned some people onto KC but that by itself would not be enough to launch them into the mainstream. Plus not everyone is a Tool fan.

King Crimson isn't obscure just like Yes, Genesis, ELP, Jethro Tull and Pink Floyd aren't obscure. The main '70s Brit prog acts, aka the Big Six, aren't. Tool picked KC to open for them because they're fans. 

If we drop to "Tier 2," e.g. Renaissance, Camel, Nektar, that's different. 

Well, I'm not saying KC aren't part of the big six but they are definitely the least commercially successful of those bands(which also includes Yes, Genesis, ELP etc). They are also the least popular(although these days they are probably more popular than ELP among prog fans). That doesn't mean they aren't as good just that they aren't as popular. As for your second tier you didn't mention Gentle Giant. Actually Gentle Giant might be the only band who is sort of stuck between first tier and second tier or at the very least are the top band of the second tier(along with Porcupine Tree and Marillion if we can count newer bands and I use the term newer quite liberally with Marillion(actually both now)). As for King Crimson let's face it. Your average music person doesn't necessarily know about them. I think it's mainly musicians, total music fanatics and prog fans. For Gentle Giant and the second tier bands(which GG are but are also sometimes considered first tier believe it or not)would be mostly just prog fans and the occasional obsessive music collector(pretty much the same thing as the aforementioned "total music fanatic"). But yeah I would say King Crimson are not obscure to us(then again neither is GG, VDGG and all the bands you mentioned plus any band on here with say over 300 ratings) but to the average music fan they certainly are. Sorry to burst your bubble but I'm not going to sugar coat it. In fact sometime last year I was talking to some guy, probably in his fifties, who knew Yes and seemed to be a fan but never even heard of King Crimson. To be honest I was a bit surprised. So yeah obviously not everyone knows who KC are and not even people who are technically "old enough to know better." So let's get down to the core here. Are King Crimson obscure? Well, ultimately that's a relative term. Obviously among prog fans they aren't. They are obviously one of the first bands a person will discover and get into(hopefully)if they are a prog fan. Heck I got into them before I got into ELP back in the eighties but then again I had a cousin who was into them plus read about them in a music book. I got lucky though because I mostly just knew about what I heard on the radio at that time. So among prog fans and real music people no not obscure. Among the casual music listener or those who just rely on what is popular or on the radio yes they are. 


Edited by AFlowerKingCrimson - April 04 2018 at 20:05
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