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Heathcliffe 
Forum Senior Member
Joined: November 11 2010
Location: Melbourne
Status: Offline
Points: 178
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 Posted: November 15 2011 at 15:18 |
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One for the Vine - Masterpiece.
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Snow Dog
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: March 23 2005
Location: Caerdydd
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Points: 32995
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Posted: November 15 2011 at 15:10 |
The problem was the band didn't want anyone issuing solo albums until the future of Genesis was secure. That's why Collins album came out at the time of Duke. It was allowed then. I f Steve had been patient he could have stayed in Genesis and released solo albums.
Furthermore, Voyage was NOT as succesful as previous Genesis albums as Ivan states.
Edited by Snow Dog - November 15 2011 at 15:18
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Man With Hat
Collaborator
Jazz-Rock/Fusion/Canterbury Team
Joined: March 12 2005
Location: Neurotica
Status: Offline
Points: 166183
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Posted: November 15 2011 at 15:09 |
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One From The Vine
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Dig me...But don't...Bury me
I'm running still, I shall until, one day, I hope that I'll arrive
Warning: Listening to jazz excessively can cause a laxative effect.
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refugee
Forum Senior Member
VIP Member
Joined: November 20 2006
Location: Greece
Status: Offline
Points: 7026
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Posted: November 15 2011 at 15:02 |
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^Hmm … they all contributed to the music, didn’t they? And a lot of lyrics were not written by Gabriel. As far as I know, The Musical Box was a typical band composition (also lyricwise, with contributions by Ant as well), For Absent Friends was made by Hackett and Collins, Seven Stones was written by Banks alone, the lyrics of Fountain was, I think, co-written by Banks and Rutherford (though others may have been involved). Watcher was Banks/Rutherford, Time Table was Banks alone, Gabriel made the music to Willow Farm. Firth of Fifth was again Banks and Rutherford, with Hackett adding the fantastic solo, of course, we all know that Hackett made After the Ordeal, and the lyrics for Cinema Show were written by Banks and Hackett. The Lamb …is another story, of course, but still (again as far as I know) Gabriel made the music to Counting out Time and The Chamber … and the main melody of Carpet Crawlers.
Don’t get me wrong; I’m sure you know a lot more about Genesis than I
do. Still I feel it’s a bit wrong to generalise, saying that "Tony made
most of the music and Peter made the lyrics of most tracks". But you’re
probably right about Hackett’s role and that Banks got a bit of a shock
when when VotA was released.
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He say nothing is quite what it seems;
I say nothing is nothing
(Peter Hammill)
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Ivan_Melgar_M
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: April 27 2004
Location: Peru
Status: Offline
Points: 19557
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Posted: November 15 2011 at 13:48 |
 twosteves wrote:
I think one of the greatest prog tragedies is the hate Banks has for Hackett---to the degree they never worked together again---they were the perfect prog keys and guitar combo in Genesis and made amazing music. I mean after Phil left the pop group---the ego involved to think they could carry on with CAS---they could have gotten Hackett back and made some real prog knowing they had nothing to prove anymore---but Banks just loves to exclude Hackett. |
Hate is a strong word, and I don't believe Tony hates Steve, but surely they are no best friends.
When Gabriel was in the band, things were easier, Tony made most of the music and Peter made the lyrics of most tracks, while Steve and Tony worked the arrangements together.
But when Peter leaves, all the members wanted to be composers, something I believed didn't troubled Tony, because he knew he was a step ahead of all the others, but Voyage of the Acolyte caused an earthquake, Phil and Mike played for an album completely written by Steve and it was a success (Mote than any Genesis album up to that moment), in that instant Steve ceased to be the silent member who played guitar siting in a chair, to become a strong competition for Tony.
I don't know if Steve didn't invited Tony or Tony didn't want to play in VOTA, but Tony said on an interview, that making solo albums was not healthy for Genesis (He said nothing when Phil and Mike did the same), but the tension got worst, if you watch videos from the era, it looks as three close friends (Tony, Steve & Phil), plus two guests (Steve and Bill Bruford) until a tired Steve left the band.
And glad he did, because along with Peter Gabriel, they kept the level high.
Iván
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7headedchicken
Forum Newbie
Joined: April 21 2011
Location: CA
Status: Offline
Points: 39
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Posted: November 15 2011 at 13:23 |
refugee wrote:
^Then I cast the vote for you since you don’t have enough posts to vote yet, and I can’t decide between Earl, Vine, Rooftops and Quiet Earth. |
Much apprieciated. In turn, when I'm able to vote, I will cast one for one of those other three for ya'.
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refugee
Forum Senior Member
VIP Member
Joined: November 20 2006
Location: Greece
Status: Offline
Points: 7026
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Posted: November 15 2011 at 12:51 |
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^Then I cast the vote for you since you don’t have enough posts to vote yet, and I can’t decide between Earl, Vine, Rooftops and Quiet Earth.
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He say nothing is quite what it seems;
I say nothing is nothing
(Peter Hammill)
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7headedchicken
Forum Newbie
Joined: April 21 2011
Location: CA
Status: Offline
Points: 39
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Posted: November 15 2011 at 12:43 |
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It's very tempting to go with "One For the Vine", it being the masterpiece of composition that it is, but I like "Eleventh Earl of Mar" a little bit more. It seems to encompass all aspects of the album, and contains some of it's best moments, although I've always thought of Wind and Wuthering as one of those albums that listens as one continuous track.
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lazland
Prog Reviewer
Joined: October 28 2008
Location: Wales
Status: Offline
Points: 13700
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Posted: November 15 2011 at 12:35 |
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Afterglow, but there is barely a weak moment on this one.
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Enhance your life. Get down to www.lazland.org
Now also broadcasting on www.progzilla.com Every Saturday, 4.00 p.m. UK time!
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progtapper
Forum Senior Member
Joined: April 15 2010
Location: Belgium
Status: Offline
Points: 141
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Posted: November 15 2011 at 11:55 |
Unquiet Slumbers for the whistlers…
I adore this song. And I don't even need a shower to whistle this one!
My 3 favorite Genesis albums
1. Foxtrot
2. Wind and Wuthering
3. Trespass
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Progfan1958
Forum Senior Member
Joined: July 18 2005
Location: Canada
Status: Offline
Points: 553
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Posted: November 15 2011 at 11:19 |
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Eleventh Earl Of Mar for me. It's really a shame that they've never released an official live version of this track either !
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Progfan1958
"Peace to you all"
"La paix est avec vous"
"Pax vobiscum"
"Al salaam a'alaykum"
"Vrede zij met u allen"
"Shalom aleichem"
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The-time-is-now
Forum Senior Member
Joined: November 05 2008
Location: Belgium
Status: Offline
Points: 2060
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Posted: November 15 2011 at 11:16 |
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One for the Vine.
No contest.
To me.
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 One of my best achievements in life was to find this picture :D
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twosteves
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 01 2007
Location: NYC/Rhinebeck
Status: Offline
Points: 4091
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Posted: November 15 2011 at 10:43 |
Ivan_Melgar_M wrote:
[QUOTE=Blacksword]Best track for me is 'One for the vine' A Banks classic, and possibly one of the best things he wrote.
The album as a whole is a flawed masterpiece, though. There was no need for 'Wot Gorilla' and 'You're owen special way' |
The case of Wot Gorilla? is amazing, Hackett came with "Please Don't Touch" and apparently due to internal problems, they rejected this song in favor of Wot Gorilla?
For what i know, the relations between Banks and Hackett were very low since Steve released the fantastic Voyage of the Acolyte.
This situation, maxde the band decide to give every member a chance to write at least one song, and Rutherford came with nothing better than "Your Own Special Way"
Steve was a threat to Tony's kingdom as Genesis main composer due to his songwriting capacity discovered in VOTA , but obviously Mike wasn't..
This was one of the reasons why Steve left the band:
[quote]What were the primary reasons for your departure from Genesis? It came to a point where I simply couldn’t handle playing “I know what I like in Your Wardrobe” any longer. I also didn’t feel enough of my writing and playing was being included into the music.
I think one of the greatest prog tragedies is the hate Banks has for Hackett---to the degree they never worked together again---they were the perfect prog keys and guitar combo in Genesis and made amazing music. I mean after Phil left the pop group---the ego involved to think they could carry on with CAS---they could have gotten Hackett back and made some real prog knowing they had nothing to prove anymore---but Banks just loves to exclude Hackett.
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Ivan_Melgar_M
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: April 27 2004
Location: Peru
Status: Offline
Points: 19557
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Posted: November 15 2011 at 10:18 |
Blacksword wrote:
Best track for me is 'One for the vine' A Banks classic, and possibly one of the best things he wrote.
The album as a whole is a flawed masterpiece, though. There was no need for 'Wot Gorilla' and 'You're owen special way' |
The case of Wot Gorilla? is amazing, Hackett came with "Please Don't Touch" and apparently due to internal problems, they rejected this song in favor of Wot Gorilla?
For what i know, the relations between Banks and Hackett were very low since Steve released the fantastic Voyage of the Acolyte.
This situation, maxde the band decide to give every member a chance to write at least one song, and Rutherford came with nothing better than "Your Own Special Way"
Steve was a threat to Tony's kingdom as Genesis main composer due to his songwriting capacity discovered in VOTA , but obviously Mike wasn't.. This was one of the reasons why Steve left the band:
| What were the primary reasons for your departure from Genesis? It came to a point where I simply couldn’t handle playing “I know what I like in Your Wardrobe” any longer. I also didn’t feel enough of my writing and playing was being included into the music.
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Iván
Edited by Ivan_Melgar_M - November 15 2011 at 10:18
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zbida
Forum Senior Member
Joined: January 16 2006
Location: Poland
Status: Offline
Points: 748
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Posted: November 15 2011 at 08:03 |
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Great, beautiful and nostalgic album. I must think it over.
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Snow Dog
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: March 23 2005
Location: Caerdydd
Status: Offline
Points: 32995
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Posted: November 15 2011 at 07:20 |
treebeard wrote:
great album, Afterglow for me.. Always wondered how "Please dont touch" would have sounded if the band would have allowed Hacketts track on to the album... |
Yes, imagine it with Banks and Collins performing.
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treebeard
Forum Newbie
Joined: December 04 2006
Status: Offline
Points: 36
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Posted: November 15 2011 at 07:14 |
great album, Afterglow for me.. Always wondered how "Please dont touch" would have sounded if the band would have allowed Hacketts track on to the album...
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yanch
Forum Senior Member
Joined: January 03 2010
Location: Lowell, MA
Status: Offline
Points: 3247
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Posted: November 15 2011 at 06:33 |
Wanorak wrote:
...In That Quiet Earth for me though the last three songs should be grouped as one. IMO possibly the best trio of songs they put together. Definately one of the best instrumental efforts by the group! |
This is how I feel too. The way these 3 flow together is excellent.
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someone_else
Forum Senior Member
VIP Member
Joined: May 02 2008
Location: Going Bananas
Status: Offline
Points: 24340
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Posted: November 15 2011 at 03:10 |
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The best Genesis album after their masterpiece era (from NC to SEbtP). 11th Earl of Mar is my favourite track, followed by Unquiet Slumbers for the Sleepers ... in that Quiet Earth.
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Snow Dog
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: March 23 2005
Location: Caerdydd
Status: Offline
Points: 32995
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Posted: November 15 2011 at 02:21 |
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Earl Of Mar.....stellar!
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Wind and Wuthering - Genesis Poll
