| Author |
 Topic Search  Topic Options
|
wilmon91 
Forum Senior Member
Joined: August 15 2009
Location: Sweden
Status: Offline
Points: 698
|
 Posted: September 13 2011 at 10:29 |
My view of kitsch is something cheap, colorful, simple, mass-produced, conspicuous, undemanding with entertaining qualities, and a product of it's time, like fashion. So it's not a product of timeless values. Something that gets dated quickly but may gain a nostalgic value with time.
If that's right (and I can be wrong), nothing could be stranger than to call prog kitsch! Can music be kitsch?
|
|
|
 |
frippism
Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: July 27 2010
Location: Tel Aviv
Status: Offline
Points: 4160
|
Posted: September 13 2011 at 10:04 |
I think Kitsch is a completely subjective term. Also there's the question to how you react when you hear kitsch. My friend has often cited that "kitsch is good at times"- I tend to disagree. But again it's entirely subjective.
Is there kitsch in prog? In my eyes yes, much of it is flowing with kitsch. For me it's doing something to pompous or bombastic, covering some baroque piece on a Hammond, singing about Lord Of The f**king Rings or some other fantasy book.
It's still all subjective.
|
|
There be dragons
|
|
colorofmoney91
Prog Reviewer
Joined: March 16 2008
Location: Biosphere
Status: Offline
Points: 22774
|
Posted: September 13 2011 at 06:22 |
 harmonium.ro wrote:
A lot of it is, yes, but I don't think prog in itself was kitsch. Retro-prog is kitsch in itself, though.
|
That sums up exactly what I was going to say.
|
|
|
|
Theriver
Forum Senior Member
Joined: March 13 2010
Location: Lisbon Portugal
Status: Offline
Points: 181
|
Posted: September 13 2011 at 06:03 |
|
Too often to my taste.....
|
|
Guldbamsen
Special Collaborator
Retired Admin
Joined: January 22 2009
Location: Magic Theatre
Status: Offline
Points: 23104
|
Posted: September 13 2011 at 05:43 |
|
To a certain point I guess you could call The Residents intentionally kitschy, but that´s mostly down to the tunes - not their outfits or strange personas. Third Reich n Roll along with the Commercial Album - I personally find to be pretty kitsch, but in a funny and purposeful way mind you.
|
|
“The Guide says there is an art to flying or rather a knack. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.”
- Douglas Adams
|
|
rdtprog
Special Collaborator
Heavy, RPI, Symph, JR/F Canterbury Teams
Joined: April 04 2009
Location: Mtl, QC
Status: Offline
Points: 5366
|
Posted: September 13 2011 at 05:23 |
fuxi wrote:
Rick Wakeman performing THE SIX WIVES live INSIDE Hampton Court Palace, wearing a glitter cape & accompanied by full choir and orchestra - most people would call that Kitsch, but Rick simply calls it "fun". I bought the DVD and I certainly enjoy most of it! |
Yes it is fun to watch a little bit of kitschiness in prog. I had the same feeling watching the opera She (Caamora). When you see singers and musicians dressed up and playing music with a serious passion for their art. it's kind of funny and enteirtaining at the same time. I got the same feeling listening Neal Morse playing great music and almost crying at the same time with the effects of all the personal meaning of his lyrics. It doesn't have a clear relation with the term of Kitsch, because this has a subjective meaning.
|
|
fuxi
Prog Reviewer
Joined: March 08 2006
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 2461
|
Posted: September 13 2011 at 04:55 |
|
Rick Wakeman performing THE SIX WIVES live INSIDE Hampton Court Palace, wearing a glitter cape & accompanied by full choir and orchestra - most people would call that Kitsch, but Rick simply calls it "fun". I bought the DVD and I certainly enjoy most of it!
|
|
martinprog77
Forum Senior Member
Joined: December 31 2005
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 2525
|
Posted: September 13 2011 at 04:19 |
prog rock could be considered kitsch ? no .................................unless you are talking about ELP 
|
|
Nothing can last
there are no second chances.
Never give a day away.
Always live for today.
|
|
ExittheLemming
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 19 2007
Location: Penal Colony
Status: Offline
Points: 11420
|
Posted: September 13 2011 at 04:10 |
|
If Prog could be considered an inferior imitation of something it clearly borrows from then possibly, but given the sheer broad scope of differing influences from all the bands that are considered Prog, nah.
|
|
The Hemulen
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: July 31 2004
Location: UK
Status: Offline
Points: 5964
|
Posted: September 13 2011 at 03:44 |
|
Kitsch is far too nebulous a term to be applied to anything more complex than a table lamp, IMO.
|
|
Henry Plainview
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 26 2008
Location: Declined
Status: Offline
Points: 16715
|
Posted: September 12 2011 at 23:45 |
AutumnWanderer wrote:
What's the difference between a psuedo-intellect and an intellect? I hope that's not too off topic, just trying to understand. |
Pseudo-intellectual=someone who you think is stupid because they disagree with you. I can't answer the question because I do not have a firm grasp of what kitsch means.
|
|
if you own a sodastream i hate you
|
|
AutumnWanderer
Forum Newbie
Joined: September 12 2011
Location: Australia
Status: Offline
Points: 27
|
Posted: September 12 2011 at 23:35 |
feloniousgroove wrote:
After looking up "kitsch", I would have to say that some of the people that I know that like prog have been pseudo-intellects and more pretentious than the music is. There is a lot of talent and musicianship in prog that you don't get anywhere else.
|
What's the difference between a psuedo-intellect and an intellect? I hope that's not too off topic, just trying to understand.
I agree, with all the ideas and talent in progressive music, it is hard for me think of it overall as kitsch.
|
|
feloniousgroove
Forum Newbie
Joined: September 06 2011
Location: Livermore, CA
Status: Offline
Points: 21
|
Posted: September 12 2011 at 21:24 |
|
After looking up "kitsch", I would have to say that some of the people that I know that like prog have been pseudo-intellects and more pretentious than the music is. There is a lot of talent and musicianship in prog that you don't get anywhere else.
|
|
Epignosis
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: December 30 2007
Location: Raeford, NC
Status: Offline
Points: 32552
|
Posted: September 12 2011 at 21:03 |
|
When your appreciation of it is ironic, then yes.
|
|
|
|
AutumnWanderer
Forum Newbie
Joined: September 12 2011
Location: Australia
Status: Offline
Points: 27
|
Posted: September 12 2011 at 20:51 |
Well, there was an Australian band in the mid 1970s called Kush which had a little bit of a progressive tendency (their guitarist David Herzog cites Steve Howe as an influence).
Their first album was called "Snow White And The Eight Straights", named after a description that Australian music afficionado Molly Meldrum gave them: 
Their second album is called "Nah, Tellus Wh't Kush Means Yer Great Sausage".
The big single off this was "I'm Your Football" whose opening lines are:
"I'm your football, kick me
I'm your icecream, lick me
I'm your beauty queen, look at me
I think I'm speeding, you can book me"
And it goes on like that...
Geoff Duff, the leader singer, was also going to do a concept album about two rival nations of sausages. He did all the cover art and the story, but it got lost in the mail on the way to the record label, so the record never got made. There's one song from it that exists on the Aztec Records CD re-issue of "Nah, Tellus Wh't Kush Means Yer Great Sausage"
All these elements make me consider this title a little kitsch, but overall I don't think progressive music is that kitsch. I'd rather enjoy it than laugh at it. Laugh with it if they're being playful and funny, and Kush for instance often are, while still understanding their sensibilities and the personalities in the band. I don't think it's something I'd ever roll my eyes at or anything.
Edited by AutumnWanderer - September 12 2011 at 20:55
|
|
Atavachron
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: September 30 2006
Location: Pearland
Status: Offline
Points: 65549
|
Posted: September 12 2011 at 20:36 |
'Kitsch' has morphed somewhat; it seems to mean at once tacky/low-quality, sentimental, and ostentatious. But those are all completely different things. 
|
|
harmonium.ro
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator / Retired Admin
Joined: August 18 2008
Location: Anna Calvi
Status: Offline
Points: 22989
|
Posted: September 12 2011 at 20:07 |
|
A lot of it is, yes, but I don't think prog in itself was kitsch. Retro-prog is kitsch in itself, though.
|
|
ignatiusrielly
Forum Groupie
Joined: September 12 2008
Status: Offline
Points: 55
|
Posted: September 12 2011 at 20:05 |
|
Just wondering if prog rock could be considered kitsch. I have nothing against kitsch, anyway
|
|
Four pails of water and a bagfull of salts
|
|
Donate monthly and keep PA fast-loading and ad-free forever.
/PAlogo_v2.gif "Progarchives.com Homepage")
Is prog kitsch?
