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The Best Progressive Rock Band of The '60s?

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David_D View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote David_D Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 11 2023 at 09:41
Originally posted by Grumpyprogfan Grumpyprogfan wrote:

Originally posted by David_D David_D wrote:

Originally posted by AFlowerKingCrimson AFlowerKingCrimson wrote:

Imo, there was hardly any real prog in the 60s so it's kind of silly to ask this question. Given that many people think KC's debut was the first prog album that means that(to them at least) it was not only the best but just about the only one. I won't go quite that far ...
Nevertherless, this is one of the good answers to my question. Wink
I've learned from this knowledgeable group of folks we have created two new labels. True Prog and Real Prog.

And I easily imagined, that not everybody would find FKC's answer to be good. Big smile

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Psychedelic Paul Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 11 2023 at 09:15
Am I allowed to mention Psychedelic Rock bands too, even though they're not True Prog/Real Prog? If so, I can feel another A-Z list coming on. Wink
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Grumpyprogfan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 11 2023 at 09:09
Originally posted by David_D David_D wrote:

Originally posted by AFlowerKingCrimson AFlowerKingCrimson wrote:

Imo, there was hardly any real prog in the 60s so it's kind of silly to ask this question. Given that many people think KC's debut was the first prog album that means that(to them at least) it was not only the best but just about the only one. I won't go quite that far ...


Nevertherless, this is one of the good answers to my question. Wink
I've learned from this knowledgeable group of folks we have created two new labels. True Prog and Real Prog.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote David_D Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 11 2023 at 07:27
Originally posted by AFlowerKingCrimson AFlowerKingCrimson wrote:

Imo, there was hardly any real prog in the 60s so it's kind of silly to ask this question. Given that many people think KC's debut was the first prog album that means that(to them at least) it was not only the best but just about the only one. I won't go quite that far ...

Nevertherless, this is one of the good answers to my question. Wink
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote David_D Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 11 2023 at 07:14
Originally posted by Jacob Schoolcraft Jacob Schoolcraft wrote:

The idea for certain bands to perform or record with an orchestra . ...although Procol Harum didn't feel or seem like Progressive Rock . Instrumentals like "Overture" and "Underture" from Tommy ..The Who seemed far more adventurous than anything Procol Harum could ever do. The fast snare drum rolls played by Keith Moon on "Underture " were more in the style of Carl Palmer and it was unlikely Procol Harum would sound anything close to that.

How about "In Held Twas in I"?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AFlowerKingCrimson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 10 2023 at 22:34
Imo, there was hardly any real prog in the 60s so it's kind of silly to ask this question. Given that many people think KC's debut was the first prog album that means that(to them at least) it was not only the best but just about the only one. I won't go quite that far but I still think it would be like asking for the best african prog keyboard players or something (and no I'm not being racist but just trying to make the point that there aren't many).

Edited by AFlowerKingCrimson - January 10 2023 at 22:37
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jacob Schoolcraft Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 10 2023 at 21:35
The Classical element in the Prog Psychedelic of the 60s soon felt dominating in the world of Progressive Rock in the 70s. In 67' Procol Harum were borrowing signature lines or actual pieces written by Classical composers to fuse with Rock. This gave the band a deep and dark sounding edge to their albums. The music and the lyricism of Keith Reid produced a distinctive style that began surfacing through Progressive Rock.

Of course this had already been a plan in motion with the Moody Blues. Bands like The Nice, Beggars Opera, Deep Purple, Lucifer's Friend, Argent, Rare Bird , Curved Air all had keyboardists that dominated the music by borrowing Classical music ..

The idea for certain bands to perform or record with an orchestra . ...although Procol Harum didn't feel or seem like Progressive Rock . Instrumentals like "Overture" and "Underture" from Tommy ..The Who seemed far more adventurous than anything Procol Harum could ever do. The fast snare drum rolls played by Keith Moon on "Underture " were more in the style of Carl Palmer and it was unlikely Procol Harum would sound anything close to that.

What was termed Art Rock then...imo..was derived from European Classical music and fused with Rock by the British. It contained elements of surprise and a unique combination of the two styles. I believe it inspired musicians in Italy, France, and Japan to follow that path of writing. Stomu Yamashta pursued that style working with Hugh Hopper and others of the Canterbury scene..although there probably wasn't a real scene. Realistically it was merely musicians shifting around. Different aspects in the writing style of Hatfield and the North, National Health, Egg, Gilgamesh, Gong, etc are reminiscent of early Frank Zappa.

...Certain American bands in the 60s were eclectic such as Electric Flag , C.T.A, but hardly ever fusing Classical pieces with Rock. That to me was the heart and soul of England. It inspired American musicians...a huge impact
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote richardh Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 10 2023 at 07:24
Originally posted by Grumpyprogfan Grumpyprogfan wrote:

Originally posted by Argentinfonico Argentinfonico wrote:

The Mothers of Invention without a doubt
Yep. Zappa had seven albums released in the 60's. How about the albums released by the big six of prog in the 60's? Floyd had four. Tull had two - first album was blues. Genesis had one. KC had one. Yes had one. ELP had zero.

Zappa was releasing records that had never been heard before, fusing all genres of music into something unheard of, new, and exciting. If the definition of progressive rock means to create music that is pushing boundaries, is not the popular stuff played on the radio, or the music does not have the repetitious verse - chorus - bridge - repeat - format. Zappa towers above any prog artist in the 60's.

Keith Emerson actually admitted that Zappa was a huge inspiration on a lot of musicians.

BTW ELP were formed in the seventies as you obviously know, but their previous bands the Nice, King Crimson, The Crazy World Of Arthur Brown and Atomic Rooster were all very significant in the late sixties prog/psyche scene.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote David_D Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 10 2023 at 04:24
Originally posted by David_D David_D wrote:

To all of you mentioning American artists, what connection do you see to the British Progressive Rock, or maybe just,
how do you see them to be a part of Progressive Rock?

In the case of Frank Zappa and The Mothers, I see stylistic similarities with the Canterbury Scene, and probably being the most important originators of '70s Avant-Prog. Besides that, I surely also think of them as a part of the '60s Counterculture. 


Edited by David_D - January 10 2023 at 13:02
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote David_D Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 09 2023 at 07:40

To all of you mentioning American artists, what connection do you see to the British Progressive Rock, or maybe just,
how do you see them to be a part of Progressive Rock?







Edited by David_D - January 09 2023 at 16:15
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cstack3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 09 2023 at 07:08
Originally posted by Atavachron Atavachron wrote:

^ Good argument to be made for them, both Cheerful Insanity and the Brondesbury comp are very significant--  'Tremolo Study A Major', 'Erudite Eyes', 'Suite No. 1', and of course an infant 'I Talk to he Wind'.

Underappreciated outfit, and in a way, the original King Crimson.


Thanks, mate, that's exactly how I feel about GG&F as well! Clap

I was gobsmacked by their early use of Mellotron, Fripp's very advanced guitar technique, and of course, the Giles brothers contributing.  I appreciate your comments!

Fripp's chordal work in this song blows my mind!  Plus, Mellotron! 


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote siLLy puPPy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 07 2023 at 18:05
Originally posted by omphaloskepsis omphaloskepsis wrote:

Most important album- King Crimson- ITCOTCK
Personal favorite? Jethro Tull
Most prolific and amazing during 60s? Miles Davis
All Around? Frank Zappa


Great way to put it.

Basically don't get hung up on categorization.

It's simply a tool to navigate complex systems.
 
NOT a be all, end all for musical enjoyment :)

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Atavachron Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 07 2023 at 17:44
^ Good argument to be made for them, both Cheerful Insanity and the Brondesbury comp are very significant--  'Tremolo Study A Major', 'Erudite Eyes', 'Suite No. 1', and of course an infant 'I Talk to he Wind'.

Underappreciated outfit, and in a way, the original King Crimson.

"Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought."   -- John F. Kennedy
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cstack3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 07 2023 at 16:27
Giles, Giles & Fripp. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote David_D Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 07 2023 at 14:24
Originally posted by enigmatic enigmatic wrote:

Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:

As far as progressive rock as we know it, it's ITCotCK by Crimson.

Finally someone who makes sense in this thread. 😀 Thank you SteveG!!!!

Well, I won't say I'm pissed off by that. Smile

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote enigmatic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 07 2023 at 13:35
Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:

As far as progressive rock as we know it, it's ITCotCK by Crimson.

Finally someone who makes sense in this thread. 😀 Thank you SteveG!!!!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote omphaloskepsis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 07 2023 at 13:09
Most important album- King Crimson- ITCOTCK
Personal favorite? Jethro Tull
Most prolific and amazing during 60s? Miles Davis
All Around? Frank Zappa
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SteveG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 07 2023 at 12:31
As far as progressive rock as we know it, it's ITCotCK by Crimson.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote David_D Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 07 2023 at 11:55

Have you missed pissing me off, Mosh?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jacob Schoolcraft Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 07 2023 at 10:48
Previously mentioned here were The Beatles and The Doors. It is odd to think back to those times and being exposed to that music through my sister. When I was 10, 11, and 12 my sister was trying to get me to pay attention to the lyricism. It was philosophical and cosmic. Several songs by The Beatles and The Doors were new to those times and I don't believe there were an abundance of bands doing that sort of thing until at least a year after The Beatles and The Doors. Keep in mind that the idea to pursue that style became a major foundation for Progressive Rock regarding concept albums.

Jefferson Airplane released Crown Of Creation I believe in 68' and it was an influential album. There are electronics used on that album or perhaps strange sound effects. A style later pursued by Curved Air. The song "Lather" is very much like a Syd Barrett song in several detailed comparisons. It could have been accidental that it sounded like one of his songs. ..or the answer was simply that Barrett listened to Jefferson Airplane. If you put it out of your head that Grace Slick is singing it and try to imagine Barrett singing it instead it all falls into place.

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