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When did u not only "get", but actually love VDGG?
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Gramonster View Drop Down
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I think it was around late 1991 or early 1992, I was 17 at the time and was already a Pink Floyd, Yes & Genesis fan, and becoming a King Crimson one (I already had In the Court & Red at the fall of 1991). I also loved the psychedelic era of the Beatles, Hendrix, Doors (being able to appreciate weird pieces such as The Celebration of the Lizard). A friend lent me an incomplete cassette copy of The Least We Can Do, only containing the first side + a curious personnal edit of After the Flood (the part between 3'23" and 8'13" if I remember well), and this was my first contact with VDGG. I think I "got it" since the first time I heard Darkness and was already in love at the end of White Hammer. I was into hard rock and metal before I turned into prog, so I guess it trained me to be able to appreciate the contrasts between the softer moments and the heavier, darker ones, so I liked every tracks but even more White Hammer & the After the Flood edit. My next step was H to He, where Pioneers Over C. became my favorite song, then I bought the compilation First Generation, the first CD I saw in a shop, which included Man-Erg & A Plague of Lighthouse Keepers, which only raised my love of the band to an even higher level. Pawn Hearts remains my favorite album to this day but there's not any that I don't like. I loved their sound since the start and was amazed by the level of agressivity they were able to reach with (almost) no electric guitar involved! So good memories of magical times!

Edited by Gramonster - November 17 2020 at 04:04
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I don't mind the voice at all, yet Sleepwalkers remains the only song I like, despite numerous attempts. One problem is that amounts of vocals are too high. 

Edited by Homotopy - November 17 2020 at 02:25
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Originally posted by Blacksword Blacksword wrote:

^^ 2 stars for Pawn Hearts!  

You get used to that with Paul LOL. He'll give something you find a 2.5 a 4.5 Cool. Nothing but love for Paul! Smile

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I did get into VdGG until after I had come to know and, mostly, love the usual big ones of prog. I did know that I might need time to get these bands, since it happened already with the Yes, Genesis, and so on. It took me a while to decide to get some VdGG, since by the description it sounded like something I wouldn't like (I was not too keen of the idea of sax centered, since I was not really a fan of schizoid sax playing... thinking exactly about Schizoid Man from King Crimson)... but then, somehow, I though I should give them a try, so I ordered on Amazon their highest rated albums, from The Least We Can Do to Still Life, without having heard just about anything from them... when I got them and gave them my first listen, I did think I might have overdone my self at last and just wasted that amount of money on something I couldn't like... but then, fortunatley, there was Darkness on the first album I was listening, and that did click with me soon enough, and I did come on finding awsome songs on the rest of the album. So, I do like them very much, and I do love and admire Hamill's vocals for what they are... I think he could be one of the greatest singers one could listen to if he had gone the obvious way and sang more harmonically, but he just went the other way and did the unexpected, and still I think he is one of the greatest singers around, yet it's much more difficult for people to appreciate him for what he does.
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Points: 26138 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HolyMoly Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 16 2020 at 18:37
Took me about 20 years to “get” them. Diving into P Hammill’s discography helped. Once you buy into the Hammill schtick, then you can truly enjoy VdGG
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Originally posted by PioneersOverC PioneersOverC wrote:

I'm in my late 30s, and got into progressive rock in highschool-college. Sort of as a continuation of the more interesting side of classic rock that was on the radio. It was all available at the same time via the internet so I pretty much just started with the more well-known acts in the US (Yes, Crimson, Genesis, Floyd, Tull) and worked my way out. When I got to the less well-known stuff like Gentle Giant and Van der Graaf, they *really* resonated with me. In fact, I would say those are probably my two favorite non-Canturbury UK progressive bands. 

I've continued to work my way out into more and more obscure stuff (luckily there's so much good progressive rock out there) but I often return to Gentle Giant and VDGG. Their catalogs are both deep and there's so much nuance in their records they still feel fresh after 10-15 years of listening. 

That said, I totally see how they might not resonate with others. Neither build their core sound on instrumentation common in rock music and very few hooks draw you in like the more popular bands I mentioned above. Plus VDGG is more often than not very abrasive and discordant and Gentle Giant is complex and layered to an almost exhausting degree, not to mention their medieval/renaissance music influence. 

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Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:

VDGG and Gentle Giant are a bridge too far for me. After all these years, that bridge probably collapsed too.

Clapwell said ---I'll second that emotion--lol.

Although--I do love Freehand from beginning to end---no VDGG album I love.


Edited by twosteves - November 16 2020 at 20:28
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Points: 1 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote PioneersOverC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 16 2020 at 15:07
I'm in my late 30s, and got into progressive rock in highschool-college. Sort of as a continuation of the more interesting side of classic rock that was on the radio. It was all available at the same time via the internet so I pretty much just started with the more well-known acts in the US (Yes, Crimson, Genesis, Floyd, Tull) and worked my way out. When I got to the less well-known stuff like Gentle Giant and Van der Graaf, they *really* resonated with me. In fact, I would say those are probably my two favorite non-Canturbury UK progressive bands. 

I've continued to work my way out into more and more obscure stuff (luckily there's so much good progressive rock out there) but I often return to Gentle Giant and VDGG. Their catalogs are both deep and there's so much nuance in their records they still feel fresh after 10-15 years of listening. 

That said, I totally see how they might not resonate with others. Neither build their core sound on instrumentation common in rock music and very few hooks draw you in like the more popular bands I mentioned above. Plus VDGG is more often than not very abrasive and discordant and Gentle Giant is complex and layered to an almost exhausting degree, not to mention their medieval/renaissance music influence. 


Edited by PioneersOverC - November 16 2020 at 15:14
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Points: 46833 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote micky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 16 2020 at 14:46
like Doc.. I get them..  the way only a few truly have

but can't love them.. no f**king way... they were the fathers of mediocre prog..  
prog for prog's sake.. 
where the trapping of prog were substituted for talent and creativity.. and thus cursing the whole genre of prog from thereafter haha
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I'm the opposite as in I had no trouble 'getting' VDGG straight off. The first time I heard them (Pawn Hearts) I was gob-smacked at how good they were. Afterwards I readily took in all their albums, and I still love Pawn Hearts, but more so Godbluff. I really like Peter Hamill's voice too, he manages to put so much emotion in to his singing.

As for the other 'problem' band mentioned, Gentle Giant, I started Octopus a few times and just couldn't get past the start of the first track. I had to make myself listen, but I'm glad I did as I love them as much as I do VDGG.
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I 'get them'.....don't love them.
I do have all of the original cd's up to  World Record and several original pieces of vinyl....some good prog here and there, also some mediocre stuff imho.
Always thought Hammill was too over emotive , but I do like much of the music itself.
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In 1976, a friend introduced me to the band with Pawn Hearts. My appreciation for the album was formidable, especially knowing that Fripp was onboard for the occasion, bit I was still reticent to give the Van der Graafs my full attention. Then I picked up 1977's The Quiet Zone/The Pleasure Dome, and it became a regular option in my listening schedule for the summer. Not their greatest work (that's been already mentioned), but it was enjoyable what Hammill and company did with a reworked version of the group. I've been hooked ever since.
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I've never had a problem with Peter Hammill's voice, and find it perplexing that so many people do.
 
 
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Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:

VDGG and Gentle Giant are a bridge too far for me. After all these years, that bridge probably collapsed too.

VdGG stands for Virtually degenerate Gentle Giant. Or so I've heard.
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VDGG and Gentle Giant are a bridge too far for me. After all these years, that bridge probably collapsed too.
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It's interesting that many people have this kind of experience that VDGG is hard to get into. Also for me they needed some time... not that much actually, but I surely didn't get Hammill's voice in the beginning, I thought he is annoying, and I also later come to love it.

Before I heard VDGG I actually heard Hammill solo on German TV (in Eberhard Schoener's Rock&Classic Night, which featured all kinds of musicians who used rock and classical elements of some kind). I found the music... interesting... not what I was expecting, but I was open for strange things already at the time. It didn't grab me initially but I made a mark that this is maybe something to explore, except that voice... next step was I bought a cheap sampler of VDGG's early years on the flea market, which had songs like "Killer" and "Necromancer". The music on that one convinced me immediately but I needed a few spins to get into the voice... not sure, I didn't listen to it several times with the "plan" to get the voice, rather the album wanted me to play it again and again and at some point I realised that I find his voice now really quite expressive and interesting, rather than annoying. Then I got The Quiet Zone/The Pleasure Dome, and the strange mix of that one put me back to square one initially, "interesting music but it sounds so strange and the vocals oh the vocals". But at this point I was "advanced" enough to get it at the second or third spin - still my favourite VDGG album now but the mix is really strange.

And it continued, pretty much every VDGG album got me alienated at first spin just to convince at the second or third one... except I never got into World Record and Godbluff. (Probably taking more time...?)
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Originally posted by Sean Trane Sean Trane wrote:

I suppose you know that your username is firstly the best part of Lighthouse Keeper?
 
After all these years, I still haven't decided which is the best part of "A Plague of Lighthouse Keepers". I am quite fond of VdGG cacophonies, of which there are two in "A Plague of Lighthouse Keepers", so these moments are extra special to me. But there are many other parts that I love.
 
I think my favourite lyric is "You'll begin to wonder if the points of all the ancients myths are solemnly directed straight at you.", although the imagery of "I feel I am drowning - hands stretch in the dark." does move me.
 
As for my username, it wasn't my first choice. My first choice was "A Lighthouse Keeper", but it was already taken. But even though my username wasn't my first choice, I do think it was an inspired choice. As I mentioned in my previous post, I had a compilation CD called "I Prophesy Disaster", the name of which I knew came from "A Plague of Lighthouse Keepers", so my username was a double reference, as well as being grammatically different from typical usernames.
 
 
 
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Originally posted by someone_else someone_else wrote:

VdGG is an acquired taste, hardly less than the vocals of their frontman.

I first got into VdGG in 1987. The only album I really liked back then was Godbluff (and Peter Hammill's solo album Chamaeleon in the Shadow of the Night), and the song Man-erg off Pawn Hearts. When I heard Childlike Faith in Childhood's End for the first time, in 2004 or 2005 on PA's mp3 streaming, my interest in them got a new boost. Since then their music started to grow on me to full appreciation; later on I came to appreciate PH's vocals as well.

Still Life is a top 20 album for me.



Actually, the first song that really struck me and allowed me to enter their world (Get Into, GrumpyWink) wax also Undercover Man (when I saw the Godbluff Live film, I was completely hypnotized, like a rabbit in the night is on the road by car headlights).  The construction of that album is really intelligent, going systematically one step firther with every new track.  So I really got into the second era of the classic line-up (74-76) before the firt era (70-72)

Originally posted by I prophesy disaster I prophesy disaster wrote:

Well, one doesn't have the username "I prophesy disaster", an avatar that is the album cover of "Time Vaults", and a signature that says "I was thinking about thinking but it really didn't get me very far", without being more than a little obsessed about Van der Graaf Generator. 
It was only on PA that I discovered the modern era of VdGG music, of which my favourite is "A Grounding in Numbers".
 


I suppose you know that your username is firstly the best part of Lighthouse Keeper?

TBH, I saw VDGG the first time on stage for the Trisector album tour and twice since, but for me, it's clearly Trisector that wins hands down in their post-70's albums.




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Originally posted by Grumpyprogfan Grumpyprogfan wrote:

^So this is the pre-liking of a band, something your not sure about?   

the way I see it, once you start enjoying something, there is the possibility of growth to the point of loving it. If that makes sense. EmbarrassedTongue
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^So this is the pre-liking of a band, something your not sure about?   
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