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Immediate Ruination of New Music?
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hieronymous View Drop Down
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Points: 308 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote hieronymous Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 22 2018 at 10:15
I try to be positive rather than negative, but I actually think this is interesting and I appreciate that you recognize that this is about subjective like/dislike vs. the objective good/bad that is so common.

I'm with you - mediocre vocals/lyrics definitely ruin some music for me. In my experience it's been with '70s jazz/rock fusion. For instance, post-Al Di Meola Return to Forever, or some of the solo albums of the classic fusion musicians. 

But I try not to limit myself to my first impression - it can take a few listens to get used to.
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wiz_d_kidd View Drop Down
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Points: 1444 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wiz_d_kidd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 22 2018 at 09:39
Originally posted by moshkito moshkito wrote:

But really, since you and I are not doing it, why are we being critical about someone else doing it? Would you enjoy that comment?


Being a practitioner of an art is not a requirement for liking or disliking someone else's output.
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Points: 1444 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wiz_d_kidd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 22 2018 at 09:26
Originally posted by chopper chopper wrote:

I have heard some new prog bands where I haven't liked the vocals but then what you consider to be "ho-hum" vocals may be brilliant to someone else. You can't expect a band not to post their music just in case someone doesn't like the vocals.


I never said that.  All I am saying is there is music I like, and music I dislike. And I pointed out one of the main reasons why I dislike something.  I made NO comment about whether the music was good, bad, or otherwise.  Simply that "I" dislike it.  You may love it.  Great!  Buy it and listen to it.

Aren't there features of music that you dislike?  And upon hearing them in something new, you quickly dismiss it move on to something else?  Or do you force yourself to keep listening, even though it is grating on your nerves?
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chopper View Drop Down
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Points: 20032 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote chopper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 22 2018 at 08:45
I have heard some new prog bands where I haven't liked the vocals but then what you consider to be "ho-hum" vocals may be brilliant to someone else. You can't expect a band not to post their music just in case someone doesn't like the vocals.
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moshkito View Drop Down
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Points: 17995 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote moshkito Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 22 2018 at 08:31
Hi,

I find this strange. Mostly because something of the nature that you speak, is not about the "art" of it all, the band and the individuals, but about your "likes" and "dislikes".

It does not matter who the artist is, let's say Picasso, with 1001 paintings, and you and I both will say that that one is crap, and that one ... you call that a painting? ... and so on, but in the end, IN ITS TOTALITY, you can sit there, and eventually say ... got to admit, not my preference, but one heck of an artist and he did a lot.

I think, sometimes, that we are too far apart from the music and these bands, and we do not understand them. You should have heard the wording about Gentle Giant in 1972, 1973 and such, when around my roomate and friend, there were people saying things like ... that's horrible vocals ... because they wanted to hear rock'n'roll lyrics and not some supposedly Rabelais'ian piece with modern school vocals that rock STILL has not used or worked with well enough for people to get more familiar with extremely different things in music. And rock music is the simplest form, and the one that has expanded the least from a point of view of possibilities and comparatively speaking to other arts!

I'm sure that many people did the same thing to Stravinsky. Or Bartok. Or Orff (specially his lyrics for Carmina Burana ... go check those out! That's why your symphony, or rock band, will never do it, btw!

Of the 2K CD's I have, and still 1500 LP's and going back to the beginning of my psychedelic/weird/off kilter/crazy/weird/experimental collection, there are a lot of things that you can shake your head at, be it Roy Harper standing there on the loo, or Kevin Ayers throwing up in the kitchen, or RW/RG doing their song, but all in all, for me, it is just a part of life and the one thing that no one got in the White Album when John and Paul just walked down the street with the microphone turned on, and every one thought it was just crap!

It wasn't crap ... it was life!

Now, lyrics I might agree with you, since I'm not exactly one to like vapid and vacuous rock music lyrics that supposedly mean something and in the end, they don't. I won't even discuss LZ because they are everyone's lyrical darling and best example of what "lyrics" are supposed to be like ... but I like the differences and the wild ones. AD2 is wild with lyrics. Banco's singing is an acquired taste that eventually just melts in your heart. Ange in their early days (up to Tome VI), was the same and very theatrical, something that only Peter Hammill can do well, and everyone else wonders how can he do that? It's not about the doing that ... it's the context that it is set next to that specifies the strength of the whole thing.

But really, since you and I are not doing it, why are we being critical about someone else doing it? Would you enjoy that comment?


Edited by moshkito - March 22 2018 at 08:33
Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
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wiz_d_kidd View Drop Down
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Points: 1444 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wiz_d_kidd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 22 2018 at 07:47
Imagine you've just read a review of a band you've never heard before.  The description sounds intriguing, and you have every reason to believe that you will like it.  So you cruise on over to YouTube, Bandcamp, Amazon, CD Baby, or the band's website to listen to some samples.  The first piece you listen to starts off well, and you're getting into it.  "This is great stuff!" you think.  Then something happens that makes you go "Ugh!, they just ruined it for me!".  What was that?  What is your big turn-off that makes you immediately reject new music?

For me, it's the appearance of gratuitous, mediocre vocals.  If a piece starts off with nice proggy instrumentation, then all of a sudden, someone decides they have to open their mouths and sing, as if it is "required", and their vocals are just ho-hum, mediocre (even thought the singer thinks they are the greatest vocalist in the history of the universe).

There are other characteristics in music that I don't care for, but the appearance of those dad-blasted unnecessary vocals will send me reaching for the reject button faster than anything else!  Immediate ruination!

You?
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