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Frenetic Zetetic
Forum Senior Member
Joined: December 09 2017
Location: Now
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Points: 9233
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Posted: December 22 2017 at 02:21 |
I'd consider them essential to a well-rounded prog diet 
They are indeed from Scotland, so IDK how popular this music is there, but in the UK you'd think they'd have SOME following back in the day. I can see the internet helping them now more than ever; it honestly just proves their art is timeless and transcends generations.
As someone who also plays fretless bass in several fusion outfits, I can say that bands like GG, YES, KC, etc all really prove their prowess through how limited recording techniques were back then. You HAD to be tight or no go. Time = $$$!!!
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richardh
Prog Reviewer
Joined: February 18 2004
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 29607
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Posted: December 21 2017 at 17:01 |
The Power And The Glory is my favourite by them. Precision musical engineering! The early albums have some beautiful moments but they don't really hang together that well for me. It's a bit like comparing ELP's debut to Brain Salad Surgery. I prefer it when ELP went up a gear and the same is largely true of how I feel about GG.
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dr wu23
Forum Senior Member
Joined: August 22 2010
Location: Indiana
Status: Offline
Points: 20671
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Posted: December 21 2017 at 13:05 |
Dellinger said: " I like Gentle Giant well enough, but mostly their first 2 albums, and after Phil Shulman left I just lost them. Actually, the first album I bought from them was the live Playing the Fool (since it's got such flawless reviews, and I often buy live albums first to get a good overview of the bands songs up to that point, without the risk of repeating the exact same songs (in the exact same version) in case I decide to start buying albums from them. However, I just couldn't (and still can't) understand Playing the Fool, and I thought I just wouldn't be able to get into them... I just couldn't find the beautiful melodies or hooks I wanted on an album. But somehow I was persuaded to give them a second chance, and I went for their first 4 albums (I remembered hearing Octopus on Youtube, and finding it promising, and from Playing the Fool, the one song I did like a lot was "Funny Ways", from the first album. However, I ended up loving their first 2 albums, but 3 friends started showing the aspects that I did not like on PtF (and had less of the aspects I did like from the first 2), and Octopus does have some songs I like, but also is not at the same level as the first 2. However, I don't expect to go further into their discography, and given a few listens I have given to some of the albums from after Phil left, I don't expect to change my mind."
I have to agree with this ....and while I own the first 8 (and do play them from time to time...) , the first 2 are still my favorites. Very talented musicians with clever arrangements but imho missing some heart on many tracks that end up coming off as accomplished but ultimately unsatisfying. It seemed to me at times that they almost went out of their way to be eclectic and quirky to impress people but missed the fact that that could also turn people off.
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One does nothing yet nothing is left undone. Haquin
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presdoug
Forum Senior Member
Joined: January 24 2010
Location: Canada
Status: Offline
Points: 8780
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Posted: December 21 2017 at 11:35 |
Big Gentle Giant fan here; I have all of their albums, and like every one of them. Though not structurally like Triumvirat, they formed and disbanded at around the same time, and despite that, continue to turn heads with their initial second tier popularity helping them to ride the tide, despite all those years!
Edited by presdoug - December 21 2017 at 11:44
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Icarium
Forum Senior Member
VIP Member
Joined: March 21 2008
Location: Tigerstaden
Status: Offline
Points: 34086
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Posted: December 21 2017 at 11:22 |
it seem like The Zombies, Gentle Giant cought more believrs and fans after their active periode, while Thr zombies lied down ther oars after 68 have found new strength now in the 2017s they are healthier then ever.
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AFlowerKingCrimson
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 02 2016
Location: Philly burbs
Status: Offline
Points: 18995
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Posted: December 21 2017 at 11:01 |
It's interesting how someone on another thread on here was suggesting that Gentle Giant were not that influential or important in the seventies and that they seem influential now just because of the internet. It turns out the person who said this is apparently from the UK so I'm guessing that they weren't that big in their home country. Still, I can't see how anyone can think they "weren't that important."
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Frenetic Zetetic
Forum Senior Member
Joined: December 09 2017
Location: Now
Status: Offline
Points: 9233
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Posted: December 21 2017 at 10:18 |
Amazing post Frankh, thank you for sharing!
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AFlowerKingCrimson
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 02 2016
Location: Philly burbs
Status: Offline
Points: 18995
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Posted: December 21 2017 at 09:52 |
Frank H, I find it odd that GG were opening for Renaissance at that time. However, I see you are from upstate NY and if you were there at the time I can sort of understand it because apparently Renaissance were very big up there back then. I even mentioned this to Annie when I met her once and she confirmed that. For whatever reason they had a big following up there.
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Frankh
Forum Senior Member
Joined: September 14 2017
Location: Schenectady NY
Status: Offline
Points: 214
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Posted: December 21 2017 at 04:01 |
Error, lol.
See above ^
Edited by Frankh - December 21 2017 at 22:24
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Perhaps finding the happy medium is harder than we know.
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Frankh
Forum Senior Member
Joined: September 14 2017
Location: Schenectady NY
Status: Offline
Points: 214
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Posted: December 21 2017 at 04:00 |
Had the incredible pleasure of catching Gentle Giant twice live, about months apart in what I believe was late 1976 and mid - 1977.
The first show, opening for Annie Haslam and Rennaissance. Prior to this my friends laughed at my predilection. They inquired delicately, "What the hell is this!?" Demanding and derisive.
The first record that fell into my hands was The Power And The Glory and even I, myself initially doubted. Next was Freehand. Then, In A Glass House, procured through my connection at the record store, because at that time it was only available in Europe.
Doubts dissipated. Playing The Fool.
It was one thing listening to the warped little 2 and a half minute studio piece So Sincere, and completely another thing the epic 13 minute monstrous live version. This was where the true genius of the band lay hidden. In order to fully comprehend, you had to see them. You had to catch them live.
It took their roadies about forty minutes to set up all the instrumentation the band were to employ that night, and one had to remind oneself that this was the OPENING BAND. What they did that night I don't think they could do these days. Openers are not given this kind of leeway. They aren't supposed to blow the headliner off the stage, nor are they to be afforded the opportunity.
The set list was Freehand era and resembled very much the content of Playing The Fool, less the Interview material and sadly no So Sincere. But, I will never forget this show.
Highlights were Kerry Minnear's vibes on Funny Ways(a blur!), actually Kerry Minnear on everything. Cello. And especially the keys, firing chords off like he was typing a letter 250 words a minute. Probably the best keyboard player I have ever or will ever witness. Ray's violin, but especially his bass. You were so right about these two. All of them less JP singing On Reflection. JP so solid and somehow funky behind the kit.
My friends never had sport with my predilection, again.
The second show was hot, too but not as much as that first. They headlined with Dr. Feelgood opening.
Poor, lovely Annie Haslam. She and Rennaissance never knew what hit them. She showed alot of class as people shouted, "GIANT!!!" at her for the rest of the night.
Unforgettable. And now, 41 years ago. It had to have been unforgettable for me to recall any of it, now all these decades and all those drugs later.
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Perhaps finding the happy medium is harder than we know.
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Frenetic Zetetic
Forum Senior Member
Joined: December 09 2017
Location: Now
Status: Offline
Points: 9233
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Posted: December 21 2017 at 02:22 |
WOW this thread blew up! Thank you all so much for your kind words and welcome! Honestly, I waffled on making this thread; good thing I did!
Rednight wrote:
As witnessed in your avatar, you know your 'Giant well. Their best. |
Thank you sir. I've recently received the Steve Wilson/Alucard remasters after years of terrible rips and non-official copies kicking around. They've all been on repeat for some time now. In a Glass House is arguably the best track on said record, and it MIGHT be the single-best GG track of all-time. Dat groove riff!
YESESIS wrote:
Frenetic Zetetic wrote:
Gentle Giant very well may be the best band on the planet Earth. |
1000% agree with this. There are a few bands I'm slightly uneasy about putting them ahead of, *cough* Yes *cough* Genesis.. But if anyone puts GG at the very top I will not argue with them.. they're that %$#% good.
Frenetic Zetetic wrote:
I know so few who can enjoy and appreciate the beauty, complexity and intricacy of this incredible band! |
Oh I can appreciate it lol, to me they're one of the very best prog music artists ever. I mean on a REALLY short list.
Welcome and.. way to join and make an immediate impact! Hats off to you Sir.
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Lol thank you good sir! As I said I was a bit hesitant but maybe my personal passion and love for GG transferred well to my prog brethren here on PA!
AFlowerKingCrimson wrote:
Barbu wrote:
and even better than the mighty Crim. |
About the same for me. I like both a lot but probably prefer VDGG and Camel to either one.
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It's very hard to top CC, but I think GG just might be that ONE BAND that manages to do so. VDGG is godly prog rock of the upper echelons.
Dellinger wrote:
I like Gentle Giant well enough, but mostly their first 2 albums, and after Phil Shulman left I just lost them. Actually, the first album I bought from them was the live Playing the Fool (since it's got such flawless reviews, and I often buy live albums first to get a good overview of the bands songs up to that point, without the risk of repeating the exact same songs (in the exact same version) in case I decide to start buying albums from them. However, I just couldn't (and still can't) understand Playing the Fool, and I thought I just wouldn't be able to get into them... I just couldn't find the beautiful melodies or hooks I wanted on an album. But somehow I was persuaded to give them a second chance, and I went for their first 4 albums (I remembered hearing Octopus on Youtube, and finding it promising, and from Playing the Fool, the one song I did like a lot was "Funny Ways", from the first album. However, I ended up loving their first 2 albums, but 3 friends started showing the aspects that I did not like on PtF (and had less of the aspects I did like from the first 2), and Octopus does have some songs I like, but also is not at the same level as the first 2. However, I don't expect to go further into their discography, and given a few listens I have given to some of the albums from after Phil left, I don't expect to change my mind. |
I find myself enjoying the stuff with Phil more and more these days. His input on Octopus, both vocals and sax, are immense. I love his lines during "River"; "…And the rain that's caught in its flow…"
Walkscore wrote:
I think the point about GG being "more head than heart" has some relevance. I think as they innovated in the early 1970s they attempted to take music farther than it had yet gone, and in doing so wrote some complex music that worked sometimes but not other times, and indeed, veered into the pretentious at times. When I listen to their discography I see a kind-of arc. They began very musical but less complex, became more complex and innovative but often less musical (the pinnacle of this is Octopus), and then gradually became more musical again, culminating (for me) with their most musical album, Free Hand (more musical, but perhaps less ground-breaking than Octopus, Glass House, etc). |
Interesting view point! I think their complexity, especially on later albums like TPATG and Free Hand, beliles their creativity. There's just so much going on that it's actually not any less musical, it's just harder to hear where it all "lines up". The massive time changes aren't for the feint of heart for sure! It's interesting to hear people praise Octopus for being groundbreaking when I always felt In a Glass House through Free Hand is where the real magic happened!
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Tom Ozric
Prog Reviewer
Joined: September 03 2005
Location: Olympus Mons
Status: Offline
Points: 15926
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Posted: December 21 2017 at 00:10 |
^ Well said, Chris !!
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Icarium
Forum Senior Member
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Joined: March 21 2008
Location: Tigerstaden
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Points: 34086
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Posted: December 20 2017 at 23:52 |
When one prises John Weather it really strengthen my will to ahil the late drummer Martin Smitt whom played on the debute and Aquired the Taste, whom ile like to admit is one of the slickest drummers. Whom to me had more jazz flair and floated very well. Whom seemlesly floated on technical songs like The House the Room the Street. Not eluding Malcolm but Smidt is overly overlooked and out of respect zoom into hes slickness of playing.
Edited by Icarium - December 20 2017 at 23:53
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Tom Ozric
Prog Reviewer
Joined: September 03 2005
Location: Olympus Mons
Status: Offline
Points: 15926
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Posted: December 20 2017 at 22:46 |
Gentle Giant have been / always will be, one of my long time favourite Prog bands. Cannot rave on enough about them !! Any ‘ranting’ is welcome
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Logan
Forum & Site Admin Group
Site Admin
Joined: April 05 2006
Location: Vancouver, BC
Status: Offline
Points: 37519
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Posted: December 20 2017 at 21:10 |
I like Acquiring the Taste the most, but I do enjoy GG's first eight studio albums. Gentle Giant and Premiata Forneria Marconi were my favourite bands when I joined this site as I recall. At one time I thought GG greater than I now do, but at that time I hadn't explored much "progressive" music/styles outside of Symphonic Prog, and the more music I explored the less I thought so. Anyway, I think GG was a good stepping zone for me to readily get into Rock in Opposition bands, Zeuhl and other music.
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Walkscore
Forum Senior Member
Joined: February 16 2017
Location: Toronto, Canada
Status: Offline
Points: 231
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Posted: December 20 2017 at 20:49 |
I think the point about GG being "more head than heart" has some relevance. I think as they innovated in the early 1970s they attempted to take music farther than it had yet gone, and in doing so wrote some complex music that worked sometimes but not other times, and indeed, veered into the pretentious at times. When I listen to their discography I see a kind-of arc. They began very musical but less complex, became more complex and innovative but often less musical (the pinnacle of this is Octopus), and then gradually became more musical again, culminating (for me) with their most musical album, Free Hand (more musical, but perhaps less ground-breaking than Octopus, Glass House, etc).
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Dellinger
Forum Senior Member
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Joined: June 18 2009
Location: Mexico
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Points: 12816
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Posted: December 20 2017 at 20:44 |
I like Gentle Giant well enough, but mostly their first 2 albums, and after Phil Shulman left I just lost them. Actually, the first album I bought from them was the live Playing the Fool (since it's got such flawless reviews, and I often buy live albums first to get a good overview of the bands songs up to that point, without the risk of repeating the exact same songs (in the exact same version) in case I decide to start buying albums from them. However, I just couldn't (and still can't) understand Playing the Fool, and I thought I just wouldn't be able to get into them... I just couldn't find the beautiful melodies or hooks I wanted on an album. But somehow I was persuaded to give them a second chance, and I went for their first 4 albums (I remembered hearing Octopus on Youtube, and finding it promising, and from Playing the Fool, the one song I did like a lot was "Funny Ways", from the first album. However, I ended up loving their first 2 albums, but 3 friends started showing the aspects that I did not like on PtF (and had less of the aspects I did like from the first 2), and Octopus does have some songs I like, but also is not at the same level as the first 2. However, I don't expect to go further into their discography, and given a few listens I have given to some of the albums from after Phil left, I don't expect to change my mind.
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AFlowerKingCrimson
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 02 2016
Location: Philly burbs
Status: Offline
Points: 18995
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Posted: December 20 2017 at 20:18 |
Barbu wrote:
and even better than the mighty Crim. |
About the same for me. I like both a lot but probably prefer VDGG and Camel to either one.
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AFlowerKingCrimson
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 02 2016
Location: Philly burbs
Status: Offline
Points: 18995
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Posted: December 20 2017 at 20:17 |
Great band. They apparently are on the cover of the latest edition of PROG magazine. I hope that that gives them exposure to a wider(and younger)audience who is currently slobbering over Opeth and Steven Wilson.
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Barbu
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Joined: October 09 2005
Location: infinity
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Points: 30855
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Posted: December 20 2017 at 19:42 |
and even better than the mighty Crim.
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