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Joined: April 29 2006
Location: Atlantais
Status: Offline
Points: 29630
Posted: August 30 2009 at 08:54
Epignosis wrote:
Doctors in the US are essentially private businessmen. They go to school and have to foot the bill themselves (grants aside) like most anyone else. They have to invest money in beginning a practice. Etc.
What if, for whatever reason, people no longer decided to become physicians and nurses anymore? Folks just decided the field isn't profitable enough to get into (or wasn't interesting- again, whatever reason).
Well, enjoy your next career as a Wal-Mart greeter or a fast food employee. Seriously it must be nice to have the luxury to be able invest all that time and money in a career and just quit.
v v v
Edited by Slartibartfast - August 30 2009 at 12:47
I've written novels from time to time, and this subject always made me wonder...
Doctors in the US are essentially private businessmen. They go to school and have to foot the bill themselves (grants aside) like most anyone else. They have to invest money in beginning a practice. Etc.
What if, for whatever reason, people no longer decided to become physicians and nurses anymore? Folks just decided the field isn't profitable enough to get into (or wasn't interesting- again, whatever reason).
What would our government's course of action be in such a scenario (especially with a national health care system)? Institute a mandatory draft in which certain people are forced into medical school?
Just one of those weird "what if" ideas that came to me.
Joined: June 22 2004
Location: England
Status: Offline
Points: 16130
Posted: August 30 2009 at 08:05
Universal healthcare is a no brainer in a civilised society, I would have thought...
Having grown up with the NHS, and having had short spells in hospitals over the years for trivial things, I have no complants about the service. The treatment my father recieved while dying with Cancer was `second to none. The same goes for my mother after she had a stroke. I've no complaints.
That f***ing Tory d!ckhead who recently went to the States and scared the sh!t out of the American people by running down the NHS, making reference to all the horror stories of people giving birth or dying on trolleys in the UK, should be strung up by his nuts and shot to ribbons! Take my word for it, please dont believe a single word that comes out of the mouth of any UK politican, especially a puffed little Tory sh!thead.
Bear this in mind; you will only ever hear the horror stories. Good news is no news as far as the media is concerned, and busy city hospitals in the US will have their own horror stories, under the current system. The NHS serves a huge population and is the one last institution that the British can be truly proud of.
Joined: December 31 2008
Location: Charlottesville
Status: Offline
Points: 485
Posted: August 30 2009 at 02:46
Obviously the question is not specific enough, but you guys are oversimplifying the discussion with your arguments. Pretty much everyone believes that all people have the right to some degree of health care, but the argument is how much is everyone entitled to. I kind of took the poll question of "universal healthcare" to mean the best possible care for everyone, though that may not have been how it was intended.
Joined: October 21 2007
Location: n/a
Status: Offline
Points: 8052
Posted: August 29 2009 at 22:05
Was just reading the Madoff trial sentencing transcript (incredibly funny and hysterical at times)... but anyway, a point that came up a few times was that people who'd lost their incomes, pensions, etc. with Madoff found themselves worrying about health insurance, their partners' health insurance and so on... now, at the same time you've got the stress of a financial crisis on you, you don't want that.
Now, that's a problem that I think exists with pretending that leaving people to forage for their own healthcare plans is fine.
Joined: March 12 2005
Location: Neurotica
Status: Offline
Points: 166178
Posted: August 29 2009 at 21:13
Yes.
Dig me...But don't...Bury me I'm running still, I shall until, one day, I hope that I'll arrive Warning: Listening to jazz excessively can cause a laxative effect.
Joined: July 24 2008
Location: Big Muddy
Status: Offline
Points: 5208
Posted: August 29 2009 at 20:50
Because it's a no brainer. Extremely logical, smart, and heartless people with different viewpoints from mine are using extremely emotional, not-so-smart folks to do their dirty work for them. If they could win in a real debate they might try.
You are quite a fine person, and I am very fond of you. But you are only quite a little fellow, in a wide world, after all.
Joined: December 31 2008
Location: Charlottesville
Status: Offline
Points: 485
Posted: August 29 2009 at 20:20
Negoba wrote:
This is a no-brainer. Yes.
But there are fools wiggling on the private insurers hooks and swallowing it whole. Makes you ashamed to be an American sometimes.
Of course, everyone on the other side must be fooled by some trickery, no logical person could possibly hold another viewpoint from you.
It does bother me a lot though that in the current health care debate in the US the republicans and opponents of the health care bill are just trying to spread lies and scare people instead of raising what I believe are legitimate problems with it.
Joined: February 01 2007
Location: Australia
Status: Offline
Points: 5291
Posted: August 29 2009 at 19:19
We Have a Healthcare system in Australia and if any government tried to remove it and replace it with a fully private Health System they would be thrown out. We pay at the last time I remembered is 0.75 percent Tax on your gross income. Now I will admit the public hospitals are not perfect but compared to most places in the world they are fabulous.
Whatever treatment you receive in a public hospital in Australia it is free from a Heart Transplant to an in grown toe-nail. If you are involved in an accident or are seriously unwell you will be taken to a major Public Hospital for treatment as they have the equipment ,Intensive care units etc.
You still have the choice of Private Health insurance and I will admit it is advisable because if you require an operation that is not considered life threatening you could wind up on a waitintg list for 6 months. The goverment pays a 30% rebate back to you with private health insurance. You are up for $500.00 dollars if you require an overnigtht stay or more in a private hospital and they only charge you the $500 excess once per financial year no matter how many times you are in and out. I pay over $5,000 per annum and the government pays another approx $1,500 (30% rebate) on top bringing the actual cost to $6.500. This is Family cover that I am using,single is a roughly half that. It is not a common practice here for an employer to offer Health Insurance with a job.
At the moment my wife is not well and requires surgery and the treatment that she has received through the public system has been pretty good and quick and cost me nothing except for the drutgs she requires which I will add are all under the P>B>S scheme so if the drug costs more than $34.00 the goverment pays the balance.
$1 Aust is roughly 80 US cents
I work with a friend who is a U.S citizen ( Texas,Nevada and California was where he lived) and he was telling me with private insurance you are still up for massive amounts and it is not uncommon if any serious issue arises to wind up broke.
He likes our system here by a long shot.
Anyway here is another perspective and really think hard about what you want
no, only the upper-middle class and upper class deserve treatment because anyone who can't afford it doesn't deserve to live.
Assuming that was a joke... Although I would modify it a bit and say that maybe there should be an IQ test prior to getting healthcare. Time to chlorinate the gene pool.
Seriously, I voted yes. I think healthcare is a basic human right that everyone is entitled to. While I agree that there are some who abuse the system by running to a doctor for every sniffle, perhaps there could be an "idiot" surcharge for those people. If you go to the doctor for something serious, you're covered. If you go to the doctor for a cold you're charged, whether you have private health insurance or not.
Further, I believe that mental health should be covered as well. For the person who says many people with mental health problems do nothing to help themselves and therefore should be denied coverage, let me ask, should we deny coverage to those who have heart attacks because they are overweight? How about denying coverage to those with lung cancer or skin cancer because they brought it on themselves? Or the person who breaks his leg during a skiing accident?
I think I'm too subtle for my own health sometimes...The remark in bold was directed at the diseased organ inside King By Tor's head which makes him susceptible to posting such facile garbage in the first place. It's called ironyso yeah, the IQ test sounds like a winner.
That aside, I can only endorse the remainder of your post (That's NOT irony)
Joined: October 22 2005
Location: elsewhere
Status: Offline
Points: 67407
Posted: August 29 2009 at 16:21
Slartibartfast wrote:
So if you were to break a limb or say, heaven forbid, get run over by a steamroller you'd be able to pay for that out of pocket?
What's the student medical fee that you pay if you don't mind?
Not much (30 €?), but I'd much rather pay a 50 for going to the
doctor whenever I need to than pay 30 a year for a service I don't use.
(And I don't think the student healthcare would do much good if I got
run over by a steamroller. )
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