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el böthy 
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Joined: April 27 2005
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 Posted: May 21 2008 at 21:20 |
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jejeje Styx
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"You want me to play what, Robert?"
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debrewguy
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Posted: May 21 2008 at 17:49 |
 Ivan_Melgar_M wrote:
cesar polo wrote:
Call me a romantic or something so, but my vote goes for "Babe". I know it's not the most progressive track by Styx...but my girlfriend is round here and we have live together great moments with this song, so that I can't vote for another one  . |
Yeah, I remember I declared my eternal love to a girlfriend (well really 2 months love) with that song back in the early 80's.
But still I believe it's a weak song for the band.
Iván |
I thought Babe was a good tune, but it unfortunately really gave DeYoung the motivation to take Styx into way more mainstream music, i.e. too many ballads per album. Aerosmith had that phase after Pump.
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"Here I am talking to some of the smartest people in the world and I didn't even notice,” Lieutenant Columbo, episode The Bye-Bye Sky-High I.Q. Murder Case.
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EnderEd
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Posted: May 20 2008 at 12:32 |
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Other: "Lady"
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--EnderEd
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Ivan_Melgar_M
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Posted: May 18 2008 at 13:19 |
cesar polo wrote:
Call me a romantic or something so, but my vote goes for "Babe". I know it's not the most progressive track by Styx...but my girlfriend is round here and we have live together great moments with this song, so that I can't vote for another one. |
Yeah, I remember I declared my eternal love to a girlfriend (well really 2 months love) with that song back in the early 80's.
But still I believe it's a weak song for the band.
Iván
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cesar polo
Forum Senior Member
Joined: April 23 2007
Location: Spain
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Posted: May 18 2008 at 03:45 |
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Jared
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Posted: May 17 2008 at 04:54 |
Soul Dreamer wrote:
I'm missing Castle Walls from this poll. For me always the sequence Man in the Wilderness - Castle Walls is percieved as one song, and for that it is my definitive Styx song. So I voted for Man in the Wilderness, but included in that vote also "Castle Walls" |
these were my feelings exactly...its a truly beautiful section.... 
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Music has always been a matter of energy to me. On some nights I believe that a car with the needle on empty can run 50 more miles if you have the right music very loud on the radio. Hunter S Thompson
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ghost_of_morphy
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Joined: March 08 2007
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Points: 2755
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Posted: May 17 2008 at 04:52 |
I voted for other because I apparently missed the option to vote for it. The 6/8 signature, the likable melody, and the extremely intelligent lyrics vault it above Angry Young Man, in my opinion.
Edited by ghost_of_morphy - May 17 2008 at 04:56
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Ivan_Melgar_M
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Posted: May 17 2008 at 01:29 |
Sing for a Day oneof the two songs without one vote?
Seems strange, always loved the guitar in that track.
Iván
Edited by Ivan_Melgar_M - May 17 2008 at 01:31
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nordwind
Forum Senior Member
Joined: March 07 2007
Location: Canada
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Points: 170
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Posted: May 16 2008 at 22:29 |
I'm sure if dennis is reading this thread ,he's having a good laugh ! It's only a song people !
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Jazz isn't dead.......it just smells funny.
Frank Zappa / Live in New York
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jimmy_row
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Joined: July 11 2007
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Posted: May 16 2008 at 21:53 |
Dr. Prog wrote:
How dare you Dennis DeYoung, you commie radical American hating hippie! |
I'm going to regret veering slightly off-topic here...but:
I don't quite understand how you can come up with this comment while criticizing DeYoung for "going commercial", and even name-dropping Phil Collins. It's almost as if it's okay for him to write a protest song, becuase YOU agree with it, and anyone opposed to the meaning is a right-wing extremist...while at the same time, he CAN'T write hit singles because apparently you don't like them. Please correct me if I'm wrong, because this is the impression in my mind.
How dare you Dennis DeYoung, you sleezy extreme capitalist money-hungry pig!
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Signature Writers Guild on strike
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Soul Dreamer
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Joined: October 17 2005
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Posted: May 16 2008 at 21:26 |
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I'm missing Castle Walls from this poll. For me always the sequence Man in the Wilderness - Castle Walls is percieved as one song, and for that it is my definitive Styx song. So I voted for Man in the Wilderness, but included in that vote also "Castle Walls"
Edited by Soul Dreamer - May 16 2008 at 21:28
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To be the one who seeks so I may find .. (Metallica)
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debrewguy
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Posted: May 16 2008 at 20:57 |
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Oh, btw, Lady broke as a hit single around the time of Equinox or Crystal Ball. So DeYoung was already moving on from his earlier stylings. Mostly, it came down to a building up of confidence in his songwriting that started with Curulewski's departure. You'll note that James Young had more songwriting credits on the first few albums than he did on later Styx classics like Grand Illusion et al.
Also note that until Paradise Theater, DeYoung did manage to put out some "heavy" songs, and even some that still showed a prog bent.
As for Kansas, if you do an album count of the "regression" of the progness of the music, you may see that both groups became more mainstream at about the same stage of their career. The one difference being that Kansas was taken more seriously due to the lyrical matter, and the fact that they didn't go on to put out their own "Babe", "I'm O.K." , and "Best of Times".
And finally, as too many PAers will proclaim, there is no such thing as American Prog. Heck, apart from Rush, just about any other North American prog group that achieved any success is damned with the curse of somehow being "commercial" (see Klaatu, Kansas, Styx, Saga, Triumph, etc...)
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"Here I am talking to some of the smartest people in the world and I didn't even notice,” Lieutenant Columbo, episode The Bye-Bye Sky-High I.Q. Murder Case.
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Dr. Prog
Forum Senior Member
Joined: April 29 2008
Status: Offline
Points: 306
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Posted: May 16 2008 at 18:20 |
Cesar Inca wrote:
ClassicRocker wrote:
Cesar Inca wrote:
Very emotional song about a political issue: America, stop being so imperalist because that won't lead you to greatness. If you want to be great again, stick to the dreams of freedom that gave you birth in the first place and stop being imperialist. That will help to solve the country's internal problems, the most important and urgent ones.
Kind regards. |
I don't want to get into a political argument here, but "imperialist"? Are you sure about that? I wasn't aware we had an American Empire. For clarification, are you referring to the song's meaning or your own opinion?
oh and, erm, "Styx rox!" and such...
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Beyond the fact of what I think about this sort of detail, I was just stating my interpretation of the lyrics to 'Suite Madame Blue'. I want to make it clear that I think that this is a very patriotic song, a statement of patriotic self-criticism as Socrates did from the philosopher's point of view in Ancient Athens.
The Vietnam thing was a major reference for those Americans who felt that worldwide political expansion wasn't the way while unemployment, unequity and public health were still issues unsolved in the own country. I regard the line "once long ago, a word from your lips and the world turned around" refers to the fatc that the USA used to be a very inspirational country: it achieved its independence before the victory of antu-monarchists in France, it established a multi-state nation that eventually served as some sort of model for many European democratic countries, and the USA was also the country where most of the the anti-slavery, anti-sexism and pro-labor movements began. It was very pionerring in terms of defending the ideals of freedom and equity in the area of ideas. DeYoung seems to express his total disappointment at the way the USA had managed its international affairs from the 50s onward (Korea onward). I feel that's where the allusions to Madame Blue's vanity come in.
Definitely, the last lines seem to me like a claim to stop with this line of work in international politics and start a new one, more faithful to the original spirit that had given birth to teh USA in the first place. These lyrics don't match the poetry of Hammill nor the deep imagery of Kery Livgren, but they definitely are clever, full of allusions. I hope my interpretation does hit some mark along the way. To put an European example, Spain is another country that has had a long history of self-criticism through intellectuals and artists during the time of its imperial decline.
Once again, this is my interpetation of DeYoung's concerns in these lyrics. I'm not saying I'm agreeing (alghouth I might) - this is not the subject.
And just in case, I'm not Anti-American or something, I'm not "anti-any-country". I disagree with individual people  , not with the nations they were born in. 
All in all, my all-time fave STYX song is an introspective one: 'Castle Walls'. It sets the ultimate connection between STYX' American essence and Britisn prog - much Yes and PF influence in this track, yet remaining true to the spirit of the band's signature sound.
Kind regards.
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very good analysis. At least someone has a clue about what the song is about.
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Dr. Prog
Forum Senior Member
Joined: April 29 2008
Status: Offline
Points: 306
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Posted: May 16 2008 at 18:17 |
fandango wrote:
Ivan_Melgar_M wrote:
If I knew this, I wouldn't started the thread:
Imperialism, Vietnam, Phoil Collins, etc, all of them have nothing to do here, this is a poll about STYX tracks, that's all.
Iván |
very well said, Ivan....
just what I have been thinking...there are a few 'contributors' to this thread who frankly ought to re-evaluate their PA priorities... 
earlier on in this thread, I was going to compliment people on what a refreshing change it has been to have positive, constructive discussion on Styx appreciation, as in the past, Styx particularly have come in for quite a bit of unnecessary bashing on this forum....
but of course, it doesn't ever seam to be able to stay like that, does it? someone just has to start bashing America, or intruduce controvertial global political/ religious issues which have absolutely nothing to do with the original subject, and only serve to leave a bad taste in the mouth...
...I don't know how the rest of you feel, but I for one am getting a bit fed up of it all....  |
if you followed the thread and actually read the posts, no one just started up and "bashing America". Cesar made a very accurate and well thought out statement that Suite Madame Blue by STYX is a song about America's imperialistic policies and the Vietnam War, which in fact he is dead on right about. For that he was bashed and criticized unfairly, and then people started spouting off with blatant right wing falsities and absurdities as a result. That is what the song is about. Deal with it. If it pains people to know that some songs out there actually dare to criticize the U, S of A, and you don't want to hear about it, I would suggest you stop listening to music with any kind of intelligence associated with it, and listen to Miley Cyrus records, who is unlikely to sing about anything controversial. Do you actually expect people to ignore the meaning of songs and not discuss their meaning? Are people that vacuous?
Suite Madame Blue is a lot of people's favorite Styx song exactly because is one of the few Styx songs they ever did which actually had some meat and substance to it. The meaning of the Styx song had everything to do with the thread, and people should be allowed to freely post their opinions on what the song means and why its an important song. People have every right to discuss its meaning and the reasons why it is their favorite song and why its important. I would suggest that if discussing the meaning of songs and the implications behind those songs are just too disconcerting for you, don't post about them, don't start threads about them, and don't read posts about them, and ignore posts which dare to criticize the USA, which by the way, is the very foundation and cornerstone of living in a a democratic free society like America, and what fighting for the flag in fact means.
I also find it ironic that the statement was made earlier in the thread to feel free to talk about anything you like without restrictions, and now all the whiners want to come out and control what people think and write simply because the meaning of a clearly political statement song was being discussed. Amazing.
also, the Phil Collins reference was made in direct comparison to the pop fluff factor that Styx had and their move to commercialism, again, in direct reference to the songs being discussed, and for comparison purposes. I would suggest that some people quit trying to control and micromanage other people's opinions and relax and deal with diversity of thought and freedom of expression. I also find it ironic that its the right wing that always wants to clamp down on freedom of thought and expression.
How dare you Dennis DeYoung, you commie radical American hating hippie!
Edited by Dr. Prog - May 16 2008 at 18:19
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cosmic_owl
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Joined: May 12 2008
Location: Earth
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Points: 29
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Posted: May 16 2008 at 15:39 |
fandango wrote:
Ivan_Melgar_M wrote:
If I knew this, I wouldn't started the thread:
Imperialism, Vietnam, Phoil Collins, etc, all of them have nothing to do here, this is a poll about STYX tracks, that's all.
Iván |
very well said, Ivan....
just what I have been thinking...there are a few 'contributors' to this thread who frankly ought to re-evaluate their PA priorities...
earlier on in this thread, I was going to compliment people on what a refreshing change it has been to have positive, constructive discussion on Styx appreciation, as in the past, Styx particularly have come in for quite a bit of unnecessary bashing on this forum....
but of course, it doesn't ever seam to be able to stay like that, does it? someone just has to start bashing America, or intruduce controvertial global political/ religious issues which have absolutely nothing to do with the original subject, and only serve to leave a bad taste in the mouth...
...I don't know how the rest of you feel, but I for one am getting a bit fed up of it all.... |
Indeed. Let's keep politics in a political forum. 
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~The Great Owl Hath Spoken~
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MovingPictures07
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Joined: January 09 2008
Location: Beasty Heart
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Points: 32181
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Posted: May 16 2008 at 15:25 |
fandango wrote:
Ivan_Melgar_M wrote:
If I knew this, I wouldn't started the thread:
Imperialism, Vietnam, Phoil Collins, etc, all of them have nothing to do here, this is a poll about STYX tracks, that's all.
Iván |
very well said, Ivan....
just what I have been thinking...there are a few 'contributors' to this thread who frankly ought to re-evaluate their PA priorities...
earlier on in this thread, I was going to compliment people on what a refreshing change it has been to have positive, constructive discussion on Styx appreciation, as in the past, Styx particularly have come in for quite a bit of unnecessary bashing on this forum....
but of course, it doesn't ever seam to be able to stay like that, does it? someone just has to start bashing America, or intruduce controvertial global political/ religious issues which have absolutely nothing to do with the original subject, and only serve to leave a bad taste in the mouth...
...I don't know how the rest of you feel, but I for one am getting a bit fed up of it all.... |
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Ivan_Melgar_M
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Joined: April 27 2004
Location: Peru
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Posted: May 16 2008 at 14:28 |
Cesar Inca wrote:
Ivan_Melgar_M wrote:
If I knew this, I wouldn't started the thread:
Imperialism, Vietnam, Phil Collins, etc, all of them have nothing to do here, this is a poll about STYX tracks, that's all.
Iván |
And I understood it that way and I only added my interpretation of DeYoung's lyrics to the song I chose. It would have been a different message if my fave track from that list would have had romantic or introspective lyrics.
I quote myself from a previous post:
" Beyond the fact of what I think about this sort of detail, I was just stating my interpretation of the lyrics to 'Suite Madame Blue'. I want to make it clear that I think that this is a very patriotic song, a statement of patriotic self-criticism as Socrates did from the philosopher's point of view in Ancient Athens.
The Vietnam thing was a major reference for those Americans who felt that worldwide political expansion wasn't the way while unemployment, unequity and public health were still issues unsolved in the own country. I regard the line "once long ago, a word from your lips and the world turned around" refers to the fatc that the USA used to be a very inspirational country: it achieved its independence before the victory of anti-monarchists in France, it established a multi-state nation that eventually served as some sort of model for many European democratic countries, and the USA was also the country where most of the the anti-slavery, anti-sexism and pro-labor movements began. It was very pionerring in terms of defending the ideals of freedom and equity in the area of ideas. DeYoung seems to express his total disappointment at the way the USA had managed its international affairs from the 50s onward (Korea onward). I feel that's where the allusions to Madame Blue's vanity come in.
Definitely, the last lines seem to me like a claim to stop with this line of work in international politics and start a new one, more faithful to the original spirit that had given birth to teh USA in the first place. These lyrics don't match the poetry of Hammill nor the deep imagery of Kery Livgren, but they definitely are clever, full of allusions. I hope my interpretation does hit some mark along the way. To put an European example, Spain is another country that has had a long history of self-criticism through intellectuals and artists during the time of its imperial decline.
Once again, this is my interpetation of DeYoung's concerns in these lyrics. "
Enough said about this from my part, and of course, hardly I was an America-bashing participant in this thread.
Kind regards. |
I understand that the interpretation of Suite Madam Blues can lead to that, but the problem is that instantly the people who want to bash USA (I hate to say America, because I still believe America is a Continent) jump into the thread and with equal reason the people who feel offended by this statements jump in and we start talking about anything except what the original, harmless issue was, I know you personally, and I know you're not anti-USA.
But it's not only your valid interptretation, Phil Collins also ended in this thread. He has absolutely nothing to do in a STYX poll, for God's sake, not even Kansas, being that the guys from Topeka created a 100% Prog band and STYX is mostly great Rock, just because they are both coetaneous and rom USA misleads the analysis of both bands.
If we want to debate about USA and their external policy, there is the General Discussion section and if we want to debate about Phil Collins, there are at least four open threads about him.
Let's try to keep this in focus, that's all.
Iván
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burritounit
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Joined: September 18 2007
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Posted: May 16 2008 at 14:21 |
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I voted for Suite Madame Blue though there are plenty of other songs from that I like from them, such as Come Sail Away, Renegade, Crystall Ball and others.
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"I've walked on water, run through fire, can't seem to feel it anymore. It was me, waiting for me..."
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Cesar Inca
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Location: Peru
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Points: 4888
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Posted: May 16 2008 at 13:47 |
Ivan_Melgar_M wrote:
If I knew this, I wouldn't started the thread:
Imperialism, Vietnam, Phil Collins, etc, all of them have nothing to do here, this is a poll about STYX tracks, that's all.
Iván |
And I understood it that way and I only added my interpretation of DeYoung's lyrics to the song I chose. It would have been a different message if my fave track from that list would have had romantic or introspective lyrics.
I quote myself from a previous post:
" Beyond the fact of what I think about this sort of detail, I was just stating my interpretation of the lyrics to 'Suite Madame Blue'. I want to make it clear that I think that this is a very patriotic song, a statement of patriotic self-criticism as Socrates did from the philosopher's point of view in Ancient Athens.
The Vietnam thing was a major reference for those Americans who felt that worldwide political expansion wasn't the way while unemployment, unequity and public health were still issues unsolved in the own country. I regard the line "once long ago, a word from your lips and the world turned around" refers to the fatc that the USA used to be a very inspirational country: it achieved its independence before the victory of anti-monarchists in France, it established a multi-state nation that eventually served as some sort of model for many European democratic countries, and the USA was also the country where most of the the anti-slavery, anti-sexism and pro-labor movements began. It was very pionerring in terms of defending the ideals of freedom and equity in the area of ideas. DeYoung seems to express his total disappointment at the way the USA had managed its international affairs from the 50s onward (Korea onward). I feel that's where the allusions to Madame Blue's vanity come in.
Definitely, the last lines seem to me like a claim to stop with this line of work in international politics and start a new one, more faithful to the original spirit that had given birth to teh USA in the first place. These lyrics don't match the poetry of Hammill nor the deep imagery of Kery Livgren, but they definitely are clever, full of allusions. I hope my interpretation does hit some mark along the way. To put an European example, Spain is another country that has had a long history of self-criticism through intellectuals and artists during the time of its imperial decline.
Once again, this is my interpetation of DeYoung's concerns in these lyrics. "
Enough said about this from my part, and of course, hardly I was an America-bashing participant in this thread.
Kind regards.
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cosmic_owl
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Joined: May 12 2008
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Posted: May 16 2008 at 13:43 |
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Suite Madam Blue is an excellent song. But I have to vote for Fooling Yourself. It just does something to me. It makes me happy inside.
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~The Great Owl Hath Spoken~
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