In defense of Kansas (a rant on the 80’s)

You present your opinion as undisputed fact, and then use nothing but more personal opinion to back it up.  I'd perhaps take your thoughts more seriously if you had a better reason than "I'm from Europe, and I'm better than you!"

  Playing with trolls is so fun...  

No just honest, and have an opinion that doesn't mean ever time i hear our (exceedigly boring) national anthem that i should feel patriocism., or feel my chest.

Finally Kansas are awful, nowhere near as good as bands from the two countries, one principallity and one provence that make up the UK.

yargh wrote: Here's the problem with Kansas:  In the 1970s (their prime, in the minds of those who consider the band to have had one) their sound was lifted from the better UK bands; thus, arguing that their '80s material was good because the bands they copied had moved on doesn't make any sense to me.  The '70s prog movement died in the late 1970s.  There was still progressive music to be made in the '80s, but by and large it was not to be made out of the same materials as the symph-prog bands of the 1970s.

What a load of utter hogwash.

Which UK bands did Kansas bite from?

Please name them.

Gimmie a specfic example.

Like say... well this part from "Icarus" sounds a whole lot like this part
from "Heart of the Sunrise".

Gee.. heck.. gosh... darn... golly... this part from "Song for America"
sounds a whole lot like "Fracture".

Get real.

Total revisionist history.

Kansas FAILED with the US proggers on the first 3 records because they
decidedly DID NOT sound much of ANYTHING like the UK prog bands of
the day.

Go back and read my first post on the subject and learn something.

Concentrate on the 'rock' and 'riff' thingies.

They cut their own little niche with the kids who OUTGREW Journey and
Styx when they watered down the compositional soup starting on POKR,
and finally "crossed over" to FM radio rock... which was the plan of that
evil little troll Don Kirshner from day one, and reason why he SIGNED the
band.

Hilariously... they actually still wrote a bunch of fairly decent 'prog-pop'
stuff.... something the vast majority of their now wishy-washy English
prog contemporaries, like GTR and Asia failed miserably at.... Which,
without actually saying EXACTLY as much.... is kinda what the original
poster was driving at.

Anyhoo.

There ya have it. Yer totally in the dark.

SM.

Edited by SlipperFink

dream_orchestra wrote: I don't see anyone from the UK or Europe agreeing....................yet?

I'm from Africa, and I agree.  And the last time I checked, the UK was part of Europe.

leftoverture by kansas is a prog masterpiece

SlipperFink wrote: The first 5 Kansas records were laudable. They could all play pretty well, and played and wrote WITHIN the limitations of the groups ability to execute. A VERY AMERICAN CONCEPT. Some folks thought.... and obviously some STILL think, this prevented them from being a real 'Prog band'. But let's look at who they were. A bunch of utterly repressed Biblebeating Blue-eyed Gospel afficinados from the MIDDLE OF NOWHERE. That's pretty cool in and of itself. Granted: They didn't have the compositional astusity of GG, but they were better writers than Camel or Greenslade. They didn't have the chops of groups like ELP or Yes.. but they were better players to a man than anybody in Nektar. They didn't have the lyrical impact of VDGG, but they wrote better lyric than Uriah Heep. And they had SPIRIT. They were earnest, passionate, and heartfelt. They were HONEST. And they could(gasp) ROCK.

Good point, but again I partially disagree because I hate to compare bands, specially in the case of Kansas, they were so unique as no other band ever.

Their lyrics are different, more dark, dramatic and pesimist than anybody else, the massive use of violin not as an aid to keyboards but as the main instrument is absolutely exclusive, the strong drumming of Phil Ehartand is amazing (The most uderrated drummer in history), their shameless way they expose their feelings and fears is incredible.

You can't compare them with Uriah Heep, Yes,. Genesis (Well, there's strong Genesis influence) or VDGG, they are something special, not better, not worst, only different

IMO they were in the same level as any other Prog' band, only that they had the most unique approach to Prog, despite the fact they come from the strangest city for Prog' in the world, but that made even richer their music because they added strong folk to their sound.

I simply love Kansas (Except during their Fundamentalist years (AKA The Elephante years).

Iván

Edited by ivan_2068

The first 5 Kansas records were laudable.

They could all play pretty well, and played and wrote WITHIN the
limitations of the groups ability to execute. A VERY AMERICAN CONCEPT.

Some folks thought.... and obviously some STILL think, this prevented
them from being a real 'Prog band'.

But let's look at who they were.

A bunch of utterly repressed Biblebeating Blue-eyed Gospel afficinados
from the MIDDLE OF NOWHERE.

That's pretty cool in and of itself.

Granted:

They didn't have the compositional astusity of GG, but they were better
writers than Camel or Greenslade.

They didn't have the chops of groups like ELP or Yes.. but they were
better players to a man than anybody in Nektar.

They didn't have the lyrical impact of VDGG, but they wrote better lyric
than Uriah Heep.

And they had SPIRIT. They were earnest, passionate, and heartfelt.

They were HONEST.

And they could(gasp) ROCK.

That's right folks.... Kansas was a ROCK BAND, first and foremost. They
could write an exciting and convincing guitar riff.

Yep a RIFF.

Now... For some people on this site... that's gonna be a problem... as the
RIFF has limited appeal to them.. But that's the funny thing about the
RIFF. If ya wanna run it down... FIRST YA GOTTA SHOW ME YOU CAN DO
IT....

And

many

Prog

bands

of

the

day

couldn't

RIFF
to
save
their

ass.

Just like many fusion jazz guys you'd jam with back in the day couldn't
play a BAR of rock music CONVINCINGLY.

Oh... They ALL THOUGHT they could....

But...

Nope.

...

Anyhoo.

I digress.

Point is....

There are a lot of posters on this website who can't figure out why they
can't get a decent Chicken Parm dinner at a Chinese resturant.

I'd hafta call them bungeling nitwits.... and in a perfect world....

We'd just march them into a styrofoam space capsule and launch them to
the Sun for a ground survey.

But this is "ProgSnobCentral".... and that little wrinkle traditionally
precludes cogent thought and unfettered listenership from the git-go.

The people around here who wanna know "What killed Prog?" Should look
no further than their own insuperable myopia.

SM.

PS. Steve Walsh had quite possibly the BEST VOICE in ALL of Rock Music in
his prime. I am talking about the INSTRUMENT. It was astounding. If you
can't hear that....

Yer f**ked.

Deaf.

Kryloned.

Proto-Kaw are nothing short of amazing.  The Buffalo one is new music by them, the other CD is old demos (from pre-Kansas times), salvaged.

Imagine a cross between King Crimson and VdGG, I actually like these guys *more* than what Kansas became...