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maani
Special Collaborator
Founding Moderator
Joined: January 30 2004
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 2632
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Posted: August 23 2005 at 20:06 |
Look, let's call a spade a spade. Robertson is not simply out of line, but he is suggesting a course of action that is 180 degrees from any reasonable understanding of Jesus' life and ministry. To his credit, Robertson has done a great deal of good over decades of time, though most of you probably don't know it, and would not accept it. However, he has been making these types of statements - irrational, and often extremely non-Christian - with increasing frequency, especially over the past couple of years or so. All this means is that even Christians are subject to the vagaries of age, and the often accompanying diminution of mental powers, whether as a result of dementia, Alzheimers or other disease or condition.
Clearly nothing excuses this type of comment. However, it would be equally inexcusable coming from a Jew, a Muslim, a Buddhist - or an atheist. In this regard - and because I believe, from watching him over the years, that he is in fact "showing his age" vis-a-vis his mental faculties - I really don't believe his faith or religion has anything to do with it. Thus, I find the "pot shots" being taken at Christians and Christianity in this particular thread to be inappropriate, offensive and opportunist.
Peace.
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spectral
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 04 2005
Location: Vatican City State
Status: Offline
Points: 1422
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Posted: August 23 2005 at 18:52 |
Garion81 wrote:
spectral wrote:
The issue with all this is how different people are treated in different ways. Robertson can say all this stuff and get away with it scott free. If a Muslim said anything remotely similar, he would be banged up on incitement to hatred charges, or a similar offence. The inequity is astounding and worrying. The likes of Robertson and most of the Fox News anchors (like O'Reilly) should be locked up! |
Lets S T R E T C H this out a bit.
Such a thing as free speach (sort of) left in this country. So what he said it on his own show. What muslim has been prosecuted for speaking his mind? Do you have some proof? As for Robertson oh well, . All he really said is If the guy is saying that the US is trying to kill him maybe the government should. He didn't say he was going to do it. Whether or not you agree with that is one thing to prosecute him is something else. Do what most of us in America do. Don't pay any attention to him.
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In the UK there are laws/bills relating to incitement to hatred. if a muslim cleric had uttered words similar to those he would have been arrested. However, I bet someone similar to Robertson uttering those words in the UK, the police/authorities/govt would not even batter an eyelid.
You're right though, the likes of Robertson should be ignored entirely.
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"...misty halos made visible by the spectral illumination of moonshine."
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Tony R
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator / Retired Admin
Joined: July 16 2004
Location: UK
Status: Offline
Points: 11979
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Posted: August 23 2005 at 18:47 |
Robertson, 75, founder of the Christian Coalition of America and a former presidential candidate
David Brock, president of Media Matters, a liberal media watchdog group, said the remarks should discredit Robertson as a spokesman for the religious right.
Glad to see someone with a Prog Rock background has something sensible to say on the matter
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Garion81
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: May 22 2004
Location: So Cal, USA
Status: Offline
Points: 4338
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Posted: August 23 2005 at 18:40 |
spectral wrote:
The issue with all this is how different people are treated in different ways. Robertson can say all this stuff and get away with it scott free. If a Muslim said anything remotely similar, he would be banged up on incitement to hatred charges, or a similar offence. The inequity is astounding and worrying. The likes of Robertson and most of the Fox News anchors (like O'Reilly) should be locked up! |
Lets S T R E T C H this out a bit.
Such a thing as free speach (sort of) left in this country. So what he said it on his own show. What muslim has been prosecuted for speaking his mind? Do you have some proof? As for Robertson oh well, . All he really said is If the guy is saying that the US is trying to kill him maybe the government should. He didn't say he was going to do it. Whether or not you agree with that is one thing to prosecute him is something else. Do what most of us in America do. Don't pay any attention to him.
Edited by Garion81
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"What are you going to do when that damn thing rusts?"
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jitu
Forum Senior Member
Joined: July 22 2005
Location: India
Status: Offline
Points: 482
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Posted: August 23 2005 at 17:13 |
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spectral
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 04 2005
Location: Vatican City State
Status: Offline
Points: 1422
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Posted: August 23 2005 at 17:05 |
JrKASperov wrote:
I'd like to point out that according to Christian prophecy, the church (people who follow) of YHWH and Yahshua, or Jesus, will be the first to be judged.
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Is this a good or bad thing? educate me...
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"...misty halos made visible by the spectral illumination of moonshine."
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JrKASperov
Forum Senior Member
Joined: July 07 2004
Status: Offline
Points: 904
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Posted: August 23 2005 at 16:47 |
King of Loss wrote:
Robertson is such a dipsh*t, Christian Fundamentalists are so stupid. |
Why, thank you King of Loss, I pray that your life will be as good as mine.
I'd like to point out that according to Christian prophecy, the church
(people who follow) of YHWH and Yahshua, or Jesus, will be the first to
be judged.
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Epic.
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marktheshark
Forum Senior Member
Joined: April 24 2005
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 1695
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Posted: August 23 2005 at 16:47 |
stonebeard wrote:
that's a generalization, KOL. but that doesn't mean i don't agree with you.
i think robertson should meet his maker himself if he's so eager to send others to Him. |
I don't think even Robertson is a fundamentalist. I look at a Christian Fundamentalist as like the Amish people here in this country. Anybody who is Christian and has a quest for power like Falwell and Robertson are not funamentalists. This quest for power totally contradicts the Christian faith.
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spectral
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 04 2005
Location: Vatican City State
Status: Offline
Points: 1422
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Posted: August 23 2005 at 16:18 |
The issue with all this is how different people are treated in different ways. Robertson can say all this stuff and get away with it scott free. If a Muslim said anything remotely similar, he would be banged up on incitement to hatred charges, or a similar offence. The inequity is astounding and worrying. The likes of Robertson and most of the Fox News anchors (like O'Reilly) should be locked up!
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"...misty halos made visible by the spectral illumination of moonshine."
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stonebeard
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 27 2005
Location: NE Indiana
Status: Offline
Points: 28057
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Posted: August 23 2005 at 15:31 |
that's a generalization, KOL. but that doesn't mean i don't agree with you.
i think robertson should meet his maker himself if he's so eager to send others to Him.
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NetsNJFan
Prog Reviewer
Joined: April 12 2005
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 3047
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Posted: August 23 2005 at 15:31 |
ha ha Pat Robertson make me laugh
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King of Loss
Prog Reviewer
Joined: April 21 2005
Location: Boston, MA
Status: Offline
Points: 16794
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Posted: August 23 2005 at 15:27 |
Robertson is such a dipsh*t, Christian Fundamentalists are so stupid.
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Logos
Prog Reviewer
Joined: March 08 2005
Location: Finland
Status: Offline
Points: 2383
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Posted: August 23 2005 at 13:37 |
marktheshark wrote:
"This man cannot be a true Christian. He's a fascist,"
Robertson has made controversial statements in the past. In October he suggested that the State Department be blown up with a nuclear device. He has also said that feminism encourages women to "kill their children, practice witchcraft, destroy capitalism and become lesbians."
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This pretty much sums it up.
Incredible.
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MikeEnRegalia
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: April 22 2005
Location: Sweden
Status: Offline
Points: 21430
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Posted: August 23 2005 at 13:24 |
(No further comment necessary - Frank Zappa: Jesus Think's you're a Jerk from Broadway the Hard Way)
There's an ugly little wasel 'bout three-foot nine Face puffed up from cryin' 'n lyin' 'Cause her sweet little hubby's Suckin' prong part time (In the name of The Lord)
Get a clue, little shrew Oh yeah, oh yeah Jesus thinks you're a jerk
Did he really choose Tammy to do His Work? Robertson says that he's The One Oh sure he is, if Armageddon Is your idea of family fun, An' he's got some planned for you! (Now, tell me that ain't true)
Now, what if Jimbo's slightly gay, Will Pat let Jimbo get away? Everything we've heard him say Indicated that Jim must pay, (And it just might hurt a bit) But keep that money rollin' in, 'Cause Pat and naughty Jimbo Can't get enough of it
Perhaps it's their idea Of an Affirmative Action Plan To give White Trash a 'special break'; Well, they took those Jeezo-bucks and ran To the bank! To the bank! To the bank! To the bank! And every night we can hear them thank Their Buddy, up above For sending down his love (While you all smell the glove)
Jim and Pat should take a pole (Right up each saintly glory-hole), With tar and feathers too -- Just like they'd love to do to you
('Cause they think you are bad -- And they are very mad)
'Cause some folks don't want prayer in school!
(We'd need an ark to survive the drool Of Micro-publicans, raised on hate, And 'Jimbo-Jimbo' when they graduate)
Conviced they are 'The Chosen Ones' -- And all their parents carry guns, And hold them cards in the N.R.A. (With their fingers on the triggers When they kneel and pray)
With a Ku-Klux muu-muu In the back of the truck, If you ain't Born Again, They wanna mess you up, screamin': "No abortion, no-siree!" "Life's too precious, can't you see!" (What's that hangin' from the neighbor's tree? Why, it looks like 'colored folks' to me -- Would THEY do THAT...seriously?)
Imagine if you will A multi-millionaire Television Evangelist, Saved from Korean Combat duty by his father, a U.S. Senator
Studied Law -- But is not qualified to practice it
Father of a "love child" Who, in adulthood, hosts the remnants Of papa's religious propaganda program
Claims not to be a "Faith Healer", But has, in the past, Dealt stearnly with everything from hemorrhoids to hurricanes
Involved with funding for a 'secret war' in Central America Claiming Ronald Reagan and Oliver North as close friends
Involved in suspicous 'tax-avoidance schemes', (Under investigation for 16 months by the I.R.S.)
Claims to be a MAN OF GOD; Currenty seeking the United States Presidency, Hoping we will all follow him into -- The Twilight Zone
What if Pat gets in the White House, And suddenly -- The rights of 'certain people' disappear Mysteriously?
Now, wouldn't that sort of qualify As an American Tragedy? (Especially if he covers it up, sayin' "Jesus told it to me!")
I hope we never see that day, In The Land of The Free -- Or someday will we? Will we?
And if you don't know by now, The truth of what I'm tellin' you, Then, surely I have failed somehow --
And Jesus will think I'm a jerk, just like you -- If you let those TV Preachers Make a monkey out of you!
I said: "Jesus will think you're a jerk" And it will be true!
There's an old rugged cross In the land of cutton -- It's still burnin' on somebody's lawn And it still smells rotten
Jim and Tammy! Oh, baby! You gotta go! You really got to go!
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marktheshark
Forum Senior Member
Joined: April 24 2005
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 1695
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Posted: August 23 2005 at 13:12 |
Interesting article here. Stuff like this makes me sick.
Robertson Calls for Chavez Assassination
Aug 23 12:21 PM US/Eastern
By SUE LINDSEY
Associated Press Writer
VIRGINIA BEACH, Va.
Religious broadcaster Pat Robertson has suggested that American agents assassinate Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez to stop his country from becoming "a launching pad for communist infiltration and Muslim extremism."
An official of a theological watchdog group on Tuesday criticized Robertson's statement as "chilling."
"We have the ability to take him out, and I think the time has come that we exercise that ability," Robertson said Monday on the Christian Broadcast Network's "The 700 Club."
"We don't need another $200 billion war to get rid of one, you know, strong-arm dictator," he continued. "It's a whole lot easier to have some of the covert operatives do the job and then get it over with."
Chavez has emerged as one of the most outspoken critics of President Bush, accusing the United States of conspiring to topple his government and possibly backing plots to assassinate him. U.S. officials have called the accusations ridiculous.
"You know, I don't know about this doctrine of assassination, but if he thinks we're trying to assassinate him, I think that we really ought to go ahead and do it," Robertson said. "It's a whole lot cheaper than starting a war ... and I don't think any oil shipments will stop."
On Tuesday, critics objected to Robertson's statements.
"It's absolutely chilling to hear a religious leader call for the murder of any political leader, no matter how much he disagrees with such a leader's policies or practices," said the Rev. Barry Lynn, executive director of Americans United for Separation of Church and State.
David Brock, president of Media Matters, a liberal media watchdog group, said the remarks should discredit Robertson as a spokesman for the religious right.
Robertson, 75, founder of the Christian Coalition of America and a former presidential candidate, accused the United States of failing to act when Chavez was briefly overthrown in 2002.
A Robertson spokeswoman, Angell Watts, said he would not do interviews Tuesday and had no statement elaborating on his remarks.
A call seeking comment from the U.S. State Department was not immediately returned Tuesday.
Chavez was believed to be in Cuba, but his whereabouts were unknown and no media access was announced.
In Caracas, pro-Chavez legislator Desire Santos Amaral accused Robertson of shedding his Christian values.
"This man cannot be a true Christian. He's a fascist," Santos said. "This is part of the policies of aggression from the right wing in the North against our revolution."
Santos said she thinks U.S.-Venezuelan relations could still improve but comments by "charlatans and fascists" like Robertson only get in the way.
Venezuela is the fifth largest oil exporter and a major supplier of oil to the United States. The CIA estimates that U.S. markets absorb almost 59 percent of Venezuela's total exports.
Venezuela's government has demanded in the past that the United States crack down on Cuban and Venezuelan "terrorists" in Florida who they say are conspiring against Chavez.
Robertson has made controversial statements in the past. In October he suggested that the State Department be blown up with a nuclear device. He has also said that feminism encourages women to "kill their children, practice witchcraft, destroy capitalism and become lesbians."
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