Don't Ask, Don't Tell Deemed Unconstitutional

JLocke wrote: Epignosis wrote:  I believe marriage is at its essence between one man and one woman and for life, but even more, I don't believe the government should be involved in marriage at all. Not to get all patriotic on ya, here, but what you believe and what the constitution states are two very different things. It's equal rights across the board, or it's not freedom at all.  I don't believe in marriage. At this point, I have no plans to ever get married. But as long as people are getting married, the inequalities surrounding it need to go away.

*sigh*

We have equal rights.

A gay man can marry a woman.
A straight man can marry a woman.
A gay man cannot marry a man.
A straight man cannot marry a man.

That's equal.  As I've said before, what is being sought is not equal rights, but more rights.  It's not the same thing as black people not being allowed to vote.

Also, you ignored the latter half of my sentence- that government not be involved in marriage at all.  Every reason I've ever seen people fight for gay marriage would be completely satisfied if my ideal system were in place.

Here's a common anti-gays in the military argument:

-Allowing gays to serve openly will hurt troop morale and be a distraction.

Substitute:

-Allowing blacks to serve openly will hurt troop morale and be a distraction.
-Allowing women to serve openly will hurt troop morale and be a distraction.
-Allowing Middle-Easterners to serve openly will hurt troop morale and be a distraction.

There is no getting around it: this is a bullsh*t argument. It doesn't matter if it hurts troop morale: the top brass better goddamn whip the troops into shape better if they're getting pissy about having to get along with their comrades. I'm generally a pro-troop kinda guy, but there's no give on this argument. The military should not pander to prejudice because they're afraid of the specter of "troop morale." You goddamn learn to accept people who are doing nothing wrong, are in no danger of molesting you in your sleep or something, and just want to serve this country. Here's the word for denying them that: SHAMEFUL.

Goddamn right it's unconstitutional.

jplanet wrote: Epignosis wrote: I'm just one fellow.  When Bush got elected over Gore I was 18 and more concerned with about a hundred other things instead of politics.  My opinion of judicial power has been taking shape over the past year or so, and has extremely little to do with their making rulings I disagree with... How do you feel about the ruling that takes limits off of corporate campaign contributions? That was very recent. Epignosis wrote: ... Honestly, I spend very little of my time thinking about gay people. All I ask is that what little time you do think of them, is to think of them as equals. .

Why can't companies do what they want with the money they've earned?  You don't want the government telling you whom you can't marry but it's okay for the government to tell businesses what they can't do with their profits?

Regarding thinking of people as equals, I do that.  To you, probably not equal enough.  But I've discussed my views on this subject before.  I believe marriage is at its essence between one man and one woman and for life, but even more, I don't believe the government should be involved in marriage at all.

Did anyone else see that youtube video of the gay/gay friendly soldiers in Afghanistan doing some lady gaga dance routine in their undies (it can be really hot in Afghanistan mind you) with all kinds of incredible firepower at their feet and stacked near by because they can never be too far from their weapons.

JLocke wrote: I loved your post, man. Thank you for weighing in on the subject.

Thanks!

The T wrote: Easy Money wrote: Whats the problem with taking a shower with a gay man, I don't get it, is something bad going to happen? Apparently, gays are unable to control themselves...

Or worse still, they won't find you attractive.

jplanet wrote:   Epignosis wrote: ... Honestly, I spend very little of my time thinking about gay people. All I ask is that what little time you do think of them, is to think of them as equals. .

Epignosis wrote: I'm just one fellow.  When Bush got elected over Gore I was 18 and more concerned with about a hundred other things instead of politics.  My opinion of judicial power has been taking shape over the past year or so, and has extremely little to do with their making rulings I disagree with...

How do you feel about the ruling that takes limits off of corporate campaign contributions? That was very recent.

Epignosis wrote: ... Honestly, I spend very little of my time thinking about gay people.

All I ask is that what little time you do think of them, is to think of them as equals.

.

Oh, yeah, the partisan volleying is absurd. Now the GOP says that if Obama is voted out of office, they will do a criminal investigation as to whether this administration acted unlawfully. When dems threatened this in 2008, Obama said he didn't think it was a constructive path to take. I'm sure we will see a supposedly merciful posturing of this sort if Obama is replaced as well...

JPlanet beat me to the punch on that one.