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How to define and classify "Progressive Rock"?
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Psychedelic Paul View Drop Down
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Points: 40182 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Psychedelic Paul Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 17 2022 at 05:41
Originally posted by Cristi Cristi wrote:

Originally posted by Psychedelic Paul Psychedelic Paul wrote:

Originally posted by Cristi Cristi wrote:

Originally posted by Psychedelic Paul Psychedelic Paul wrote:

It's not a silly joke at all. I think you'll find that most all-music sites don't have lots of sub-genres for prog. We have lots of prog sub-genres here because it's a specialist prog site

But we are not on an all-music site, are we? 
it seems to me you give those kind of sites more credit and respect than you have ever given PA, which is insulting to the work admin and collabs (and other users) have done on the PA database. How you do not understand that is beyond me... Ouch
No, you've got it completely wrong. I've never even visited any all-music sites since I've been a member of ProgArchives. Why would I need to? I've got all the music I need right here and on YouTube. Big smile

Then the only conclusion i can take is that you were trolling with that classification. Ouch
Wrong again! That was how we used to classify prog when I used to run my own music site, whether you like it or not. Big smile
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Points: 43679 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Cristi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 17 2022 at 05:32
Originally posted by Psychedelic Paul Psychedelic Paul wrote:

Originally posted by Cristi Cristi wrote:

Originally posted by Psychedelic Paul Psychedelic Paul wrote:

It's not a silly joke at all. I think you'll find that most all-music sites don't have lots of sub-genres for prog. We have lots of prog sub-genres here because it's a specialist prog site

But we are not on an all-music site, are we? 
it seems to me you give those kind of sites more credit and respect than you have ever given PA, which is insulting to the work admin and collabs (and other users) have done on the PA database. How you do not understand that is beyond me... Ouch
No, you've got it completely wrong. I've never even visited any all-music sites since I've been a member of ProgArchives. Why would I need to? I've got all the music I need right here and on YouTube. Big smile

Then the only conclusion i can take is that you were trolling with that classification. Ouch
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Psychedelic Paul View Drop Down
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Points: 40182 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Psychedelic Paul Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 17 2022 at 05:28
Originally posted by Cristi Cristi wrote:

Originally posted by Psychedelic Paul Psychedelic Paul wrote:

It's not a silly joke at all. I think you'll find that most all-music sites don't have lots of sub-genres for prog. We have lots of prog sub-genres here because it's a specialist prog site

But we are not on an all-music site, are we? 
it seems to me you give those kind of sites more credit and respect than you have ever given PA, which is insulting to the work admin and collabs (and other users) have done on the PA database. How you do not understand that is beyond me... Ouch
No, you've got it completely wrong. I've never even visited any all-music sites since I've been a member of ProgArchives. Why would I need to? I've got all the music I need right here and on YouTube. Big smile
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Points: 43679 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Cristi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 17 2022 at 05:18
Originally posted by Psychedelic Paul Psychedelic Paul wrote:

It's not a silly joke at all. I think you'll find that most all-music sites don't have lots of sub-genres for prog. We have lots of prog sub-genres here because it's a specialist prog site

But we are not on an all-music site, are we? 
it seems to me you give those kind of sites more credit and respect than you have ever given PA, which is insulting to the work admin and collabs (and other users) have done on the PA database. How you do not understand that is beyond me... Ouch
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Psychedelic Paul View Drop Down
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Points: 40182 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Psychedelic Paul Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 17 2022 at 05:13
Originally posted by Cristi Cristi wrote:

Originally posted by Psychedelic Paul Psychedelic Paul wrote:

But it's true! That's how we used to classify Progressive Rock on YouTube Episodes & Music back in 2013-2015. We didn't have any of the additional prog categories we have here such as Crossover Prog, Eclectic Prog or Heavy Prog, etc, etc.

It wasn't just a Progressive Rock music site though - it was an all-music site with 20 parent genres of music and 200 sub-genres, but with only two sub-genres for prog:-
 Classic Prog & Neo Prog. Smile


Most of the PA subgenres have been around for years. The fact that you still classify things like that, I can't take that seriously, just a silly joke of yours. 
It's not a silly joke at all and I don't "still classify things like that". I think you'll find that most all-music sites don't have lots of sub-genres for prog. We have lots of prog sub-genres here because it's a specialist prog site, and yes, I already know what you're going to say:- "Thank You Captain Obvious!" LOL


Edited by Psychedelic Paul - August 17 2022 at 05:15
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Originally posted by Psychedelic Paul Psychedelic Paul wrote:

But it's true! That's how we used to classify Progressive Rock on YouTube Episodes & Music back in 2013-2015. We didn't have any of the additional prog categories we have here such as Crossover Prog, Eclectic Prog or Heavy Prog, etc, etc.

It wasn't just a Progressive Rock music site though - it was an all-music site with 20 parent genres of music and 200 sub-genres, but with only two sub-genres for prog:-
 Classic Prog & Neo Prog. Smile


Most of the PA subgenres have been around for years. The fact that you still classify things like that, I can't take that seriously, just a silly joke of yours. 
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Originally posted by Psychedelic Paul Psychedelic Paul wrote:


David asked the question and I answered it as honestly as I could. If you don't like the answer, that's just too bad. Big smile

that's a rude thing to say. 
I do not like the answer because it's inaccurate. 
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Points: 40182 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Psychedelic Paul Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 17 2022 at 04:41
Originally posted by Cristi Cristi wrote:

Originally posted by Psychedelic Paul Psychedelic Paul wrote:


1967-1979: Classic Prog
Post-1970's: Neo Prog

And that was it! Big smile

this was not funny two years ago, it's not funny today either.
But it's true! That's how we used to classify Progressive Rock on YouTube Episodes & Music back in 2013-2015. We didn't have any of the additional prog categories we have here such as Crossover Prog, Eclectic Prog or Heavy Prog, etc, etc.

It wasn't just a Progressive Rock music site though - it was an all-music site with 20 parent genres of music and 200 sub-genres, but with only two sub-genres for prog:-
 Classic Prog & Neo Prog. Smile

David asked the question and I answered it as honestly as I could. If you don't like the answer, that's just too bad. Big smile


Edited by Psychedelic Paul - August 17 2022 at 04:55
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Points: 43679 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Cristi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 17 2022 at 04:32
Originally posted by Psychedelic Paul Psychedelic Paul wrote:


1967-1979: Classic Prog
Post-1970's: Neo Prog

And that was it! Big smile

this was not funny two years ago, it's not funny today either.
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Psychedelic Paul View Drop Down
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Points: 40182 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Psychedelic Paul Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 17 2022 at 04:26
Originally posted by David_D David_D wrote:


Paul, I'm curious about your way of classifying. Smile
We had a very simple way of classifying Progressive Rock when I used to run my own music site:-

1967-1979: Classic Prog
Post-1970's: Neo Prog

And that was it! Big smile
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Points: 15131 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote David_D Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 17 2022 at 03:34

Paul, I'm curious about your way of classifying. Smile
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Originally posted by David_D David_D wrote:

Originally posted by suitkees suitkees wrote:

Originally posted by David_D David_D wrote:

If you define Progressive Rock close to mainstream Rock, it can be difficult to see the difference - which would be not good for Progressive Rock.

To my knowledge, genre definitions have never influenced artistic creation (be it music or other artistic expressions). Music influences music, and different artistic works can influence other artistic works, even crossing artistic expressions (i.e. films can inspire music, music can inspire paintings, literature can inspire music, etc.). I really think you are radically overestimating the importance of "genre definitions" regarding their influence on artistic expression itself: it is not the definitions that influence artistic works, it is the artistic works that influence other artistic works (which, in turn, may lead to and/or reformulate a genre definition...).
Genres are by nature very ill defined and never have clear boundaries (and definitely no static boundaries). Trying to come to rigid definitions will lead to include or exclude works that we would intuitively exclude/include.

Would it be okay for you to quote this post of yours in my blog "How to define and classify Progressive Rock?", and maybe continue this discussion there?

Originally posted by suitkees suitkees wrote:

^ Yes, that's OK. It is better suited there if you want to continue on it.

Suitkees' post quoted here was written in the thread "Top 100 all-time as rated on RYM and PA", 12 August 2022.

Thank you very much, Suitkees, for this very good post of yours, and however this discussion will be continued or not here, I'm very glad of this post.
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But it might be a help to read my article again. 
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Originally posted by earlyprog earlyprog wrote:

Originally posted by David_D David_D wrote:

Thank you very much for this input of yours, Earlyprog, and I'll think about how to relate to it. Smile

No worries, that's ok. Perhaps too overwhelming even after 3 days 

I'm afraid, it is. Big smile
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Originally posted by David_D David_D wrote:


Thank you very much for this input of yours, Earlyprog, and I'll think about how to relate to it. Smile







No worries, that's ok. Perhaps too overwhelming even after 3 days 
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Originally posted by earlyprog earlyprog wrote:

^Too generic in my opinion, David. Only option ruled out is the obvious status quo.

I would have hoped for a more informative conclusion/status after several months and pages into your blog.

Seems that you are back to scratch.

Well, I don't think about it that way, and anyway, that's how I have moved, and it's a longer story to explain why.
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Originally posted by nick_h_nz nick_h_nz wrote:

And prog dares you
To change our way of
Thinking about it…
But Nick, I'm curious about why you want to define Progressive Rock as including as you do.


Edited by David_D - August 10 2022 at 15:21
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^Too generic in my opinion, David. Only option ruled out is the obvious status quo.

I would have hoped for a more informative conclusion/status after several months and pages into your blog.

Seems that you are back to scratch.
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Originally posted by nick_h_nz nick_h_nz wrote:

.........
And prog dares you
To change our way of
Thinking about it…
Originally posted by David_D David_D wrote:

I can tell that by now I'm in doubt about what to find being the best use of the term Progressive Rock, and I may become in favour of the double way you use, but which would be though:

1. A less including one, much similar to RYM's, which I guess is best corresponding to the historically and today mostly used one, so it can be called "Progressive Rock proper".
2. A more including one, and the way I've suggested to define Progressive Rock in my article here, which uses the term Prog as a meta-genre.
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Originally posted by Psychedelic Paul Psychedelic Paul wrote:

Or he could have been there because his car tyres were Under Pressure. Tongue

thanks, Paul Smile
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