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Rearrange PA top 20 to your personal tastes |
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nick_h_nz 
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Prog Metal / Heavy Prog Team Joined: March 01 2013 Location: Suffolk, UK Status: Offline Points: 6737 |
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 Topic: Rearrange PA top 20 to your personal tastesPosted: November 07 2021 at 06:56 |
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At the moment, 19 of these are still in the top 20, but Wobbler is not. That album is presently sitting at 25, and Rush’s Hemispheres is in the 20th spot. So, with that in mind: 01: In the Court of the Crimson King 02: Wish You Were Here 03: Larks Tongues in Aspic 04: Pawn Hearts 05: Godbluff 06: Red 07: Animals 08: Foxtrot 09: Mirage 10: Per un Amico 11: Hemispheres 12: Nursery Cryme 13: Selling England by the Pound 14: Thick as a Brick 15: Relayer 16: Moonmadness 17: Close to the Edge 18: Moving Pictures 19: Dark Side of the Moon 20: Fragile Despite owning all of these, very few of them would be in my own top 20, and even where there might be a possibility that some of the bands might feature in my own list, it would not be these albums. I am, however, well aware that my own preferences are just that - and I’m equally aware of how well and universally loved these albums are. That most are in the top 20 is hardly surprising. |
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King Crimson776
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Joined: October 12 2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 2779 |
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Posted: November 07 2021 at 03:04 |
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In the Court of the Crimson King Selling England by the Pound Foxtrot Moonmadness Mirage Larks' Tongues in Aspic Red Pawn Hearts Godbluff Per Un Amico Close to the Edge Fragile Thick as a Brick Nursery Cryme Wish You Were Here The Dark Side of the Moon Animals Relayer Moving Pictures From Silence to Somewhere
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iluvmarillion
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Posted: October 24 2021 at 00:11 |
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I was asking myself the same question. The other 19 albums I could line up in any order it wouldn't matter.
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jamesbaldwin
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Joined: September 25 2015 Location: Milano Status: Offline Points: 6052 |
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Posted: October 21 2021 at 17:37 |
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After seeing the gnosis website, and their (complicated) way of drawing up the ranking, I tried to formulate my (provisional) ranking here
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Amos Goldberg (professor of Genocide Studies at the Hebrew University in Jerusalem): Yes, it's genocide. It's so difficult and painful to admit it, but we can no longer avoid this conclusion.
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Sacro_Porgo
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Posted: October 19 2021 at 15:01 |
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PF's exclusion definitely strikes me as odd. Maybe their experts are all too big of snobs to acknowledge Floyd's greatness. :p
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Porg for short. My love of music doesn't end with prog! Feel free to discuss all sorts of music with me. Odds are I'll give it a chance if I haven't already! :)
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Sacro_Porgo
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Posted: October 19 2021 at 14:59 |
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That's better! :)
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Porg for short. My love of music doesn't end with prog! Feel free to discuss all sorts of music with me. Odds are I'll give it a chance if I haven't already! :)
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Nogbad_The_Bad
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RIO/Avant/Zeuhl & Eclectic Team Joined: March 16 2007 Location: Boston Status: Offline Points: 21324 |
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Posted: October 19 2021 at 14:27 |
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Meddle is the highest rated Floyd album at 11.84 (out of 15) whereas Il Balletto in 20th is 12.4 CAN - Tago Mago is rated 11.4, Ege Bamyasi 11.25, Future Days 11.27, Babaluma 10.54 My personal CAN ranking are all higher than that. There's a real range on CAN, there are 15 ratings of 14 or 15 on Tago Mago which is perfection and near perfection. There's also a bunch of 6, 7, 8 & 9's.
Edited by Nogbad_The_Bad - October 19 2021 at 14:27 |
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Ian
Host of the Post-Avant Jazzcore Happy Hour on Progrock.com https://podcasts.progrock.com/post-avant-jazzcore-happy-hour/ |
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Nogbad_The_Bad
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Posted: October 19 2021 at 14:18 |
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I think there must be a bug in their algorithm, Red should sit in 13th between Foxtrot and Hhai based on its rating, not sure why it didn't appear.
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Ian
Host of the Post-Avant Jazzcore Happy Hour on Progrock.com https://podcasts.progrock.com/post-avant-jazzcore-happy-hour/ |
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Lewian
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Posted: October 19 2021 at 13:55 |
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Hmmm, did the filters filter out some stuff that counts as prog around here? I have no issues with the Italians, but Pink Floyd should for sure be represented, shouldn't they? Another thing I agree unsurprisingly with the RYM folks is that Can should be in there. Hybris better than Tago Mago (or for those who have issues with the second album Ege Bamyasi, Future Days, or Babaluma)? I ask you.
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Sacro_Porgo
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Posted: October 19 2021 at 12:46 |
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Incredibly interesting list! I dare say that's a great list for anyone looking to seriously get in to prog, who maybe knows some of the most popular classics already. I will also say, it pains me to see Larks Tongues at the top when Red is no where in sight! I love both, mind you.
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Porg for short. My love of music doesn't end with prog! Feel free to discuss all sorts of music with me. Odds are I'll give it a chance if I haven't already! :)
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Logan
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Posted: October 19 2021 at 12:43 |
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^ thanks for the list. Been ages since I visited Gnosis. That list definitely is much more interesting to me than PA's and RYM's. So much on it that I value very highly. I wonder how ELP fares?
 My favourite Prog reviews site was Ground & Sky. |
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Nogbad_The_Bad
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Posted: October 19 2021 at 12:24 |
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Gnosis has a ranking system where their 110 or so 'experts' rate albums so you get more of a curated ranking. If I filter that down to the top prog albums with lots of ratings (>30) I get a top 20 of:-
1. King Crimson - Larks Tongues In Aspic 2. PFM - Per Un Amico 3. Banco - Darwin! 4. Hatfield & The North - Rotters Club 5. Anglagard - Hybris 6. VDGG - Pawn Hearts 7. Yes - CTTE 8. Banco - Io Sono Nato Libero 9. Hatfield & The North - s/t 10. National Health - Of Queues & Cures 11. PFM - Storia Di Un Minuto 12. Genesis - Foxtrot 13. Magma - HHai 14. Jethro Tull - Thick As A Brick 15. Gentle Giant - In A Glass House 16. Area - Arbeit Macht Frei 17. Gentle Giant - Octopus 18. Banco - s/t 19. Caravan - In The Land Of Grey & Pink 20. Il Balletto di Bronzo - Ys Interesting list, they sure like their Italians
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Ian
Host of the Post-Avant Jazzcore Happy Hour on Progrock.com https://podcasts.progrock.com/post-avant-jazzcore-happy-hour/ |
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Cristi
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Crossover / Prog Metal Teams Joined: July 27 2006 Location: wonderland Status: Offline Points: 45691 |
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Posted: October 19 2021 at 08:31 |
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ok, was just wondering, no harm done, I even put that LOL emoticon to point out I am kidding (little bit)
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Logan
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Posted: October 19 2021 at 08:23 |
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We've been discussing a variety of issues. One might think of ELP as having become a sort of nexus when it comes to issues around ratings and rankings. There are indeed other bands and albums, there are also other threads if people aren't appreciating the discussion here. And people can still post their rearrangement of the top 20 if they like (I already did a bit of what little of the top 20 I tend to play, which is really only Pawn Hearts over the last decade). I like it often when conversation doesn't just try to stick narrowly to one topic but twists, digresses, changes and evolves as seems natural to me when people get together socially. Some people seem very keep-on-topic as a principal, even when it comes to fizzling out topics by other people where the OP hasn't expressed concern, and even when the OP has switched gears due to conversation in the thread I've seen complaints about moving off-topic. I have enjoyed taking part in the discussion with people here very much, much more than I would arranging and re-arranging that list. My two cents.
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jamesbaldwin
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Posted: October 19 2021 at 05:41 |
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When I say that a ranking is "serious" I don't mean that it is objective. In fact, I wrote that I think the rankings of Scaruffi, Ondarock and Mucchio Selvaggio are serious: but they are very different from each other! I consider serious what is done according to a criterion, for example: 1) the beauty of music, 2) the historical importance 3) a compromise between the two previous ones. But I know well that, for example, establishing the beauty of music is a subjective operation, which also depends on the personality of the person who evaluates it, on his propensity for certain emotions and not others. And this is where the different evaluations of music critics come from. In addition, I consider serious or not a ranking afterwards: if a prog ranking has 4 albums of PF (or Genesis, to say the best known bands) in the first 7 places I do not consider it serious. If it already had 4 albums (for example) by Henry Cow in the first 7, it would already deserve some study to understand the logic. I prefer the rankings made by the editors/collaborators of a site to those of anonymous voters who pass by. I consider them more thoughtful, more serious, especially if clear criteria are established. The ranking of the editorial staff of a site is not OBJECTIVE, it is the average of personal judgments. Then it's strange that on this site, where rankings matter a lot, collaborators say they don't care about rankings. For example, in the last t ten years the rankings have increased: every year the collaborators make a ranking of the best albums or rather, I correct myself: a ranking of their FAVORITE albums, if I understand correctly. Above this thread we find the Collaborators' Top Album Archive which includes the collaborators' rankings o of the fave albums of the last 10 years, and above again the Collaborators' Top Album of 2020. (here, in my opinion, the criterion of "favorite" is rather vague, and I would not know how to interpret it) And in this ranking the first 10 albums are highlighted, so it is a ranking baed on different levels like that of the Italian magazine Mucchio Selvaggio that I have already mentioned. So in the last 10 years the collaborators have decided to make rankings year by year (so far I have not participated because I listen to few contemporary prog records). The ranking of collaborators for the decade 2011-2020 could already be published on the site, if collaborators wanted. Edited by jamesbaldwin - October 19 2021 at 05:46 |
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Amos Goldberg (professor of Genocide Studies at the Hebrew University in Jerusalem): Yes, it's genocide. It's so difficult and painful to admit it, but we can no longer avoid this conclusion.
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Lewian
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Posted: October 19 2021 at 04:51 |
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@Lorenzo: I agree with most of your concerns about "popularity rankings", be they on rateyourmusic or here. However I'm wary of an assumption that seems to be underlying your arguments, which is that objectivity in rankings is possible, at least to the extent that somehow rankings could be assessed as better ("more serious") or worse in any objective manner. I don't buy that. I think that with rateyourmusic we get problems, with "good experts only" we get other problems. It's all more of a game really, which of course has some use and some justification, but we'd be well advised to not take it too seriously..
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Cristi
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Posted: October 19 2021 at 04:27 |
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this has become an ELP thread
 kinda off topic already, there are other bands and albums...
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Rick1
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Posted: October 19 2021 at 04:06 |
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Well, Danny Baker made the case for ELP in last year's Prog magazine much more eloquently than I ever could.
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Logan
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Posted: October 18 2021 at 22:57 |
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^ Maybe I should try again. I do like the debut and various other ELP music (hardly a hater -- I was very into Trilogy at one time). A big yes on your opinion regarding people caring so much about what the charts reflect, and too often it seems that people don't understand what it reflects or is intended to reflect. It's a rather silly rabbit hole I have often gone down in discussion -- spend too much time arguing about things I don't care about sometimes.
I respect ELP more than I appreciate it and still think of it as the quintessential Prog act -- warts and all. ;) They made some lovely and fun music.I love this ELP cover: |
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siLLy puPPy
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PSIKE, JRF/Canterbury, P Metal, Eclectic Joined: October 05 2013 Location: SFcaUsA Status: Offline Points: 15344 |
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Posted: October 18 2021 at 22:37 |
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^ totally agree with you regarding ELP however the last time i went on a marathon and listened to the first four albums i actually liked them better than i ever had in the past. They were clearly prog innovators and their popularity surely made prog bigger than it may have been otherwise but they just don't rank high for me on my personal charts and i suspect many others feel the same hence the lower ranking of albums on charts compared to their contemporaries. Personally i think too many put too much energy into caring what those charts reflect!
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 https://rateyourmusic.com/~siLLy_puPPy |
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omphaloskepsis wrote: