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What was the first "modern" prog rock album?
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ForestFriend View Drop Down
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    Posted: May 04 2019 at 12:16
I think prog and metal have always been a little intertwined. Even in early prog, there's a lot of heavy riffing (Schizoid Man, Peel The Paint, Heart Of The Sunrise, etc.), and early metal bands had a focus on longer, instrumental sections, big dynamic contrasts, fantastical lyrical content - and by the late 70s a huge emphasis on guitar virtuosity (think guys like Van Halen, Randy Rhoads, Yngwie Malmsteen, etc.). Iron Maiden doesn't really stand out to me as being way more prog than other metal bands (more prog than the average glam metal band, sure).
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I can't imagine anyone living in the UK in the '70s not being influenced by Genesis, Yes, ELP, Tull, Floyd, etc.
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Originally posted by richardh richardh wrote:

Originally posted by dr wu23 dr wu23 wrote:

Originally posted by richardh richardh wrote:

Something by Iron Maiden ( The Number Of The Beast is the obvious one but could easily go Powerslave , Somewhere In Time or Seventh Son). Tracks like Phantom Of The Opera and Ryme Of The Ancient Mariner were certainly way more than just 'metal'. I remember reading in the 80's an interview with IM after Seventh Son Of A Seventh Son where they considered themselves to be a prog band just like Yes, Genesis etc and not a branch of Heavy Rock ( ie Zep , Sabbath etc) . I'm not sure I really agreed at the time but now it makes sense. Prog has moved in a heavier direction generally. Maiden were ahead of the game maybe?

Do you recall where you read that article where Maiden in the 80's...said they were prog more than metal..?
Just curious.
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I can barely recall yesterday but this sticks in my mind because it was surprising to me at the time. Probably read it in Kerrang which I was occasionally reading at the time.

Thanks......I just thought that was a bit strange since everyone I know offline that like Maiden think they are a 'metal band'....with a few prog hints.
But I am aware that Harris is a huge fan of prog.
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If you read the Iron Maiden biography, Harris lists Close to the Edge and Selling England by the Pound as two of his favorite albums and influences on his writing...
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Originally posted by dr wu23 dr wu23 wrote:

Originally posted by richardh richardh wrote:

Something by Iron Maiden ( The Number Of The Beast is the obvious one but could easily go Powerslave , Somewhere In Time or Seventh Son). Tracks like Phantom Of The Opera and Ryme Of The Ancient Mariner were certainly way more than just 'metal'. I remember reading in the 80's an interview with IM after Seventh Son Of A Seventh Son where they considered themselves to be a prog band just like Yes, Genesis etc and not a branch of Heavy Rock ( ie Zep , Sabbath etc) . I'm not sure I really agreed at the time but now it makes sense. Prog has moved in a heavier direction generally. Maiden were ahead of the game maybe?

Do you recall where you read that article where Maiden in the 80's...said they were prog more than metal..?
Just curious.
Smile
 

I can barely recall yesterday but this sticks in my mind because it was surprising to me at the time. Probably read it in Kerrang which I was occasionally reading at the time.
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Originally posted by richardh richardh wrote:

Something by Iron Maiden ( The Number Of The Beast is the obvious one but could easily go Powerslave , Somewhere In Time or Seventh Son). Tracks like Phantom Of The Opera and Ryme Of The Ancient Mariner were certainly way more than just 'metal'. I remember reading in the 80's an interview with IM after Seventh Son Of A Seventh Son where they considered themselves to be a prog band just like Yes, Genesis etc and not a branch of Heavy Rock ( ie Zep , Sabbath etc) . I'm not sure I really agreed at the time but now it makes sense. Prog has moved in a heavier direction generally. Maiden were ahead of the game maybe?

Do you recall where you read that article where Maiden in the 80's...said they were prog more than metal..?
Just curious.
Smile
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Judging from most suggestions here "modern prog" is a combination of a few slightly complex heavy metal-tunes and a simplified and poppier version of 70's prog - with synths. Doesn't sound right to me. Neo prog and sophisticated NWOBHM has more of a "last romantics during the beginning of modernism"-feel, than an actual birth or rebirth of anything.


Edited by Saperlipopette! - May 02 2019 at 12:16
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Iron Maiden bass player Harris was a considerable prog-head...so good call...
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Something by Iron Maiden ( The Number Of The Beast is the obvious one but could easily go Powerslave , Somewhere In Time or Seventh Son). Tracks like Phantom Of The Opera and Ryme Of The Ancient Mariner were certainly way more than just 'metal'. I remember reading in the 80's an interview with IM after Seventh Son Of A Seventh Son where they considered themselves to be a prog band just like Yes, Genesis etc and not a branch of Heavy Rock ( ie Zep , Sabbath etc) . I'm not sure I really agreed at the time but now it makes sense. Prog has moved in a heavier direction generally. Maiden were ahead of the game maybe?
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Originally posted by ForestFriend ForestFriend wrote:

Originally posted by AFlowerKingCrimson AFlowerKingCrimson wrote:

I never really thought of Bjork as prog. Kate Bush is prog related maybe imo but that's about it. I think she's crossover prog on here but I'm not sure. I suppose that fits her too.


This is the difficulty with a discussion like this. Either something resembles the early 70s music we know as prog, and we write it off as sounding too retro, or it sounds nothing like it and we write off as not being prog.

Bjork not being retro has pretty much nothing to do with it. Does her music have qualities that fit the traditional definition of prog? That is to say long instrumental passages, a focus on the music(ie composition) and not just songs in general, tight musicianship, odd time signtatures etc? It doesn't have to sound like old prog much(if at all)it just has to fit the general description and be considered prog according to the template that made it different which is what set prog apart from other music in the first place. I don't just mean sound but also construction of the music. Based on what I've heard Bjork's music does not fall within the general prog guidelines. Is her music quirky and different from most other "mainstream music?" Sure, but so was XTC, The Tubes and a lot of other bands. It doesn't make them prog. Art rock sure but not true prog imo. Something can be progressive(which I'm sure Bjork is)without being prog rock. Yes, I know Bjork is on this site but so is Tori Amos. 

I guess it's all irrelevant to this topic anyway since the first Bjork album came out around 1993 or so which makes her a little late to the party regardless of we want to define her music.  


Edited by AFlowerKingCrimson - May 01 2019 at 11:20
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Originally posted by AFlowerKingCrimson AFlowerKingCrimson wrote:

I never really thought of Bjork as prog. Kate Bush is prog related maybe imo but that's about it. I think she's crossover prog on here but I'm not sure. I suppose that fits her too.


This is the difficulty with a discussion like this. Either something resembles the early 70s music we know as prog, and we write it off as sounding too retro, or it sounds nothing like it and we write off as not being prog.
My prog band - Boreal Kinship
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Saga, maybe It Bites, Toto, Talking Heads (maybe), Ozric Tentacles, 
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I never really thought of Bjork as prog. Kate Bush is prog related maybe imo but that's about it. I think she's crossover prog on here but I'm not sure. I suppose that fits her too.
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I would also say that Kate Bush and Bjork are vaulble candiades of people whom were not derivative of 70s influence but still new it and incorporated art rock into their song writing. i bet that is easyer in Singer-songwriting
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When it comes to new forms of prog in the early '80s outside of the first bits of neo-prog it would have to be avant-prog... Dün, This Heat and Kultivator might be good here, and you've also got Univers Zero, Art Zoyd, Present, Etron Fou Leloublan and Aksak Maboul creating their new wave around this time even though they're a bit too early for your criteria. Thinking Plague maybe?
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Originally posted by BaldFriede BaldFriede wrote:

The first album of Mother Gong's "Robot Woman" trilogy came out 1981. Most definitely a modern prog album. Their 1979 album "Fairy Tales" was still firmly old school though.

Sadly, this is an album that is under represented and not heard, and I think that a lot of folks do not like some of the acting in it by Daevid Allen to help create the story for the album, which is incredible, and a very "feminist" concern, for women ... something that a lot of men are threatened with a lot more than they might care to admit!

Gilli's albums, in general, are quite with it ... and many times her words are just so strong and with it, as to make one cry ... hearing her welcome the magick brothers and mystic sisters (more than once, but never better than in one album!), and then in so many other albums, adds something to the GONG trilogy and in general to the whole commune at the time, when it seems that the women were submissive, and when they wanted their freedom, they became witches ... in the end, nothing was farther from the truth, and Gilli, bless her heart, was one at its forefront!

NP: Mother Gong -- WILD CHILD


Edited by moshkito - April 24 2019 at 21:59
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^ Well, like I said I amended my initial statement just a tad.
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Originally posted by AFlowerKingCrimson AFlowerKingCrimson wrote:

Originally posted by siLLy puPPy siLLy puPPy wrote:

^ that was 1977!

UK's first album was 78. 

1313 was 77. UK was 78 but still both are 70s!

The TRUE answer is the album that was released TODAY and yet haven't heard Wink

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Originally posted by siLLy puPPy siLLy puPPy wrote:

^ that was 1977!

UK's first album was 78. 


Edited by AFlowerKingCrimson - April 24 2019 at 18:27
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Originally posted by Nogbad_The_Bad Nogbad_The_Bad wrote:

Well now its clearly Univers Zero - 1313 or UK - s/t

Tongue

No, no. You can't change your answer. Give someone else a chance. ;) Besides UK is very old prog sounding isn't it? With a touch of fusion? 


Edited by AFlowerKingCrimson - April 24 2019 at 17:41
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