Rush: How did they conquer the 80's with integrity

I'm no expert, but I'd have to assume that their early Led Zeppelin-esque hard rock sound coupled with the success of 2112 were effective. 2112 had a 20-minute prog epic, yes, but it also had such radio songs as Passage to Bangkok, Lessons, Tears etc.

I think Genesis departed more from their 70's roots than Rush did. Loosing two main members, it seems Genesis had to do something to keep going. We all know Phil Collins has a pop side to him (More Fool Me, Mad Man Moon, Follow You Follow Me) and he took over as the flavor of Genesis, but they did it well enough to attract another legion of fans.

To me Yes with 90125 and Big Generator, were closer to what Rush did but Yes were more commercially accepted, by that I mean on the FM radio. Rush still did not dominate the FM radio waves, but only with Tom Sawyer and Spirit of Radio, the rest of the success was still via album sales and droves of under ground fans, mainly the prog community.

Back then it seemed if you dominated the FM dial PLUS music videos on MTV, you were a commercial pop success. Gosh, I remember seeing the Yes videos played over and over and over...Rush not into music videos.

Bottom line I think Rush incorporated the "new wave 80s" sound into their music just enough to keep it fresh but not fall off the edge like people view Genesis and Yes did. Rush lyrics were still based on albums like Hemispheres, AFTK and 2112....whereas Genesis and Yes were writing more about love and feelings, emotions and relationships.

The Police and these other new wave bands had that in their lyrics, but Rush picked up on the music side, the sound that they were making and incorporated that into their 80's albums. The progressive and hard rock/metal fans obviously liked it and made them some of their best selling albums....There is some amazing music on those albums.

Rush 80's music was great, even if I had discovered them with A Farewell To Kings, then Hemispheres, Caress of Steel etc, I never felt let down by the turn they took at the turn of the 80's, I embraced it quite readily. First of all it was quite gradual, slowly progressing with each album to a more accessible and yet elaborated sound. And yes, they went into a more accessible territory but they never fell into the easy pop-sounding verse-chorus format. Rush was the example of how to get accessible while not compromising the music quality. I also have the impression that they did never seek explicitly for pop-hits, while other bands clearly did. Rush seeked for some airplay and popularity but never at the expense of doing crap.

The members of Rush have always been savvy enough to connect to the popular trends of music at any one time. This allows them to put a production sheen on their songwriting, which in turn makes the album sound like a product of its times. Since we are talking about popular music, the passages of these times in incredibly fast. Yet, they maintain a sophisticated and skilled approach to songwriting, both in terms of lyrics and music, so the listener hears a nice balance between timelessness and timeliness. The 80s was not the only time they did this. Roll the Bones followed the recent ascendance of rap in popular music, while Test for Echo was grungey. Perhaps the two most egregious examples, but they bring the practice out in the open.

Rednight wrote: Catcher10 wrote: I think Genesis departed more from their 70's roots than Rush did. Loosing two main members, it seems Genesis had to do something to keep going. We all know Phil Collins has a pop side to him (More Fool Me, Mad Man Moon, Follow You Follow Me) and he took over as the flavor of Genesis, but they did it well enough to attract another legion of fans. To me Yes with 90125 and Big Generator, were closer to what Rush did but Yes were more commercially accepted, by that I mean on the FM radio. Rush still did not dominate the FM radio waves, but only with Tom Sawyer and Spirit of Radio, the rest of the success was still via album sales and droves of under ground fans, mainly the prog community. Back then it seemed if you dominated the FM dial PLUS music videos on MTV, you were a commercial pop success. Gosh, I remember seeing the Yes videos played over and over and over...Rush not into music videos. Bottom line I think Rush incorporated the "new wave 80s" sound into their music just enough to keep it fresh but not fall off the edge like people view Genesis and Yes did. Rush lyrics were still based on albums like Hemispheres, AFTK and 2112....whereas Genesis and Yes were writing more about love and feelings, emotions and relationships. The Police and these other new wave bands had that in their lyrics, but Rush picked up on the music side, the sound that they were making and incorporated that into their 80's albums. The progressive and hard rock/metal fans obviously liked it and made them some of their best selling albums....There is some amazing music on those albums. As for Mad Man Moon reflecting some kind of "pop side," FOOEY! The song is perhaps the proggiest number on A Trick of the Tail, argueably Collins' finest vocal performance on record, and the band's greatest epic since the departure of the Gabe-Meister.

Everyone here knows that Genesis is my #2 all time favorite band...behind Rush. I love all eras of Genesis, its brilliant music..prog or no prog, I'm not that stuck up on that point.

That song can easily be a FM radio friendly song, meaning a pop song, because of how Phil Collins delivers it. Unlike a Rush song say like Losing It or Different Strings, which I have never heard on the radio and would never make a radio playlist, they have no pop flavor to them.

Certainly Mad Man Moon is not the progiest song on that album. And I am not sure I understand, you say the song is their greatest epic since the departure of Peter Gabriel??

Maybe I misunderstand that part....

Catcher10 wrote: Rednight wrote: Catcher10 wrote: I think Genesis departed more from their 70's roots than Rush did. Loosing two main members, it seems Genesis had to do something to keep going. We all know Phil Collins has a pop side to him (More Fool Me, Mad Man Moon, Follow You Follow Me) and he took over as the flavor of Genesis, but they did it well enough to attract another legion of fans. To me Yes with 90125 and Big Generator, were closer to what Rush did but Yes were more commercially accepted, by that I mean on the FM radio. Rush still did not dominate the FM radio waves, but only with Tom Sawyer and Spirit of Radio, the rest of the success was still via album sales and droves of under ground fans, mainly the prog community. Back then it seemed if you dominated the FM dial PLUS music videos on MTV, you were a commercial pop success. Gosh, I remember seeing the Yes videos played over and over and over...Rush not into music videos. Bottom line I think Rush incorporated the "new wave 80s" sound into their music just enough to keep it fresh but not fall off the edge like people view Genesis and Yes did. Rush lyrics were still based on albums like Hemispheres, AFTK and 2112....whereas Genesis and Yes were writing more about love and feelings, emotions and relationships. The Police and these other new wave bands had that in their lyrics, but Rush picked up on the music side, the sound that they were making and incorporated that into their 80's albums. The progressive and hard rock/metal fans obviously liked it and made them some of their best selling albums....There is some amazing music on those albums. As for Mad Man Moon reflecting some kind of "pop side," FOOEY! The song is perhaps the proggiest number on A Trick of the Tail, argueably Collins' finest vocal performance on record, and the band's greatest epic since the departure of the Gabe-Meister. Everyone here knows that Genesis is my #2 all time favorite band...behind Rush. I love all eras of Genesis, its brilliant music..prog or no prog, I'm not that stuck up on that point. That song can easily be a FM radio friendly song, meaning a pop song, because of how Phil Collins delivers it. Unlike a Rush song say like Losing It or Different Strings, which I have never heard on the radio and would never make a radio playlist, they have no pop flavor to them. Certainly Mad Man Moon is not the progiest song on that album. And I am not sure I understand, you say the song is their greatest epic since the departure of Peter Gabriel?? Maybe I misunderstand that part....

How all perfectly smug. And Mad Man Moon is played to death on FM radio, second only to Bad Company's Rock and Roll Fantasy. And what is the proggiest song on 'Tail', hmm? I'd love to hear your answer. Also, name your post-Gabriel epic for the band-I'm all eyes.

Rednight wrote: Catcher10 wrote: Rednight wrote: Catcher10 wrote: I think Genesis departed more from their 70's roots than Rush did. Loosing two main members, it seems Genesis had to do something to keep going. We all know Phil Collins has a pop side to him (More Fool Me, Mad Man Moon, Follow You Follow Me) and he took over as the flavor of Genesis, but they did it well enough to attract another legion of fans. To me Yes with 90125 and Big Generator, were closer to what Rush did but Yes were more commercially accepted, by that I mean on the FM radio. Rush still did not dominate the FM radio waves, but only with Tom Sawyer and Spirit of Radio, the rest of the success was still via album sales and droves of under ground fans, mainly the prog community. Back then it seemed if you dominated the FM dial PLUS music videos on MTV, you were a commercial pop success. Gosh, I remember seeing the Yes videos played over and over and over...Rush not into music videos. Bottom line I think Rush incorporated the "new wave 80s" sound into their music just enough to keep it fresh but not fall off the edge like people view Genesis and Yes did. Rush lyrics were still based on albums like Hemispheres, AFTK and 2112....whereas Genesis and Yes were writing more about love and feelings, emotions and relationships. The Police and these other new wave bands had that in their lyrics, but Rush picked up on the music side, the sound that they were making and incorporated that into their 80's albums. The progressive and hard rock/metal fans obviously liked it and made them some of their best selling albums....There is some amazing music on those albums. As for Mad Man Moon reflecting some kind of "pop side," FOOEY! The song is perhaps the proggiest number on A Trick of the Tail, argueably Collins' finest vocal performance on record, and the band's greatest epic since the departure of the Gabe-Meister. Everyone here knows that Genesis is my #2 all time favorite band...behind Rush. I love all eras of Genesis, its brilliant music..prog or no prog, I'm not that stuck up on that point. That song can easily be a FM radio friendly song, meaning a pop song, because of how Phil Collins delivers it. Unlike a Rush song say like Losing It or Different Strings, which I have never heard on the radio and would never make a radio playlist, they have no pop flavor to them. Certainly Mad Man Moon is not the progiest song on that album. And I am not sure I understand, you say the song is their greatest epic since the departure of Peter Gabriel?? Maybe I misunderstand that part.... How all perfectly smug. And Mad Man Moon is played to death on FM radio, second only to Bad Company's Rock and Roll Fantasy. And what is the proggiest song on 'Tail', hmm? I'd love to hear your answer. Also, name your post-Gabriel epic for the band-I'm all eyes.

I'm good thanks.....this is a Rush thread not a Genesis thread. You can go and start a Genesis ATotT thread if you want to find out peoples opinion of that album.

[How all perfectly smug. And Mad Man Moon is played to death on FM radio, second only to Bad Company's Rock and Roll Fantasy. And what is the proggiest song on 'Tail', hmm? I'd love to hear your answer. Also, name your post-Gabriel epic for the band-I'm all eyes.]

Well I don't know where you live but I have NEVER heard "mad man moon" on FM radio. Maybe you are thinking of "follow you follow me." That is the one that gets over played.

As for favorite post Gabriel epic my vote might go to Dukes Travel's/Dukes End although there are a few. At one point "home by the sea/second home by the sea" was my favorite Genesis song period. Now it's lucky if it makes my top twenty. Anyway, how did we get on the topic of Genesis. I thought this was about RUSH.

Edited by Prog_Traveller - September 10 2014 at 11:44

Ok. Well your sarcasm went over my head. Maybe because you didn't use any winkies. ;) Yeah, let's stick to RUSH for this thread. :)

Yes and Genesis wrote great complex music, followed by overall decent pop-prog music. Rush wrote inadequate 'complex' music, followed by good streamlined prog tunes. So part of it is that the former bands fell quite a ways whereas Rush got better. There's also the fact that Rush's style of prog was suited to the 80's, and that they never got as outright 'poppy' as albums like Genesis, 90125 etc.

Edited by King Crimson776 - September 11 2014 at 01:02