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VanVanVan
Prog Reviewer
Joined: October 08 2009
Status: Offline
Points: 756
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Posted: April 10 2011 at 22:30 |
The Dark Elf wrote:
NecronCommander wrote:
Haha, well that was an entertaining reply. Though it still seems that everyone is falling back on the whole "growling" defense. Get original, folks!
In response, yes, I can tell the difference between different people growling. I could discern Mikael Akerfeldt's growls from Greg Puciato's roars from Tommy Rogers's screams from Brent Hinds's bellows. They make sense to me, and to some people they don't. Probably the same way you could be able to tell the difference between a warbly keyboard solo from Bill Bruford and one from Kerry Minnear when I couldn't. That's fine bud, I get that they aren't for everyone, we've done this whole thing before. Knocking the whole genre because of the singing is a pretty stupid thing to do, especially when the focus is on the rest of the music. |
*Bows*
Thank you for a civil reply to my snarky commentary. At least you have a sense of humor. In regards to the "falling back on the whole 'growling' defense', it is an insurmountable wedge that drives me from these bands. I cannot listen to it. I find it campy and ridiculously over-the-top. It does nothing for the composition; in fact, it detracts from the music altogether. In addition, It is done by so many bands of so many "metal" genres as to utterly lack in originality (hence my questioning the entire "progressive" title of these bands).
A progression can be defined as moving away from accepted modes of operation, but the inane growling has been done for decades now; ergo, it is not original. And when you say, quite rightfully, that "the focus is on the rest of the music", I would say the stupid thing is that growling like Linda Blair possessed occurs so often in the compositions of these bands as to constitute an anchor that each of these performers drags around with them. It is an unnecessary impediment in what possibly might be a much larger group of fans listening to the music. Unfortunately, until this lunacy is ended and someone actually has the balls to break the mold and actually "progresses", then there will always be a gulf between us. |
Well, to be fair, you could say the same thing about any style of singing.
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"The meaning of life is to give life meaning."-Arjen Lucassen
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Any Colour You Like
Prog Reviewer
Joined: May 15 2009
Status: Offline
Points: 12294
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Posted: April 10 2011 at 22:37 |
Rhetorical slides are fun fun fun fun
Pickin' my arguments in the front seat Ignorin' my logical gaps in the back
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Equality 7-2521
Forum Senior Member
Joined: August 11 2005
Location: Philly
Status: Offline
Points: 15784
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Posted: April 10 2011 at 22:37 |
The Dark Elf wrote:
Equality 7-2521 wrote:
I'd rather listen to a warthog than Phil Collin's whiney rat voice.
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That is, of course, your option and your preference. I am sure there are many splendid zoos in your area where you can commune with your guttural side. As far as Phil Collins, I haven't cared for his work since Wind & Wuthering. Very commendable drummer though. |
And everything you said has been your opinion. I fail to see your point.
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"One had to be a Newton to notice that the moon is falling, when everyone sees that it doesn't fall. "
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The Dark Elf
Forum Senior Member
VIP Member
Joined: February 01 2011
Location: Michigan
Status: Offline
Points: 13321
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Posted: April 10 2011 at 22:58 |
Equality 7-2521 wrote:
The Dark Elf wrote:
Equality 7-2521 wrote:
I'd rather listen to a warthog than Phil Collin's whiney rat voice.
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That is, of course, your option and your preference. I am sure there are many splendid zoos in your area where you can commune with your guttural side. As far as Phil Collins, I haven't cared for his work since Wind & Wuthering. Very commendable drummer though. |
And everything you said has been your opinion. I fail to see your point. |
You see, this is how it works: you give your opinion, I give mine. If our opinions are irreconcilable (as would be the case here, obviously), then we agree to disagree and move on. Or we could engage in a several post debate that may or may not be beneficial to anybody reading it. Usually, no one budges from their original premise, but it may be entertaining when colorful words get tossed about.
That is the only point of forums such as these.
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...a vigorous circular motion hitherto unknown to the people of this area, but destined to take the place of the mud shark in your mythology...
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Equality 7-2521
Forum Senior Member
Joined: August 11 2005
Location: Philly
Status: Offline
Points: 15784
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Posted: April 10 2011 at 23:04 |
Actually the point of the forum is to mock other people's opinions and pack as many non-sequiturs into a post as possible.
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"One had to be a Newton to notice that the moon is falling, when everyone sees that it doesn't fall. "
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The Dark Elf
Forum Senior Member
VIP Member
Joined: February 01 2011
Location: Michigan
Status: Offline
Points: 13321
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Posted: April 10 2011 at 23:09 |
Equality 7-2521 wrote:
Actually the point of the forum is to mock other people's opinions and pack as many non-sequiturs into a post as possible. |
Then you indeed have forum posting down to a science. Like this post, for instance:
Equality 7-2521 wrote:
WOW nice one racist. |
Talk about a pointless and objectionable comment.
Edited by The Dark Elf - April 10 2011 at 23:13
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...a vigorous circular motion hitherto unknown to the people of this area, but destined to take the place of the mud shark in your mythology...
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The Dark Elf
Forum Senior Member
VIP Member
Joined: February 01 2011
Location: Michigan
Status: Offline
Points: 13321
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Posted: April 10 2011 at 23:21 |
NecronCommander wrote:
The Dark Elf wrote:
NecronCommander wrote:
Haha, well that was an entertaining reply. Though it still seems that everyone is falling back on the whole "growling" defense. Get original, folks!
In response, yes, I can tell the difference between different people growling. I could discern Mikael Akerfeldt's growls from Greg Puciato's roars from Tommy Rogers's screams from Brent Hinds's bellows. They make sense to me, and to some people they don't. Probably the same way you could be able to tell the difference between a warbly keyboard solo from Bill Bruford and one from Kerry Minnear when I couldn't. That's fine bud, I get that they aren't for everyone, we've done this whole thing before. Knocking the whole genre because of the singing is a pretty stupid thing to do, especially when the focus is on the rest of the music. |
*Bows*
Thank you for a civil reply to my snarky commentary. At least you have a sense of humor. In regards to the "falling back on the whole 'growling' defense', it is an insurmountable wedge that drives me from these bands. I cannot listen to it. I find it campy and ridiculously over-the-top. It does nothing for the composition; in fact, it detracts from the music altogether. In addition, It is done by so many bands of so many "metal" genres as to utterly lack in originality (hence my questioning the entire "progressive" title of these bands).
A progression can be defined as moving away from accepted modes of operation, but the inane growling has been done for decades now; ergo, it is not original. And when you say, quite rightfully, that "the focus is on the rest of the music", I would say the stupid thing is that growling like Linda Blair possessed occurs so often in the compositions of these bands as to constitute an anchor that each of these performers drags around with them. It is an unnecessary impediment in what possibly might be a much larger group of fans listening to the music. Unfortunately, until this lunacy is ended and someone actually has the balls to break the mold and actually "progresses", then there will always be a gulf between us. |
I hadn't thought of what you said about the growling being unoriginal, and you may be right on that, but that's also because it's a staple of metal. It wouldn't be metal (well, sometimes) without the growls, any less than it would be symphonic prog without the Mellotron. Some things are kind of essential to the music.
Also, more often than not, I think you'll find that for the good majority of the heavy bands on this website can effectively use both clean and harsh vocals to convey different moods. Look at Opeth: Akerfeldt has a beautiful clean voice and they fit wonderfully with the clean passages in their music, but when they need to bring the rain with the heaviness, nothing else would work but a deep, guttural roar. That's one of the cool things about progressive metal bands is that most of them realize that there is a purpose to these different stylings, unlike most metal bands who do growl just for the sake of the convention of growling.
Even then, for the most part the growling is just a textural thing with the music. The growling is anchored around the music, not the other way around. And metal isn't meant to be an accessible genre, the music is supposed to be challenging and difficult to listen to, but rewarding to the people who adapt to its stylings. |
Yes, Akerfeldt has quite a nice voice when he actually chooses to sing. As for me, the guttural roars are so stereotypical of the entire genre and multiplicity of sub-genres that it invariably results in a roll of the eyes and switching to the next song.
Thanks for the dialogue. You are passionate about your music. I just can't share that passion.
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...a vigorous circular motion hitherto unknown to the people of this area, but destined to take the place of the mud shark in your mythology...
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zbida
Forum Senior Member
Joined: January 16 2006
Location: Poland
Status: Offline
Points: 748
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Posted: April 11 2011 at 02:31 |
Is there any plan for Genesis to escape from such polls?
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Equality 7-2521
Forum Senior Member
Joined: August 11 2005
Location: Philly
Status: Offline
Points: 15784
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Posted: April 11 2011 at 08:29 |
The Dark Elf wrote:
Equality 7-2521 wrote:
Actually the point of the forum is to mock other people's opinions and pack as many non-sequiturs into a post as possible. |
Then you indeed have forum posting down to a science. Like this post, for instance:
Equality 7-2521 wrote:
WOW nice one racist. |
Talk about a pointless and objectionable comment. |
You posted something that made no sense, so I responded with something similar.
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"One had to be a Newton to notice that the moon is falling, when everyone sees that it doesn't fall. "
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Snow Dog
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: March 23 2005
Location: Caerdydd
Status: Offline
Points: 32995
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Posted: April 11 2011 at 08:38 |
Equality 7-2521 wrote:
The Dark Elf wrote:
Equality 7-2521 wrote:
Actually the point of the forum is to mock other people's opinions and pack as many non-sequiturs into a post as possible. |
Then you indeed have forum posting down to a science. Like this post, for instance:
Equality 7-2521 wrote:
WOW nice one racist. |
Talk about a pointless and objectionable comment. |
You posted something that made no sense, so I responded with something similar.
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Thanks...I was wondering what the racist comment was about.
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lucas
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: February 06 2004
Location: France
Status: Offline
Points: 8138
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Posted: April 11 2011 at 08:44 |
mathcore vs progressive rock ?
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"Magma was the very first gothic rock band" (Didier Lockwood)
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Prog Geo
Forum Senior Member
Joined: November 09 2010
Location: Athens (Greece)
Status: Offline
Points: 2555
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Posted: March 04 2016 at 14:11 |
Dillinger
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Sonorous Meal show every Sunday at 20:00 (greek time) on http://www.justincaseradio.com
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Cristi
Special Collaborator
Crossover / Prog Metal Teams
Joined: July 27 2006
Location: wonderland
Status: Offline
Points: 46372
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Posted: March 04 2016 at 14:28 |
Genesis
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Tom Ozric
Prog Reviewer
Joined: September 03 2005
Location: Olympus Mons
Status: Offline
Points: 15926
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Posted: March 05 2016 at 16:05 |
'Growling' vocals may be cool when you're a teenager, but they are kinda ridiculous, and perhaps even a bit silly at 40-something - having said, I am loving many bands with Growls, but more so for the music than the vocals. I can tolerate it, I know it takes a lot of technique to achieve properly, and, well, Extreme music needs Extreme singing. Even Beardfish had a go at it on 'The Void', and it came across quite novel.
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Pastmaster
Forum Senior Member
Joined: January 23 2015
Location: Spiderwood Farm
Status: Offline
Points: 1774
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Posted: March 05 2016 at 16:31 |
I vote Dillinger. I like a handful of Genesis songs, but I've never really been a fan. Not a huge Dillinger fan either, but I really do love the "One of Us is the Killer" album.
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dr wu23
Forum Senior Member
Joined: August 22 2010
Location: Indiana
Status: Offline
Points: 20696
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Posted: March 05 2016 at 22:28 |
Never heard of the Dillinger Escape Plan band, but John Dillinger escaped from our local jail back in the day and Depp filmed in our town for that part from Public Enemy.
Edited by dr wu23 - March 05 2016 at 22:28
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One does nothing yet nothing is left undone. Haquin
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Tom Ozric
Prog Reviewer
Joined: September 03 2005
Location: Olympus Mons
Status: Offline
Points: 15926
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Posted: March 05 2016 at 22:47 |
^ Google 'em now - you'll be blasted with a few bars of Mathcore, hysterical screaming, then a few bars of Fripp-like intricacy, then some thrash, and maybe throw in some Djent, and that's just the first minute............
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PrognosticMind
Forum Senior Member
Joined: August 02 2014
Location: New Hampshire
Status: Offline
Points: 1195
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Posted: March 06 2016 at 04:52 |
Is this real life?
Genesis.
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"A squid eating dough in a polyethylene bag is fast and bulbous. Got me?"
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Frenetic Zetetic
Forum Senior Member
Joined: December 09 2017
Location: Now
Status: Offline
Points: 9233
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Posted: April 03 2018 at 02:50 |
Genesis
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"I am so prog, I listen to concept albums on shuffle." -KMac2021
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Mortte
Forum Senior Member
Joined: November 11 2016
Location: Finland
Status: Offline
Points: 5538
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Posted: April 03 2018 at 02:55 |
Is this joke?
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