40th Anniversary of Bill Bruford leaving Yes
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Topic: 40th Anniversary of Bill Bruford leaving Yes
Posted By: Adams Bolero
Subject: 40th Anniversary of Bill Bruford leaving Yes
Date Posted: July 19 2012 at 17:50
On July 19th 1972 Bill Bruford left Yes and joined King Crimson: ------------- ''Nobody realizes that some people expend tremendous energy merely to be normal.'' - Albert Camus |
Replies:
Posted By: Horizons
Date Posted: July 19 2012 at 18:16
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Smartest decision he made. ------------- Crushed like a rose in the riverflow. |
Posted By: smartpatrol
Date Posted: July 19 2012 at 18:34
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I'm glad he left. he was vital in making some of the best Yes albums ever, but without him we woulden't have such great KC albums such as red and Three of a Perfect Pair ------------- http://bit.ly/1kqTR8y" rel="nofollow">  The greatest record label of all time! |
Posted By: Dellinger
Date Posted: July 19 2012 at 18:45
| I'm not so sure, really, if I prefer his leaving Yes or not... I guess I'll never truly know. What he achieved with King Crimson was great, and indeed his playing in King Crimson was even more amazing than in Yes. But then, some of my favourite albums ever are Fragile and Close to the Edge, and I might wonder if they might have come closer to that again if he had stayed... or at least if the next 2 or 3 albums might have had much better drumming (imagine Relayer with Bruford on Drums). Still, perhaps Bruford was right when he said Yes had reached their height with CttE, and he couldn't achieve much more by staying in the band. However, we must enjoy what we do have, and that's a bunch of really awsome albums, both by King Crimson and Yes, with and without Bruford. |
Posted By: Slartibartfast
Date Posted: July 19 2012 at 18:49
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For me both bands benefited.
------------- Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened... 
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Posted By: Man With Hat
Date Posted: July 19 2012 at 18:57
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Damn! Talk about some people here feeling old. Guess I'll have to play some Bruford KC to commemorate. ------------- Dig me...But don't...Bury me I'm running still, I shall until, one day, I hope that I'll arrive Warning: Listening to jazz excessively can cause a laxative effect. |
Posted By: Fox On The Rocks
Date Posted: July 19 2012 at 20:35
 Austin, I totally agree. Don't get me wrong, I absolutely love Yes, but it always seemed Bruford was held back in Yes, not to mention him and Squire never got along. In fact, I heard somewhere they borderline got into a fistfight on stage over some disagreement. Squire's a bit of hothead though, that's not really a surprise. In King Crimson though, that's where Bruford really let loose and showed off his unique style and approach. The partnership between Bill and David Muir on Larks' is extraordinary. Larks' to Three Of A Perfect Pair - inspiration drum records. ------------- 
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Horizons wrote:Posted By: richardh
Date Posted: July 20 2012 at 01:53
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The line up that made CTTE and Fragile was pretty much untouchable. In a way Bruford leaving because Yes had reached its peak was a self fulfilling prophecy. For me Yes were never as good again although they made several more excellent albums after his departure with various different line ups. |
Posted By: CPicard
Date Posted: July 20 2012 at 13:15
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The two bands should have merged. |
Posted By: BlackenedGass
Date Posted: July 20 2012 at 15:38
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I can't imagine Jon Anderson singing Schizoid Man or songs like Exiles or Starless. And I DEFINITELY can't imagine John Wetton singing songs like Close To The Edge or Roundabout! Would have been interesting to see what King Yes would have come up with though.... |
Posted By: dr prog
Date Posted: July 20 2012 at 17:40
| Wetton era Crimson is overrated. I'd rather him in Yes because Yes made all their best albums while Bruford was there. |
Posted By: tamijo
Date Posted: July 20 2012 at 17:51
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Why want him there if he wanted to leave. He is an artist, not a sparepart. ------------- Prog is whatevey you want it to be. So dont diss other peoples prog, and they wont diss yours |
Posted By: dr prog
Date Posted: July 20 2012 at 17:58
| He moved to a band which wouldn't let him use cymbals because the guitarist didn't think he could hear his guitar well enough |
Posted By: Horizons
Date Posted: July 20 2012 at 18:00
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He moved to a better band, for him and in general. I think that's pretty smart. ------------- Crushed like a rose in the riverflow. |
Posted By: dr prog
Date Posted: July 20 2012 at 19:50
From a band who could compose to a band who couldn't really compose. Not better for me
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Posted By: darkshade
Date Posted: July 20 2012 at 20:09
You're right. Songs like Starless, Frakture, and Red are not well composed pieces of music. ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/MysticBoogy" rel="nofollow - My Last.fm 
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Posted By: dr prog
Date Posted: July 20 2012 at 20:13
Only 3 songs from about 20 from that era you can mention? Frakture is pretty repetitive really. Starless and Red are the best tracks from that album, but I don't go crazy over them like most do in here
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Posted By: darkshade
Date Posted: July 20 2012 at 20:25
Yes, because I didn't feel like listing every song that King Crimson has created that is well composed. I ain't got that kind of time. ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/MysticBoogy" rel="nofollow - My Last.fm
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Posted By: infocat
Date Posted: July 20 2012 at 20:51
------------- -- Frank Swarbrick Belief is not Truth. |
Posted By: Epignosis
Date Posted: July 20 2012 at 21:13
2007 my first child was born. More important to me. ------------- https://epignosis.bandcamp.com/album/a-month-of-sundays" rel="nofollow - https://epignosis.bandcamp.com/album/a-month-of-sundays |
Posted By: Epignosis
Date Posted: July 20 2012 at 21:15
Slart and I agree.  Check the temperature in hell! Which I don't believe exists!  ------------- https://epignosis.bandcamp.com/album/a-month-of-sundays" rel="nofollow - https://epignosis.bandcamp.com/album/a-month-of-sundays |
Posted By: Epignosis
Date Posted: July 20 2012 at 21:16
But, *ahem*, this was the more important comment:
2007 my first child was born. More important to me. ------------- https://epignosis.bandcamp.com/album/a-month-of-sundays" rel="nofollow - https://epignosis.bandcamp.com/album/a-month-of-sundays |
Posted By: Dellinger
Date Posted: July 22 2012 at 21:13
About Schizoid Man I absolutley agree, but with Exiles and Starless he might actually have sounded better. But for me, that's not particularly difficult, I really love those two songs, but Wetton's vocals rather put me a bit off... I guess the perfect choice, for me, for singing those two songs would have been Lake (weirdly enough, I like the way Wetton sings Schizoid Man better than the original version with Lake). However, back with Schizoid Man, I do feel Jon Anderson wouldn't have been very good singing that song, but he did sing on South Side of the Sky... so perhaps, just perhaps, he might have pulled out Schizoid Man nicely. |
Posted By: Sympathy Orchestra
Date Posted: August 02 2012 at 21:25
I completely agree.  ------------- www.thesympathyorchestra.com |
Posted By: Queen By-Tor
Date Posted: August 03 2012 at 00:56
In a thread titled 40th Anniversary of Bill Bruford leaving Yes
Yes. This is completely relevant. Read
Trololol. Go spend time with your child(ranz) instead of posting on the internet  |
Posted By: Sagichim
Date Posted: August 03 2012 at 05:10
| I'm glad he moved to Crimson, it's not like Yes fell apart after his departure, they still managed to create some great music. About Crimson they really pulled out an ace, together with Bruford they were really a force. |
Posted By: Mr. Maestro
Date Posted: August 03 2012 at 23:05
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Here's an amusing little quote I found in the King Crimson article on TV Tropes: "In Yes, there was an endless debate about should it be F natural in the bass with G sharp on top by the organ. In King Crimson... you were just supposed to know." - Bill Buford ------------- "I am the one who crossed through space...or stayed where I was...or didn't exist in the first place...." |
Posted By: smartpatrol
Date Posted: August 03 2012 at 23:10
------------- http://bit.ly/1kqTR8y" rel="nofollow"> The greatest record label of all time! |
Posted By: smartpatrol
Date Posted: August 03 2012 at 23:12
f**k load of necklaces on Fripp ------------- http://bit.ly/1kqTR8y" rel="nofollow"> The greatest record label of all time! |
Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: August 04 2012 at 00:25
^  Yeah, I remember that from "Prog Rock Britannia". Who the hell did he think he was, a rapper?
Try "to a band that could improvise". ... pf.
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Posted By: rogerthat
Date Posted: August 04 2012 at 02:54
| He certainly benefited immensely from the move. I wonder if we would have ever seen or even known of such a fantastic improvisational side to him had he carried on in Yes. He was brilliant with Yes already but Red album has some of the most expressive drumming of that era. |
Posted By: richardh
Date Posted: August 04 2012 at 10:38
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Posted By: Dellinger
Date Posted: August 04 2012 at 14:14
Well, I easily prefer composition over improvisation. |
Posted By: smartpatrol
Date Posted: August 04 2012 at 14:24
I don't think Wetton's in that pic. I think it's L-R: Fripp, Muir, Bruford, Cross. ------------- http://bit.ly/1kqTR8y" rel="nofollow"> The greatest record label of all time! |
Posted By: richardh
Date Posted: August 04 2012 at 16:30
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Posted By: prog4evr
Date Posted: August 04 2012 at 17:27
Perfectly stated! I agree wholeheartedly...
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Posted By: dr prog
Date Posted: August 04 2012 at 18:40
Improvising is for concerts.
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Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: August 04 2012 at 21:04
| ^ Why is that, if I may ask? |
Posted By: richardh
Date Posted: August 05 2012 at 04:47
| Providence is probably the only improvised studio track I like so Crimson could seemingly do this (although Moonchild still leaves me cold) |
Posted By: Long_john_s
Date Posted: August 05 2012 at 14:27
The Problem with KC and improvising is their lack of improvisation-skill. Although I love KC, I've never liked their improvisation-tracks because they all sound rather directionless and sloppy to me . Compare a track like moonchild with Hymn To Him from Mahavishnu and see how it should be: an epic composition mixed with fine improvisation.
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Posted By: rogerthat
Date Posted: August 05 2012 at 19:27
| ^^^ It's not necessary to improvise only in tracks structured for improvisation, though. KC simply follow the rule of not playing every note the same way again so even in more composed tracks like One More Red Nightmare, actually especially on that track, the quality of playing is very improvised and organic. |
Posted By: Tapfret
Date Posted: August 05 2012 at 20:31
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He didn't really "leave". He just went on hiatus until Yes did something truly profound. So he returned to make Union. ------------- https://www.last.fm/user/Tapfret" rel="nofollow">  https://bandcamp.com/tapfret" rel="nofollow - Bandcamp |
Posted By: wehpanzer
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 14:25
LOL - he might do OK with it...at least the Prince Rupert section...
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Posted By: ProgMetaller2112
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 18:17
 I don't like Easy Money what the f**k were they mocking Yes, did Bill have anything to do about it  Bill as much as I love his drumming and talents can come across a douchbag.He talks about Yes in a condescending way and gives way too much credit to King Crimson Yes is has always and will always be better than King Crimson Compare Close To The Edge or Relayer to say Larks Tongues or Red it's not even close. Yes wins all the way. I guess Yes wanted to show him up. Sound Chaser. Bill Bruford who????  We don't need that prick ------------- “War is peace. Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength.” ― George Orwell, Nineteen Eighty-Four "Ignorance and Prejudice and Fear walk Hand in Hand"- Neil Peart |
Posted By: ProgMetaller2112
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 18:24
here is someone who gets it dr prog you are  ------------- “War is peace. Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength.” ― George Orwell, Nineteen Eighty-Four "Ignorance and Prejudice and Fear walk Hand in Hand"- Neil Peart |
Posted By: ProgMetaller2112
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 18:26
And Union is truly profound ???  . Bill is a prick sorry had to say it  ------------- “War is peace. Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength.” ― George Orwell, Nineteen Eighty-Four "Ignorance and Prejudice and Fear walk Hand in Hand"- Neil Peart |
Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 18:29
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Posted By: ProgMetaller2112
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 18:31
yeah yeah so can Yes, Sound Chaser and The Ancient obliterate any of KC's work ------------- “War is peace. Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength.” ― George Orwell, Nineteen Eighty-Four "Ignorance and Prejudice and Fear walk Hand in Hand"- Neil Peart |
Posted By: ProgMetaller2112
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 18:33
Improvise, Shnookums  Improvise theirs are actually good ------------- “War is peace. Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength.” ― George Orwell, Nineteen Eighty-Four "Ignorance and Prejudice and Fear walk Hand in Hand"- Neil Peart |
Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 18:33
| ^ Whatever works for you. And don't patronize me. |
Posted By: ProgMetaller2112
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 18:36
you have done the same ------------- “War is peace. Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength.” ― George Orwell, Nineteen Eighty-Four "Ignorance and Prejudice and Fear walk Hand in Hand"- Neil Peart |
Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 18:36
| ^ How? |
Posted By: ProgMetaller2112
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 18:37
by getting upset and calling me shnookums, I suggest you look back into the great arguments we had  ------------- “War is peace. Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength.” ― George Orwell, Nineteen Eighty-Four "Ignorance and Prejudice and Fear walk Hand in Hand"- Neil Peart |
Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 18:39
| ^ Then I must have had a reason for it, right? Either way, that does not give you a reason to be the smaller man. Be the bigger man. |
Posted By: ProgMetaller2112
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 18:40
I have a reason here just look at the posts on this thread ------------- “War is peace. Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength.” ― George Orwell, Nineteen Eighty-Four "Ignorance and Prejudice and Fear walk Hand in Hand"- Neil Peart |
Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 18:42
| ^ You have a reason to be the smaller man? |
Posted By: ProgMetaller2112
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 18:42
Aww sh*t look at my main man the pimp Tyga Fripp ------------- “War is peace. Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength.” ― George Orwell, Nineteen Eighty-Four "Ignorance and Prejudice and Fear walk Hand in Hand"- Neil Peart |
Posted By: ProgMetaller2112
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 18:43
Yes we are talking about how Yes actually do good improves listen to 5 per cent for Nothing, Cans and Brahms,Sound Chaser, and The Ancient just like you had a reason to be a smaller man it all makes sense to me ------------- “War is peace. Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength.” ― George Orwell, Nineteen Eighty-Four "Ignorance and Prejudice and Fear walk Hand in Hand"- Neil Peart |
Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 18:44
| ^ You have no idea what I mean by "smaller man", do you? |
Posted By: ProgMetaller2112
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 18:46
sinking down to someone else's level I'm guessing ------------- “War is peace. Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength.” ― George Orwell, Nineteen Eighty-Four "Ignorance and Prejudice and Fear walk Hand in Hand"- Neil Peart |
Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 18:46
| ^ "Smaller", not "same". But you are close. So, you were saying that you wanted to be the smaller man? And you had a reason for that? |
Posted By: ProgMetaller2112
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 18:49
and your point is? ------------- “War is peace. Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength.” ― George Orwell, Nineteen Eighty-Four "Ignorance and Prejudice and Fear walk Hand in Hand"- Neil Peart |
Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 18:50
| ^ You avoided my questions. |
Posted By: ProgMetaller2112
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 18:50
I thought I answered your questions? ------------- “War is peace. Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength.” ― George Orwell, Nineteen Eighty-Four "Ignorance and Prejudice and Fear walk Hand in Hand"- Neil Peart |
Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 18:52
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Posted By: ProgMetaller2112
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 18:53
you're losing me here, Andrey------------- “War is peace. Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength.” ― George Orwell, Nineteen Eighty-Four "Ignorance and Prejudice and Fear walk Hand in Hand"- Neil Peart |
Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 18:56
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^
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Posted By: Tom Ozric
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 19:00
| Why don't we just start another thread called '40th Anniversary of Bill Bruford joining King Crimson'...........then we can avoid the Yes vs Crimso arguments. I thought this is supposed to be a happy place........ |
Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 19:03
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^ Then the Yes vs. KC arguments will resurface again. Also, in order to keep PA as a happy place, everyone (and I mean everyone) has to put the right amount of effort into doing it.* * Go on, call me a utopianist.
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Posted By: ProgMetaller2112
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 19:05
I didn't want to be the smaller man it just happened ------------- “War is peace. Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength.” ― George Orwell, Nineteen Eighty-Four "Ignorance and Prejudice and Fear walk Hand in Hand"- Neil Peart |
Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 19:08
| ^ Make a note of this conversation we just had. |
Posted By: Tom Ozric
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 19:08
| ..........or why not - '40th Anniversary of Jamie Muir joining AND leaving King Crimson'............??? |
Posted By: thellama73
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 19:11
I love you guys.  P.S. For the record, KC is better than Yes. ------------- 
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Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 19:12
^ Oh, c'mon!
On a more relevant note: as Austin (Horizons) was saying (and I'll back him up again), the KC niche was a better place for Bill. In "Prog Rock Britannia" he admitted that he probably should have kickstarted his career as a jazz drummer, not as a rock drummer, ... which is also the reason why he put up with KC a long time ago and just stuck with jazz. Whatever serves him right.
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Posted By: Eria Tarka
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 19:14
My thoughts exactly |
Posted By: Eria Tarka
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 19:19
Correct me if I'm wrong but I don't believe Cans n' Brahms was improv. Also, you are entitled to limeYes more than KC but, I don't think there's any denying that KC was far superior to Yes in the realm of improv. |
Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 19:20
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Posted By: Tom Ozric
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 19:22
| I love Lark's Tongues in Aspic................the album, not the witch's concoction.......... |
Posted By: thellama73
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 19:24
Witch's concoction? That's a legitimate meal! I went through a phase last year where I made a bunch of aspics, but alas I was unable to procure any larks' tongues. -------------
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Posted By: Tom Ozric
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 19:29
 ??? I know cat food (cat food cat food AGAIN !!) has pilchards in aspic but I never thought that Larks' Tongues would be a delicacy........sounds like something straight out of a black-magic cookbook.......
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Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 19:31
 Looks delicious to me. Where is it from, some Western-European cuisine?
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Posted By: thellama73
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 19:34
I have a Latin cookbook with a recipe for larks' tongues (It begins "Catch 1000 larks. Remove tongues. Discard larks.") so I always assumed it was an ancient Roman dish. -------------
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Posted By: Tom Ozric
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 19:36
That doesn't look like the cover of the Crimson album I have  .......and it doesn't even look tasty at all (to me)......
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Posted By: Tom Ozric
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 19:39
| I intend on releasing an album called 'two all beef patties, special sauce, lettuce, cheese, pickles and onions on a sesame seed bun in aspic' sometime next year........ |
Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 19:40
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^ Too yello for the jello.
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Posted By: Tom Ozric
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 19:50
| ...................and it will have an eccentric percussionist featured............ |
Posted By: ProgMetaller2112
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 21:46
 I disagree------------- “War is peace. Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength.” ― George Orwell, Nineteen Eighty-Four "Ignorance and Prejudice and Fear walk Hand in Hand"- Neil Peart |
Posted By: ProgMetaller2112
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 21:47
I guess you missed it was in Prog Rock Britannia ------------- “War is peace. Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength.” ― George Orwell, Nineteen Eighty-Four "Ignorance and Prejudice and Fear walk Hand in Hand"- Neil Peart |
Posted By: Eria Tarka
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 21:50
Shocking |
Posted By: ProgMetaller2112
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 21:50
like this ------------- “War is peace. Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength.” ― George Orwell, Nineteen Eighty-Four "Ignorance and Prejudice and Fear walk Hand in Hand"- Neil Peart |
Posted By: Horizons
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 21:58
Just kidding they don't. ------------- Crushed like a rose in the riverflow. |
Posted By: ProgMetaller2112
Date Posted: February 08 2013 at 22:01
 ------------- “War is peace. Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength.” ― George Orwell, Nineteen Eighty-Four "Ignorance and Prejudice and Fear walk Hand in Hand"- Neil Peart |
Posted By: Slowdive
Date Posted: February 11 2013 at 14:57
| It's still tragic to me, because even though Crimson gained a phenomenal drummer, they always lacked in the vocal department without Lake. ELP has never been worth the power in vocals Lake brought to KC on their first two albums, and could've brought to the proceeding albums. |
Posted By: dr prog
Date Posted: February 11 2013 at 15:28
I played larks album recently and just didn't enjoy it much. The album has major holes I reckon. There's no kick ass compositions such as gentle giants playing the game or the runaway. Brilliant tracks. I only like wettons voice in the slow tracks. His voice sucks in easy money a bit |
Posted By: rdtprog
Date Posted: February 11 2013 at 16:03
i am just starting to read a french translation of his autobiography call "Bill Bruford, l'Autobiographie, Yes, King Crimson, Earthworks et le reste". by Aymeric Leroy. Plenty of fun read for a month at least.... ------------- Music is the refuge of souls ulcerated by happiness. Emile M. Cioran |
Posted By: Horizons
Date Posted: February 11 2013 at 18:17
That's like my favorite KC song.  ------------- Crushed like a rose in the riverflow. |
Posted By: Argonaught
Date Posted: February 11 2013 at 19:20
Please tell me these are NOT lark's tongues???? |
Posted By: Argonaught
Date Posted: February 11 2013 at 19:32
| I think in KC there was more breathing space for Bruford than it had ever been, or could have been in Yes. For one thing, Bruford gravitated towards jazz ... KC was a lot more jazzy than Yes. For another, in Yes the drummer somehow never was a primary player (I am glad the bassist was, though). |
Posted By: thellama73
Date Posted: February 11 2013 at 19:38
I have always been a bit mystified by the love Larks' Tongues gets around here. Don't get me wrong, it has it's moments and I am a big KC fan in general, but compared to their other works it has always struck me as a bit lackluster. The only track on it I really love is The Talking Drum. -------------
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Posted By: Dayvenkirq
Date Posted: February 11 2013 at 19:42
^ I always thought of four out of six tracks on the album as brothers, all heavy. The grooves, the sound of the guitar and the bass, masterful improvs and compositions. Bruford was definitely integral to that sound. A (mostly) dirty record, and that's why I like it.
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