The slow demise of Gentle Giant in the top 100
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Printed Date: February 23 2025 at 15:53
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Topic: The slow demise of Gentle Giant in the top 100
Posted By: BarryGlibb
Subject: The slow demise of Gentle Giant in the top 100
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 00:23
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I remember when I wasn't even a member of PA but had been looking at the site for a number of years before I joined and Gentle Giant had 5-6 albums in the top 100. Today they have 2 in the top 100 and I'm afraid that Free Hand is sitting precariously at 99 and will soon be pushed out. In A Glass House (at 42) is slowly sliding down the PA charts. Soon there will not be one Gentle Giant album in the top 100, which is outrageous considering their standing in the Prog community. My suggestion is that discussion should commence by the powers that be that the top 100 should be exclusively for albums that have been rated by a large number of individuals, not albums that have only be rated a busload of people. I suggest that albums in the top 100 should have at least 300 people rating it. I understand the algorithm rating but for example at present there are 50 albums in the top 100 that each have 300 members or less rating them; some even as low as 29 - 80 PA members rating them. Surely something must be done. Otherwise how are Prog youngsters ever going to revere Prog legends such as Gentle Giant if they end up not having one album in the top 100 in PA? Can we get something done about this? |
Replies:
Posted By: Henry Plainview
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 00:42
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I'm sorry, but I'm laughing too hard to write a rational response to this post. ------------- if you own a sodastream i hate you |
Posted By: GentleGiant
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 00:50
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Top 100 is not navel Earth
------------- BeGiantForADay "This British band is just the cup of tea for aficionados who demand virtuosity,progress and originality in their mix." http://rateyourmusic.com/~GentleG |
Posted By: BarryGlibb
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 00:52
Am I missing something here? |
Henry Plainview wrote:Posted By: Henry Plainview
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 01:11
Yes, self-awareness. Ok, I can't sleep I guess I can manage something. First of all, your claim that we need to modify the algorithm to protect Gentle Giant is absurd in every possible way. Glass House is hardly in a precarious position at 42, and why should we promote Gentle Giant over other bands that the rating base (apparently) likes more? I don't like Gentle Giant, and I really don't care that you do. Just as you don't care that I like Henry Cow and would not like us modifying the algorithm so that the number of ratings is less important so I can sneak one into the top 100. Should we also take pity on ELP because they only have one album in the top 100, and it's rated even lower than Glass House? Who decides what band is important enough to subvert their natural rating? And did you look at the result of knocking out everything under 300? It's a very very boring list with only about 25 bands represented because only the very big bands can get enough star-only ratings from random people to make it. The current list represents prog much more than 7 Gentle Giant, Genesis, King Crimson, and Pink Floyd albums. ------------- if you own a sodastream i hate you |
Posted By: BarryGlibb
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 01:27
Henry I don't think I like being dissed like this. I happen to have gret admniration for Henry Cow, Fred Frith etc. So you have good taste. I put this post up in good faith, just trying to contribute to the PA community. You seemed to like my Under appreciated Prog Spoon Player thread and I thought I had an ally. Not sure if that is so now.. I just feel that the top 100 is being infiltrated by albums that are only being rated by a few people (<100) that is all. And I put Gentle Giant in there as an example. |
Posted By: Slartibartfast
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 01:31
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You will see an inevitable decline in the ratings for the artists that no longer make new music. It's really no big deal.
------------- Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened... 
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Posted By: SaltyJon
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 01:36
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What he said (Henry and Slarti). I'm personally happy to see lesser-known bands making it onto the top 100. Of course, once they're there they're not quite as much "lesser-known" but still...diversity is a good thing. Gentle Giant will live without being in the top 100, and anyone who happens to click on the Eclectic Prog page will still be exposed to them since they have four albums in the Eclectic top 20.
------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Salty_Jon" rel="nofollow"> 
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Posted By: JJLehto
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 03:09
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Youngsters will find it the same way a lot of us probably did, through the internet. There is this giant progressive rock site I heard about what a very active forum. Besides, classics are classics. Anyone wanting to get into prog will come across GG I am sure... |
Posted By: Triceratopsoil
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 03:37
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Posted By: BarryGlibb
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 04:01
And? |
Posted By: darkshade
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 04:12
all of this ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/MysticBoogy" rel="nofollow - My Last.fm 
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Posted By: darkshade
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 04:14
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by the way, i thought this thread was about the slow demise of Gentle Giant. Period. I was going to say, it wasn't slow, it was actually quite fast 
------------- http://www.last.fm/user/MysticBoogy" rel="nofollow - My Last.fm
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Posted By: BarryGlibb
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 04:22
Yes it is fast and that is my point. Caravan & ELP have gone. Focus, VdG Generator, Rush, Camel and even much of Yes are heading in the same direction. i.e. South bound. |
Posted By: Mr ProgFreak
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 04:27
Actually the "prog community" is an ever changing group of people, and even if we could get a representative bunch of them to vote on "top album ever", it remains to be seen whether today Gentle Giant would be included. The problem is, among other things, that 100 albums is much too short a list to mention all great albums. I think the only way to ensure that Gentle Giant is in there would be to limit it - for example to albums of the 1970s, and to one album per artist. It just so happens that the signature service at Progfreak.com provides a great way of demonstrating this. To the left there's my top rated prog albums, in the middle they're narrowed down to one per artist, to the right they're also narrowed down to the 1970s.  ------------- https://tagyourmusic.org/users/Mike" rel="nofollow - https://tagyourmusic.org/users/Mike |
Posted By: The Hemulen
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 04:27
| It never ceases to amaze me how people can get so f**king worked up about a list. A list on the internet, no less. |
Posted By: JJLehto
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 04:37
Yes, quite amazing. And I wonder if he even bothered to read my response, sorry to sound self centered but I think it's pretty obvious a kid who wants to get into prog will find the classics, even if they are not in a silly list. Not only from this site, but type in progressive rock and the big name bands and classics will come up first... Besides, the site should be changed just so some bands you like can stay in the top 100? They may be classics, even essentials but it is what it is! If the site gets changed so you can keep your albums in the top 100 I demand its then altered in a way to put every Opeth album in the top 100. Why not, I think they are deserving. |
Posted By: BarryGlibb
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 04:47
Mr Trouserpress sir. "He" read your response.....and took note. I just didn't respond. All I'm doing is creating debate. I am not getting f**ing worked up about a list as has beeen suggested. All I'm saying is that albums are getting credit when 29 people have reviewed them as apposed > 300. I am not trying to creat a war here. Normally I'm a bit of a joker but I seemed to have touched a few nerves with this post. Which is good for democracy! |
Posted By: BarryGlibb
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 04:49
| The last post should have been to JJLehto. Sorry about that. |
Posted By: toroddfuglesteg
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 04:57
| Although Mount Everest is not visible from the Times Square in New York; does that means Mount Everest is a lesser mountain ? |
Posted By: Mr ProgFreak
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 05:03
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Interesting point. However, I think the original poster was complaining that the Times Square is presented as a place to look for mountains like Mount Everest. I somewhat agree - on a website like progARCHIVES.com, it would be nice to have a list of the top classic (1970s) prog albums around for newbies to check out. Or make it the top 100 most essential classic prog artists. And by that reasoning it's clear that the original poster simply tries to use the top 100 list for something that it's not. Which is perfectly understandable, but obviously can't work.
------------- https://tagyourmusic.org/users/Mike" rel="nofollow - https://tagyourmusic.org/users/Mike |
Posted By: toroddfuglesteg
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 05:08
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In this respect, we should put up a "ProgRock for newbies" list or article if we want to help out newbies. Just like a fly fisher or a golf website would put up a "xxxx for newbies" article. Then again; most people would find that patronising. Personally; I started in PA as a Genesis fan and expanded into music I did not even know excisted after my initial period here. Zeuhl for example. I cannot fail to notice that many others are following the path I took a couple of years ago. The same path as others followed long before I started in PA. I think the exploration element is a very important element of becoming a newbie member of PA. And no newbie-introduction help is needed here. Regarding Gentle Giant: I do believe the vast majority of newbies know who they are and what they stood for. |
Posted By: The Hemulen
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 05:17
But who would decide such a list? I'm wary of encouraging any notion of a fixed "consensus" on what is and isn't deemed worthy of someone's attention. The commendable thing about PA's top 100 is that it is an ever-shifting thing, continually reflecting the amalgamated opinions of an ever-shifting and expanding community. It's still incredibly flawed, but at least it doesn't reinforce some kind of indisputable, untouchable received opinion in which album X is forever a "classic" and albums Y and Z shall languish in eternity as "also-rans" regardless of how the community's attitude towards them may shift and develop over the years. Take my oh-so-beloved Cardiacs for example. When I joined this site many moons ago they were barely ever mentioned and had a very low level of appreciation, even amongst the avant-prog contingent. Their reputation on this site has snowballed in the last two or three years thanks to a few very vocal members championing them and an ever-increasing awareness of the band in the wider music community thanks to the internet and social media in particular. That increased awareness and reputation has resulted in one of their albums finally creeping into the PA top 100. That may infuriate some of the die-hards and purists, but it is at least a better (albeit still ultimately inaccurate) reflection of their current status within this community. |
Posted By: Mr ProgFreak
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 05:27
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^ There isn't one community - you'll always have factions that prefer avant-garde underdogs, factions that favor melodic mainstream stuff like Camel, then you have those who only like 70s stuff, people who focus on Neo-Prog or 90s retro prog, metal fans, fans of heavy prog, Italian etc.. So obviously it makes little sense to narrow the list by subjective preference of genre - narrowing by year/decade or limiting to one album per artist seem preferable to me, and, as I showed with the sig image, can shorten the list quite substantially, giving exposure to more artists. And it of course doesn't mean that the original list would have to disappear ... users should ideally decide for themselves which level of detail they want to see. ------------- https://tagyourmusic.org/users/Mike" rel="nofollow - https://tagyourmusic.org/users/Mike |
Posted By: Snow Dog
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 05:50
I don't agree that the top 100 should all have at least 300 ratings, but I do agree that maybe more weight in the algorithm could be allowed for such albums. ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Snow_Dog" rel="nofollow"> 
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Posted By: harmonium.ro
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 06:11
| Well prog didn't stop at 70s classics, and many people have many different tastes. If anyone wants to see a chart of the best classic (70s) albums, it can simply be done by changing the years in the chart generator from "All" to the preferred period. Maybe a shortcut could be implemented on the homepage to to link to this chart directly. |
Posted By: Epignosis
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 06:42
The algorithm already very much weights in favor of number of reviews. For example:
No disrespect intended to the OP, but for someone so concerned with Gentle Giant's place in the top 100 chart, you've only rated their albums:  ../artist.asp?id=118" rel="nofollow - GENTLE GIANT ../album.asp?id=1145" rel="nofollow - Acquiring The Taste (rating only) ../artist.asp?id=118" rel="nofollow - GENTLE GIANT ../album.asp?id=1154" rel="nofollow - Civilian (rating only) ../artist.asp?id=118" rel="nofollow - GENTLE GIANT ../album.asp?id=1149" rel="nofollow - Free Hand (rating only) ../artist.asp?id=118" rel="nofollow - GENTLE GIANT ../album.asp?id=1144" rel="nofollow - Gentle Giant
| ../Review.asp?id=393663" rel="nofollow - review ../artist.asp?id=118" rel="nofollow - GENTLE GIANT ../album.asp?id=11473" rel="nofollow - GG At The GG (rating only) ../artist.asp?id=118" rel="nofollow - GENTLE GIANT ../album.asp?id=1153" rel="nofollow - Giant For A Day (rating only) ../artist.asp?id=118" rel="nofollow - GENTLE GIANT ../album.asp?id=6946" rel="nofollow - Giant On The Box (rating only) ../artist.asp?id=118" rel="nofollow - GENTLE GIANT ../album.asp?id=18995" rel="nofollow - In A Glass House (rating only) ../artist.asp?id=118" rel="nofollow - GENTLE GIANT ../album.asp?id=1147" rel="nofollow - In A Glass House (rating only) ../artist.asp?id=118" rel="nofollow - GENTLE GIANT ../album.asp?id=1151" rel="nofollow - Interview (rating only) ../artist.asp?id=118" rel="nofollow - GENTLE GIANT ../album.asp?id=23752" rel="nofollow - King Alfred's College Winchester (rating only) ../artist.asp?id=118" rel="nofollow - GENTLE GIANT ../album.asp?id=1160" rel="nofollow - King Biscuit Flower Hour Presents (rating only) ../artist.asp?id=118" rel="nofollow - GENTLE GIANT ../album.asp?id=23953" rel="nofollow - Live In Stockholm '75 (rating only) ../artist.asp?id=118" rel="nofollow - GENTLE GIANT ../album.asp?id=616" rel="nofollow - Octopus (rating only) ../artist.asp?id=118" rel="nofollow - GENTLE GIANT ../album.asp?id=1150" rel="nofollow - Playing The Fool - The Official Live (rating only) ../artist.asp?id=118" rel="nofollow - GENTLE GIANT ../album.asp?id=10003" rel="nofollow - Scraping The Barrel (rating only) ../artist.asp?id=118" rel="nofollow - GENTLE GIANT ../album.asp?id=1152" rel="nofollow - The Missing Piece (rating only) ../artist.asp?id=118" rel="nofollow - GENTLE GIANT ../album.asp?id=1148" rel="nofollow - The Power And The Glory (rating only) ../artist.asp?id=118" rel="nofollow - GENTLE GIANT ../album.asp?id=1146" rel="nofollow - Three Friends (rating only) ../artist.asp?id=118" rel="nofollow - GENTLE GIANT ../album.asp?id=1163" rel="nofollow - Totally Out Of The Woods (rating only) ../artist.asp?id=118" rel="nofollow - GENTLE GIANT ../album.asp?id=1158" rel="nofollow - Under Construction (rating only)Ratings are weighted one time, while a review is rated ten times. If you truly wanted to "protect" GG's place in the top 100 (a silly goal, but there we are), then surely you would have begun writing reviews rather than creating a thread to overhaul the algorithm. ------------- https://epignosis.bandcamp.com/album/a-month-of-sundays" rel="nofollow - https://epignosis.bandcamp.com/album/a-month-of-sundays |
Posted By: toroddfuglesteg
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 06:47
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You said the truth, Epignosis. |
Posted By: clarke2001
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 08:38
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Barry, I'm afraid I agree with Henry and some other posters here. If you love Gentle Giant (as I do) I guess you had moments when you were listening their music and thinking 'oh my God, this music is out of this world, nothing can be compared to thier complexity and imagination' or something like that (at least I had such moments). However, it's just an list generated automatically by math calculations. While there's no denying ProgArchives is one of the most relevant things among Internet Prog Community, I'd say GG are treated well and people are aware of them: they're popping up frequently in forum discussions, and they're widely acknowledged as one of the most influential (one of the best if you want) prog bands in history. They are a household name, they are one of the most important names in Eclectic Prog (along VDGG and King Crimson) and will remain so in forthcoming years. Top 100 and similar lists just won't do certain artists justice. To put it up in another way: while a prog newbie who stumbled upon ProgArchives might be fooled by a Top 100 list as a god-given ultimate list at first; he or she, if continues to lurk on our forums, will very soon become aware of GG appreciation. And written words mean much more than listed numbers. ------------- |
Posted By: Tony R
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 08:59
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Posted By: Easy Livin
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 10:55
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I think Barry raises a point worthy of discussion. Not specifically about Gentle Giant, whom I personally feel are much less relevant in the history of prog than they are now credited with, but as regards the balance of high ratings vs. volume of reviews.
My concern on the volume front is that if I review a "popular" album and give it 1 star, I would not want that review to count towards the albums "popularity". I believe the algorithm we have offers a fair balance. mailto:M@x" rel="nofollow - M@x and a number of noted site members spent a lot of time looking at the best algorithm, and I think they got it right.
As i say though, it is a topic worthy of review from time to time.
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Posted By: caretaker
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 11:31
| I personally think it's fine like it is. And I think we underestimate the resourcefulness of the young guys. They can fend for themselves. |
Posted By: notesworth
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 12:13
There's already a list for 1967-1975 linked from the main charts page: http://www.progarchives.com/top-prog-albums.asp?ssubgenres=&salbumtypes=1&syears=1975&syears=1974&syears=1973&syears=1972&syears=1971&syears=1970&syears=1969&syears=1968&syears=1967&scountries=&sminratings=1&smaxratings=0&sminavgratings=0&smaxresults=50&x=56&y=4#list" rel="nofollow - http://www.progarchives.com/top-prog-albums.asp?ssubgenres=&salbumtypes=1&syears=1975&syears=1974&syears=1973&syears=1972&syears=1971&syears=1970&syears=1969&syears=1968&syears=1967&scountries=&sminratings=1&smaxratings=0&sminavgratings=0&smaxresults=50&x=56&y=4#list Gentle Giant has four albums in the 1967-1975 list.
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Posted By: darkshade
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 12:18
i was talking about GG's career  ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/MysticBoogy" rel="nofollow - My Last.fm
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Posted By: crimhead
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 13:57
^ This. I miss Gentle Giant but I don't lose any sleep over them only having one album in the Top 100. |
Posted By: Angelo
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 14:12
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I guess the topic starter would have had a point, if not for what Easy Livin' already wrote, plus the fact that the Top-100 is hardly the only source of information and suggestions new users have for finding out about prog.
------------- http://www.iskcrocks.com" rel="nofollow - ISKC Rock Radio I stopped blogging and reviewing - so won't be handling requests. Promo's for ariplay can be sent to [email protected] |
Posted By: Henry Plainview
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 14:12
lol, I'm like North Korea, I don't have any allies. Henry Cow was not intended to be my taste vs. yours that was just the first thing I thought of. My point was trying to illustrate how silly it is to arbitrarily choose certain bands over others for the top 100 and work the algorithm from there. The ones with a lower number of ratings are up there because the ratings are primarily reviews by collabs and members. I consider their opinion much more relevant than random people giving it a star rating. Because the random people only care about the top 20 most popular prog bands and there is so much more to it than that. ------------- if you own a sodastream i hate you |
Posted By: Triceratopsoil
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 14:41
| Lots of people (I'm sure) use the top albums list as a way to discover good music they haven't heard yet; if the top 100 were just albums that everybody already knew, it would be sort of pointless. It's not like Robert Fripp cares how highly rated his music is on some random website |
Posted By: Catcher10
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 14:50
This is a good and appropriate reply.....much better than most who in my opinion slammed the OP for even bringing up the subject and connected with an artist....jeez givem a break! Had he picked one of the "big 3" I seem to think the replies would have been different.
Lists are lists and how they are created will always be a subject of discussion....but if we all want this site to continue to be a leader in progressive music information, we must all challenge it occasionally.
-------------   
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Posted By: Triceratopsoil
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 14:55
I would have actually ridiculed him in that case. |
Posted By: chopper
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 15:11
It doesn't seem to be affecting Genesis that much. |
Posted By: Anthony H.
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 17:18
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My question is: why is the Top 250 list so radically different now than it was a week ago?
-------------  |
Posted By: Snow Dog
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 17:30
Why? By what right? ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Snow_Dog" rel="nofollow">
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Posted By: Triceratopsoil
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 17:40
Because the top list is already full of "big 3" albums; how could you possibly complain about a lack of them? |
Posted By: Snow Dog
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 17:43
I understand...you are right...but is ridicule needed? ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Snow_Dog" rel="nofollow">
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Posted By: Triceratopsoil
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 17:53
| Yes, absolutely |
Posted By: Angelo
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 18:34
How different is it, then? ------------- http://www.iskcrocks.com" rel="nofollow - ISKC Rock Radio I stopped blogging and reviewing - so won't be handling requests. Promo's for ariplay can be sent to [email protected] |
Posted By: Anthony H.
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 18:55
Tons of albums were either moved way up/down or added outright. For example, Maiden Voyage is in the top 60 when it wasn't even in the top 250 before, and Sing to God and Leaving Your Body Map both went up around 60 ranks. Other examples include: Stormcock, Isa, and A Little Man and a House and the Whole World Window. ------------- |
Posted By: Equality 7-2521
Date Posted: March 13 2011 at 19:01
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We should just fix Gentle Giant on the list so that their name can be passed on to future generations. ------------- "One had to be a Newton to notice that the moon is falling, when everyone sees that it doesn't fall. " |
Posted By: Catcher10
Date Posted: March 14 2011 at 09:46
The problem with most is that he picked Gentle Giant, the discussion went from "is there something wrong with the rating system" to "GG does not deserve it or really who cares about GG.."
It was an immediate slam against the band he picked....."so what, my band is not there so I don't care about yours".
Ridiculing someone does not improve the site.....I fail to see that as a constructive reply. -------------
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Posted By: harmonium.ro
Date Posted: March 14 2011 at 09:50
| ^ It wasn't at all like you say. We must have read different threads. |
Posted By: Catcher10
Date Posted: March 14 2011 at 09:54
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^ Its ok...its just my opinion. -------------
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Posted By: npjnpj
Date Posted: March 15 2011 at 02:01
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Perhaps I'm the exception, but when looking at the top 100 list, I'm mainly interested in what albums are in the top 5 or 10 and the way their positions shift slightly now and then (a bit like watching paint dry). For the other 90 I just like to know which albums are in there, not the number at which they stand. For any of those I couldn't care less one of them is at number 12 or 98. If I did, I'd probably get upset. I am interested in new introductions to the list and albums that consequntly vanish from the list though. |
Posted By: topographicbroadways
Date Posted: March 15 2011 at 10:05
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This is ridiculous I discovered most bands on PA via the forum not checking the Top 100. A bands position in the rankings carries nowhere near as much weight as what the reviews of it say in my view. If you are a member of PA or regularly check it out then it is impossible for Gentle Giant to slip past your radar regardless of their position in the rankings -------------  
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Posted By: Padraic
Date Posted: March 15 2011 at 10:16
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I feel confident that newcomers to progressive rock will have no issues discovering Gentle Giant on this website. I'm more interested in this ostensible algorithm change that made drastic changes to the top album list, but that's a separate thread.
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Posted By: AtomicCrimsonRush
Date Posted: March 23 2011 at 22:51
I discovered most bands thru the forums too but I have to say the top 100 has merit. Many would check this to see what is out there and revered as the best of the best. I printed a top 100 in 2006 before i even joined. But its unrecognizable now.
I would love to see a special Prog Rock list of top 100 albums.
 Kind of like 1001 albums you must hear before you die book. So all are placed in their specific years. I know we can look up albums by years by going thru the search section with albums, but a user friendly (newbie friendly), one click on the home page of 70s, 80s, 90s, 00s, etc lists of top 100 prog albums would be quite useful. And not hard to compile. It would change as reviews come in but that wont matter.
This is one idea i would be happy to support or help with. Gentle Giant would end up on a top 100 70s.
of course the 80s list would be kind of difficult to compile as there was hardly any decent prog (did I just say that>?)
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Posted By: moshkito
Date Posted: April 04 2011 at 21:13
Good luck trying to convince these quasi-socialists that they are wrong in their "ideas" about a Top Ten or Top 100. Specially when many of these bands did their work with complete and utter disrespect for the "Top Ten" that was the AM radio (America for example) at the time. But it only took 5 years and FM radio in America also became just another top ten, and then 30 years later someone had the gall to invent Satelite Radio to become yet another Top Ten disgrace and blatant commercial endeavour!
And us, on top of it, are too stuck in that commercialization to help try and address that -- yet another Top Ten ... we would be lost without it!
In the end, our egos in this board will kill it anyway ... and tomorrow another gagaband will be number one and GG will fall off and the day after another spearsbruhaha will be number one and KC will fall off ... it's just a matter of time ... and logistics! We're standing up for a process that ... will kill it all for us, and not help the very music and process that we're standing up for!
That's what happens when a process has no past and no future ... and uses an excuse for "today".
I am of the opinion that the Top 100 should ONLY have a group/artist ONCE ... not 3 (or 4) albums by Genesis or ELP or anyone else ... and this would help consider these as ARTISTS ... instead of just another top ten countdown! ... which will change tomorrow as we get more metal and prog fans and less purists and us old fudgers will all die off sooner or later ... and that metal goth kid can't wait for us to leave!
No one remembers Strawberry Alarm Clock ... or Sugarloaf ... or Ides of March ... or even Mason Profit! ... much less James Gang ... and if you do ... you're a hard core oldster and someone will quickly joke that you need a haircut! ... and the new word is ... et tu musik?
   ------------- Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told! www.pedrosena.com |
Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: April 22 2011 at 23:36
| I'll just have to add more 4 and 5 star reviews for GG. |
Posted By: Harry Hood
Date Posted: April 23 2011 at 23:28
Hey man. Civilian is a damn good album. One of the best albums of the 80's. ------------- 
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Posted By: The Hemulen
Date Posted: April 24 2011 at 10:03
It's good for what it is, but "one of the best albums of the 80's"? Really?! Civillian was an ageing prog band's competent last-ditch attempt at commercial viability, nothing more. There was a shedload of exciting, innovative music produced in that decade, all of which utterly eclipses that album. |
Posted By: Slartibartfast
Date Posted: April 24 2011 at 11:40
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I rather like Civilian, too. You won't find many that don't consider it at least a step up from Giant For A Day
------------- Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...
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Posted By: harmonium.ro
Date Posted: April 24 2011 at 14:33
Don't forget you're on a prog forum. |
Posted By: darkshade
Date Posted: April 24 2011 at 14:41
After Interview, GG were not the band they used to be. I can enjoy those last couple of GG albums, but they're nowhere near the quality of the pre-Interview albums. BTW i have not truly listened to any Gentle Giant in a very long time ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/MysticBoogy" rel="nofollow - My Last.fm
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Posted By: Warthur
Date Posted: May 12 2011 at 09:56
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Personally I like the fact that the top 100 list is in flux. If we gave too much weight to number of reviews that wouldn't happen so much (though, as demonstrated upthread, number of reviews is in fact taken into account). Ultimately, the top 100 would be a boring, boring list if the same old predictable bands filled it; I like the fact that new acts have a shot at making a mark on it. Sure, very occasionally you get a fluke where an album ends up lower or higher than it really deserves to be, but the way the system's set up that'll correct itself over time as more people toss in reviews and ratings - and I'd rather have the occasional eccentric placing which lets me discover new albums and bands I hadn't previously considered than to eliminate such blips and end up staring at an almost static list. And hey, since this thread was posted a third GG album's made its way back into the top 100. Like I say: the list is self-correcting. This is a thread about a problem which literally solves itself.
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