Possibly the most complicated thing ive ever heard
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Topic: Possibly the most complicated thing ive ever heard
Posted By: 7/8_owns_4/4
Subject: Possibly the most complicated thing ive ever heard
Date Posted: January 12 2008 at 14:19
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http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendID=6196676 - http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendID=6196676
The band is After the Burial. listen to the song called "Pi: The Mercury God of Infinity". It's definetley the most complex thing i've ever heard. The have a blog up there on how they made the rhythm up. I saw them last night with Born of Osiris and was truly amazed when they played this. ------------- Get a 7 string or get out. |
Replies:
Posted By: BaldFriede
Date Posted: January 12 2008 at 14:32
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Sounds more complex than it actually is; once you know the counting pattern it is quite easy. It is certainly a lot less complex than for example "The Rites of Spring". -------------  BaldJean and I; I am the one in blue. |
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: January 12 2008 at 15:11
http://www.myspace.com/meshuggah - http://www.myspace.com/meshuggah  ------------- https://awesomeprog.com/users/Mike" rel="nofollow">Recently listened to: 
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Posted By: crimhead
Date Posted: January 12 2008 at 15:19
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I was liking the band up to the vocals. Nothing original here. Sorry. |
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: January 12 2008 at 15:25
Aren't most prog pieces a lot less complex than The Rites of Spring?  ------------- https://awesomeprog.com/users/Mike" rel="nofollow">Recently listened to:
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BaldFriede wrote:Posted By: ProgBagel
Date Posted: January 12 2008 at 15:33
| They look really stupid in that video. |
Posted By: crimhead
Date Posted: January 12 2008 at 15:40
That makes me want to retract what I said about them, that is liking what I heard. |
Posted By: moreitsythanyou
Date Posted: January 12 2008 at 15:40
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The most complex thing that I've heard and enjoyed has been the music of Behold...The Arctopus
-------------  <font color=white>butts, lol[/COLOR] |
Posted By: proger
Date Posted: January 12 2008 at 15:42
Id doing a lot of hard, weird noisies, in u-simtric signutres is complicated... so I dont know what... ------------- ...live for tomorrow... |
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: January 12 2008 at 16:05
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^ I posted the link because that After the Burial track from the first post sounds a *lot* like Meshuggah.
------------- https://awesomeprog.com/users/Mike" rel="nofollow">Recently listened to:
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Posted By: GoldenSpiral
Date Posted: January 12 2008 at 16:25
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Yeah, similar to Meshuggah, but the 'shug is a lot better. Meshuggah has tuff-guy vocals, but After the Burial has some really trite metalkore vocals. If you're into this sort of thing, try Meshuggah, Psyopus, or Behold... the Arctopus. ------------- http://www.myspace.com/altaic" rel="nofollow - http://www.myspace.com/altaic ALTAIC "Oceans Down You'll Lie" coming soon |
Posted By: Avantgardehead
Date Posted: January 12 2008 at 16:29
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Meshuggah ripoff through-and-through, and I don't even like Meshuggah...
------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Avantgardian |
Posted By: ProgBagel
Date Posted: January 12 2008 at 16:30
HAHA. Yeah I was kind of banking it off your statement too. |
Posted By: explodingjosh
Date Posted: January 12 2008 at 16:50
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Yea that video is pretty embarrassing. I've noticed alot of bands like this: "whatever-core" style band playing complex time sigs, polyrhythms, even keyboards... but everything that I've heard seems like its all put together just to make a heavy breakdown that kids are supposed to hardcore dance to. Its all the rage here in Fort Worth, TX. You can't visit a high school without seeing the trendy kids sporting shirts from bands like these. I'd hate to make those kind of generalizations, but I haven't heard anything that tells me otherwise. I've found that once you get over the whole shock factor of the insanely heavy, aggressive sound that they're all going for, there's not really much left to discover. Am I wrong though? Am I missing anything? ------------- 
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Posted By: explodingjosh
Date Posted: January 12 2008 at 16:54
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Alot of these bands are calling themselves prog too... some are pretty close, some are wayyyyy off. I've even heard some use the term "prog-core" before... that was a good laugh.
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Posted By: King Crimson776
Date Posted: January 12 2008 at 17:22
| Holy shyt! Another wannabe Meshuggah band! so complex, broh! |
Posted By: King Crimson776
Date Posted: January 12 2008 at 17:31
 I love you.
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Posted By: Bj-1
Date Posted: January 12 2008 at 20:53
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If you want some REALLY difficult metal, try out Spastic Ink.
http://www.progarchives.com/artist.asp?id=1177 - http://www.progarchives.com/artist.asp?id=1177
'nuff said! ------------- RIO/AVANT/ZEUHL - The best thing you can get with yer pants on! |
Posted By: Jshutt64
Date Posted: January 12 2008 at 23:33
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Meshuggah is way more complicated.
Go listen to the likes of "I" and tell me that is complicated.
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Posted By: darkshade
Date Posted: January 15 2008 at 19:47
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and Meshuggah's not even the most complex band either (metal or not) ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/MysticBoogy" rel="nofollow - My Last.fm 
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Posted By: Vibrationbaby
Date Posted: January 16 2008 at 14:59
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None of these bands know much about music though. Put the sheet music for say, Rodrigo`s Concierto d`Aranjuez in fromt of them and they would be lost.
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Posted By: Visitor13
Date Posted: January 16 2008 at 15:32
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Maybe. Not that it matters much, anyway (see people like Paco De Lucia, who can't/couldn't read sheet music). |
Posted By: Hirgwath
Date Posted: January 16 2008 at 15:57
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I can't help but feel good about the advent of the complex (or pseudo-complex, if you want) hardcore music. At long last the kids at my high school are moving beyond Blink 182... It ain't perfect, but it's a lot less annoying. And while some of those bands might be misleading people when they label themselves "progressive", that label could lead kids to real progressive rock. ------------- Skwisgaar Skwigelf: taller than a tree. Toki Wartooth: not a bumblebee. |
Posted By: Vibrationbaby
Date Posted: January 16 2008 at 15:59
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That wasn`t my point. My point was these guys don`t know much about melody, dynamics, harmony, rhythm etc. etc. Let`s just play fast with lots of starts and stops then we`ll sound like musical geniuses to all the 12 year olds.
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Posted By: Hirgwath
Date Posted: January 16 2008 at 16:01
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OK...that video...was a bit of a surprise. Yuck. On the other hand, I find this video awe-inspiring (not in terms of composition, before you post about how they have no understanding of musical theory...) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r-lxwlgyhhA - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r-lxwlgyhhA ------------- Skwisgaar Skwigelf: taller than a tree. Toki Wartooth: not a bumblebee. |
Posted By: Visitor13
Date Posted: January 16 2008 at 16:05
Ah, yes. Fair point. |
Posted By: 7/8_owns_4/4
Date Posted: January 16 2008 at 16:22
Talk about damn good music. DEP is one of the best tech hardcore bands out there.
Perhaps I should have realized before I registered on this forums that this is more of the Genesis, Rush type progressive crowd, not that there is anything wrong with that. ------------- Get a 7 string or get out. |
Posted By: Visitor13
Date Posted: January 16 2008 at 16:26
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Oh yeah. DEP are wicked. Though I think The Locust are even more impressive. |
Posted By: Nuke
Date Posted: January 16 2008 at 20:18
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I didn't think it was that unmusical. Did you guys actually listen to the Pi song, or did you just listen to the first on the list, because the Pi song had no vocals. The beginning guitar thing was pretty well done. And the Pi part is amazing. You guys say it isn't that complicated, but do you realize that to play this song you need to memorize the first 71 digits of Pi? Let me break down the Pi part, since the article does a poor job clarifying. It plays a number by playing a group of eight notes, and seperates them by a dotted eighth rest. so, the riff starts like (counted in 16ths) ( 1-1-1--1--1-1-1-1--1--1-1-1-1-1--), see? 3.1415 is what is in the parenthesis. Then, over that, the drummer plays a steady 4/4 pattern with the hi-hat, snare, and china cymbal. Is this the most complex song ever? No. It is basically a sequence of random numbers, just like pi. Hard to play? Heck yeah! ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Seabury">  
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Posted By: BroSpence
Date Posted: January 16 2008 at 22:18
| well that was boring. |
Posted By: GoldenSpiral
Date Posted: January 16 2008 at 23:01
I hadn't noticed that, but that's cool... mostly because it's extremely nerdy. I love mathematical patterns in music... so that's a neat idea. The rest of their material however... not so much. ------------- http://www.myspace.com/altaic" rel="nofollow - http://www.myspace.com/altaic ALTAIC "Oceans Down You'll Lie" coming soon |
Posted By: Nuke
Date Posted: January 16 2008 at 23:12
Yeah, I didn't even listen to their other stuff. I'll trust the opinion of others for now... ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Seabury">
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Posted By: Petrovsk Mizinski
Date Posted: January 17 2008 at 00:26
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It would be good if someone could actually give us a good definition of complicated, so we can make better judgement of the songs complexity.
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Posted By: Nuke
Date Posted: January 17 2008 at 00:34
Rhythmic complexity, in this case. Or more just nerdiness ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Seabury">
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Posted By: Jshutt64
Date Posted: January 17 2008 at 00:34
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Well...really and truly, complexity and "complicated" are both relative terms.
This kind of music is void of melody, contrast, and typical things that make music, well....music. The rhythmic patterns are what make it complex in this instance.
It's really not that musical, in my opinon. Impressive, yes. But musical? No.
And yes, it's complex in one sense of the term. But there's more to music than just bashing one note over some crazy ass time signature.
That being said, the ability to stay together on pieces like this is truly remarkable.
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Posted By: oracus
Date Posted: January 17 2008 at 09:54
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Listen to a Peter Brotzmann's record (machine gun considered his best one) and you 'll have to change your perception of Complexity Those Pseudo-complex (as mentioned above) bands are just 'bad-ass' boys trying to emulate complexity with fancy tricks. ------------- 
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Posted By: Visitor13
Date Posted: January 17 2008 at 11:15
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Eh, I don't know. Somehow I think 'complex' is the wrong word to describe music played by people like Brotzmann. Extremely 'dense' maybe, but 'complex'? I love Brotzmann, BTW, but I think 'complex' is more suitable for composers from the (duh) New Complexity 'movement', like Brian Ferneyhough or James Dillon; also for people like Stockhausen, Elliott Carter and even the already mentioned Stravinsky. |
Posted By: Blacksword
Date Posted: January 17 2008 at 13:54
f  ing brilliant! I think that's the best bit of music, certainly the most original piece of music I've ever heard in my life. I really love vocals like that. All that yelling about death is so moving..
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Posted By: Abstrakt
Date Posted: January 17 2008 at 14:15
| DT has made more complex songs that that! |
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: January 17 2008 at 14:32
"Starts and stops" ... doesn't sound like you're a musician either. Luckily I'm a musician myself so you won't succeed poisoning me against these bands. ------------- https://awesomeprog.com/users/Mike" rel="nofollow">Recently listened to:
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Posted By: Nuke
Date Posted: January 17 2008 at 15:01
DT tends to stick to one meter. These guys are playing in 2 at once: 4/4 and Pi ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Seabury">
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Posted By: reality
Date Posted: January 18 2008 at 17:50
I agree, does flash over substance sound familiar to you? A lot of bands use weird time signatures or aggression as a novelty to get people to listen to them. The problem is people should recognize the novelty and move on, but for some reason they do not. Most people are not trained in music appreciation so they fall for the flash. Do not worry if you feel inferior, because these bands do not know how to write music either. |
Posted By: explodingjosh
Date Posted: January 20 2008 at 15:06
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^^^^I think I'm just frustrated more than feeling inferior. I like to have a vulnerable, humble and open minded tone to some topics where I think I have the gist of what's going on and what we're talking about, but I'm not 100% sure, and I might of missed something. This kinda of music is something that I don't listen to alot (but I am exposed to it alot, cause of my younger brother) and I didn't want to make any ignorant generalizations. But the frustration comes from the fact that this music is soooo popular among young "music fans". They only listen to it for a fake sense of sophistication in their metalcore. "derrrrr our time signatures f----ing include Pi, we're intellectual motherf---ers" -------------
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Posted By: explodingjosh
Date Posted: January 20 2008 at 15:09
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They have they Pi symbol all over their merch, also. I wonder if they can even define Pi geometrically and mathematically, or if they just thought it looked really cool.
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Posted By: explodingjosh
Date Posted: January 20 2008 at 15:45
Although Rush is one of my all time favorite bands, these days I'm more into Jazz and metal these days (Between the Buried & Me, Meshuggah[favorite], Death, Cynic, Atheist, Planet X, Allan Holdsworth, Bruford, Pat Metheny) so one would think that I would totally dig something like this, judging by the subject. I think the friction in this thread is caused because bands like this one (again, I hate generalizations) make 'complex' music for the sake of being different and slllllightly sophisticated in their own little world of metalcore, and most of the bands that we progheads (generalization) are into are the ones that invole and include complexity, with weird time signatures and whatever else, but they offer more than just that. Band like the ones I mentioned above have elements like polyrhythms, time sigs, millions of riffs, but also have feeling, harmonies (whether pretty or dissonant), texture, etc. to create something more. That Pi song seems so hinged on that single polyrhythm that it loses novelty pretty quick, for me at least. You'll probably be able to impress kids who only listen to hardcore with stuff like this, but, as snobby as it sounds... I don't think that band or that kind of music is even in the same league. -------------
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Posted By: King Crimson776
Date Posted: January 20 2008 at 16:05
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^^ Jesus Christ, Josh, you're totally right, don't be so timid about it. This After the Burial band purely sucks. Listen to Future Breed Machine by Meshuggah (or any one of the good songs in that style), then listen to any ATB song and laugh your ass off. These stooges wish they could make good music, but they can't; they are incapable. You saw the video; it's plain to see that they're idiots. A Pi symbol, I mean c'mon, what douchebags.
Hey thread starter, learn about music before you embarrass yourself like this again. |
Posted By: explodingjosh
Date Posted: January 20 2008 at 16:29
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lol hey by the way, KingCrimson776, are you a Mars Volta fan yet?? -------------
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Posted By: King Crimson776
Date Posted: January 20 2008 at 16:49
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Hell no, I saw the clip of them on The Henry Rollins Show; confirmed my beliefs.
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Posted By: Nuke
Date Posted: January 20 2008 at 17:35
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I really think you guys are underestimating this music. It is no meshuggah by any means, but meshuggah are in a league all their own. The guitarist is pretty good from the pi song, and the drummer is completly polymetric. So yeah, the music is a bit lacking on the composition side (I thought the pi song, which is what the thread is based on, was well-composed, but some of their other songs are meat-and-potatoes), but it is still not crap. I really like the Pi song. The fact that they memorized the first 71 numbers of pi and played it is impressive enough as is, I mean, I've never tried memorizing pi, but that sounds pretty hard at least. I also liked how it was set up, with the classical guitar thing, silence, some industrial sounds, and how once they were on the pi part, they used stereo effects and stuff to retain the effect. Here's the first 71 digits of pi if you want to count it out... 3.1415 92653 58979 32384 62643 38327 95028 84197 16939 93751 05820 97494 45923 07816 4 ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Seabury">
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Posted By: King Crimson776
Date Posted: January 20 2008 at 17:35
What!? You haven't heard The Rite of Spring? |
Posted By: King Crimson776
Date Posted: January 20 2008 at 17:40
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Playing Pi is complexity for the sake of it as Josh said. They just did that so they could say they did and so they could use the super cool Pi logo.
I'm sorry man, I can't imagine thinking that song sounded good. I like my drummers to be only somewhat polymetric anyway.
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