Music
Printed From: Progarchives.com
Category: Other music related lounges
Forum Name: General Music Discussions
Forum Description: Discuss and create polls about all types of music
URL: http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=36574
Printed Date: March 10 2025 at 16:31
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 11.01 - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: Music
Posted By: Niki ( IO )
Subject: Music
Date Posted: April 08 2007 at 05:04
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In your opinion, Is music invented or discovered?
Is created by us by created means and symbols...
Or is there waiting for us to be discovered and then symbolize, then shareble...
 Sorry fo my poor English...I am afraid I speak my own one... I think is a deep topic bad said by someone who is missing words, but I hope , if taken not too serious, it could bring some interesting posts... ------------- IO |
Replies:
Posted By: progismylife
Date Posted: April 08 2007 at 05:05
| Maybe discovered since all the notes are there and the artist discovers different ways of combining said notes to make a song. |
Posted By: BroSpence
Date Posted: April 09 2007 at 00:17
| Music is discovered then invented, modified, and supermanisized. |
Posted By: Chus
Date Posted: April 09 2007 at 00:19
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Music was discovered when men realized they could speak, even before that. ------------- Jesus Gabriel |
Posted By: Atavachron
Date Posted: April 09 2007 at 00:25
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Great question, let me get back to you...
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Posted By: Witchwoodhermit
Date Posted: April 09 2007 at 00:57
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Both, IMO.
As an artist, I can say that, there are times I create and other times I'm "guided".
I think this is what you're suggesting.
A musician will create and work a piece of music to their will. To match the "vision" of it , in their head.
But during that process, discoveries occur. Work with other musicians or stumbled upon accidents, will create "magic". Something that was not intended, or repeatable.
The end result is a thought out, constructed work, that was both self inspired and then "inspired".
My take anyway.
------------- Here I'm shadowed by a dragon fig tree's fan ringed by ants and musing over man. |
Posted By: Apsalar
Date Posted: April 09 2007 at 01:22
A very interesting question! thought I'm too tired to give any indepth answers at the moment. Funnily enough I was reading through a book the other day, which contained and email exchange between ' Radu Malfatti' and 'Taku Sugimoto' (both composers who utilise substantial periods of silence in their music). Malfatti touched breifly on this matter throughout the course of this discussion. My own views are somewhat similar this (musically wise), thought I might disgree slightly depending on the context the dicussion is focusing on. small quotation: "Evolution goes on, whether we like it or not, and the creative human being is the one who can detect the changes before others do. I don't think any one "invents" things, not Edison, not Bell, not Charile Parker, not Schoenberg, not Cage, etc., but I believe that some - only very few - people are more alert and awake than others and hear, feel or sense the changes eariler that the rest. Which does not mean they are the best..." Radu Malfatti 2002 This quote might be aimed more directly at evolutionary step taken in musical idea (taking into account the elite mindset), but I think it is still applicable to the creation of music, generally speaking. |
Niki ( IO ) wrote:Posted By: Witchwoodhermit
Date Posted: April 09 2007 at 01:38
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"Evolution goes on, whether we like it or not, and the creative human being is the one who can detect the changes before others do. I don't think any one "invents" things, not Edison, not Bell, not Charile Parker, not Schoenberg, not Cage, etc., but I believe that some - only very few - people are more alert and awake than others and hear, feel or sense the changes eariler that the rest. Which does not mean they are the best..." Rudu Malfatti 2002
There is no such thing as " original thought" as the phrase goes. I do believe that.
Invention is a culmination of thought, time and effort, from many and different sources.
It's champion (and namesake) is the essential, but final chapter, in a long chaptered study. ------------- Here I'm shadowed by a dragon fig tree's fan ringed by ants and musing over man. |
Posted By: andu
Date Posted: April 09 2007 at 04:43
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I think that people discover rhythm patterns and melodies so singing comes "naturally", but they invent music. Music is when people take conscious control over the structures they discover and try to elaborate further; and they do it by imposing premeditated ideas and concepts to the process and the results. Going back in history to the earliest theories of music that we know about (I think the oldest one is the one of Pythagoras and his school), they had very well defined reason for their choices for what they called perfect ratios . They used these ratios in music and physics, maths, architecture, medicine etc. because of their metaphysical beliefs in the relevance of these numbers. My "classical civilization & culture" teacher told me he had the opportunity to listen to attempts of recreating Greek antique music from some discovered "transcripts", and they sounded really weird, like nothing he had heard before. ------------- "PA's own GI Joe!" 
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Posted By: paolo.beenees
Date Posted: April 09 2007 at 17:33
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When animals are born, they have plenty of innate skills (i.e. instinctive skills): they can walk, make sounds, interpret signals...
When men are born, they have just three innate skills: they can suck, they can grasp and they can press their feet. Any other behaviour and skills are products of culture and relationships, and so music must be invented.
Nevertheless, Chomsky and his followers think that our brain is so structured that some of his areas are pre-arranged for functions such as speach. These areas, or "devices", set basic rules according to which, for instance, languages are created. But once they follow these basic rules, languages can be as different from each other as possible (and indeed they are!). I think this happens also with music: as a form of communication it must respect some strict rules linked to its dedicated "device", but this doesn't mean that music is innate; in face, according to these rules we can create (or invent, if you like) any kind of music we like.
I hope not being so confusing...
Paolo
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Posted By: Picklebury
Date Posted: April 09 2007 at 17:35
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Both. Discovered in the sense that it comes about from a natural
phenomenon we discovered. Invented in the sense that the methods
of harnessing this natural phenomenon we invented.
------------- The Official Unofficial Krautrock Team: Earning Zappa88's ire since he posted that blasphemous review. |