Is closing threads a good solution ...
Printed From: Progarchives.com
Category: Site News, Newbies, Help and Improvements
Forum Name: Report abuse here
Forum Description: Let us know about inappropriate reviews, posts, PMs, etc.
URL: http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=28399
Printed Date: December 04 2024 at 11:32
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Topic: Is closing threads a good solution ...
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Subject: Is closing threads a good solution ...
Date Posted: September 10 2006 at 05:56
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... if people invade the threads, posting abusive, insulting and off-topic comments? I mean, by closing the thread the ultimate goal is reached: destroying the discussion. The closing of the prog metal categories thread is what made me ask this question ... maybe we can come up with a better solution for such problems. I don't mean to criticise the admins - they have to do *something*. ------------- https://awesomeprog.com/users/Mike" rel="nofollow">Recently listened to: 
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Replies:
Posted By: Jimbo
Date Posted: September 10 2006 at 06:02
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It's a valid question, definitely. I personally think the abusive comments should just be deleted, so that the conversation can continue peacefully.
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Posted By: JayDee
Date Posted: September 10 2006 at 06:45
 peace! ------------- 
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Jimbo wrote:Posted By: Trickster F.
Date Posted: September 10 2006 at 06:46
I entirely agree with Jimbo, and not just as the victim of the latest mess created by Philippe. I think that by locking every thread because of specific trolls we will soon have a forum devoid of any Prog-Metal related threads(I know many would like it to happen though). ------------- sig |
Posted By: Ricochet
Date Posted: September 10 2006 at 06:55
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I'm up for deleting the riot-pulse-message and keeping the thread on-going. Practically we should prevent the case of a "rough message", as well as the ones that react to that message. Otherwise, the rest should be left and continued. In the case of the Metal-genre thread, I believe what's been said before phillipe's intervention (than the afterwards reactions) could continue. (off-subject: Trickster: Dostoievski-avatar, nice!  )------------- 
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Posted By: Raff
Date Posted: September 10 2006 at 06:55
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OK, guys, as this discussion seems to be aimed at me mainly... 1. Please re-read what I wrote before locking the thread, and you'll see that I am speaking of a temporary closure; 2. I or the others report the fact to the other Admins, so that a common decision can be reached; 3. it does not seem very correct to me doing such a thing as opening a thread to discuss my decisions (or those of anybody else) in the public forum, when there is a Collabs section or PMs to be used for this purpose. Just my two cents, as always... Edit: I posted this before Rico posted his own message. Please, re-read the discussion, and see that I would've had to delete half of it... Is this what you really want? |
Posted By: Ricochet
Date Posted: September 10 2006 at 06:58
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I think you're proceeding alert and great every time, Raffaella; just making a suggestion of a different way.
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Posted By: Trickster F.
Date Posted: September 10 2006 at 07:01
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It would also be a good idea if everyone just ignored Philippe's posts, but I guess that will happen sooner or later. How many people still take his "take" on Metal seriously? ------------- sig |
Posted By: Jimbo
Date Posted: September 10 2006 at 07:05
This is not about you Ghost Rider.  I've been thinking about this subject long before you became an admin. Your actions (which were completely acceptable, BTW) may have prompted the creation of this thread, but I'm talking about the situation in general.-------------
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Posted By: oliverstoned
Date Posted: September 10 2006 at 07:24
Our goal was not to destroy the discussion (we don't care about it) but to protest about something that we consider abusive: including non-prog bands into a site which is said to be dedicated to progressive music. |
Posted By: Raff
Date Posted: September 10 2006 at 07:28
Olivier, you chose to ignore what I wrote in that thread before I closed it, so I'll repeat it here, loud and clear: this is not the way to protest. If you have something against the inclusion of such bands, you have all the right to open a thread and express what you feel - but in different terms from the ones you and Philippe used. As long as you or anybody else feels that is the way to go about things, the Mods will have no choice but close the discussions or delete the posts altogether. |
Posted By: Australian
Date Posted: September 10 2006 at 07:33
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As my maths (Australian spelling has an ‘S’ on the end) teacher would say, just ask who ever the abuser is to stop before taking any serious actions.
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Posted By: oliverstoned
Date Posted: September 10 2006 at 07:33
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I can open a thread if you want, but i don't see where's the problem considering that i'm not agressive or offensive and that i'm quietly exposing my arguments. |
Posted By: Angelo
Date Posted: September 10 2006 at 07:42
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Hmppff. I just started a thread on the topic discussed here (too soon, shoud've checked). Guess it would be Ok to close that one: http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=28401 Basically, my suggestion there is in line with Jimbo and Ricos. Angelo ------------- http://www.iskcrocks.com" rel="nofollow - ISKC Rock Radio I stopped blogging and reviewing - so won't be handling requests. Promo's for ariplay can be sent to [email protected] |
Posted By: philippe
Date Posted: September 10 2006 at 07:44
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Ghost Rider, It's so funny how you debate on forms...can you please argue about the content and the crucial problematic which concerns the credibility of the site (I'm not speaking about the forum, this place is just amusement). Look at the prog metal subgenre and assume that things go to fare…If I will speak to the owners about it, I’m sure I will have a correct answer. I will expose my arguments in French so this discussion will remain private. As I said to someone else I can pass about some metal bands but many inclusions are really abusive and senseless. I think that this kind of totally free and uncontrolled policy about additions can ruin the reputation of the site. We privilege quantity rather than quality, most of time, expanding ourselves in non-coherent directions. We must refer to the “content” guideline; I’ve worked for it since years. ------------- 
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Posted By: toolis
Date Posted: September 10 2006 at 07:49
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being one of the people that got involved (phillipe called all metalheads, pigheads..i'm thinking of changing my nickname to Metalpig - The Filthy Power) i have to say 2 things:
1.for the few months that i have been posting replies, it was the first time sth like that happened to me and not that easy to let it go if someone calls you names...i tried to answer with humour but it didn't work... 2.Ghost Rider, it seems as if you check all the forums only to see if you can close them.. we are big boys you know... we can work it out... you didn't have to do this..  ------------- -music is like pornography... sometimes amateurs turn us on, even more... -sometimes you are the pigeon and sometimes you are the statue... |
Posted By: toolis
Date Posted: September 10 2006 at 07:57
i wonder where this beutiful, kind, formal language was before when you were calling me "pighead"... ------------- -music is like pornography... sometimes amateurs turn us on, even more... -sometimes you are the pigeon and sometimes you are the statue... |
Posted By: micky
Date Posted: September 10 2006 at 08:00
possibly but don't you think this would be better served being discussed by everyone ...including the parties directly involved in private.... or where it should be.. in the collab areas... much like the symphonic schism we endured... some things are best handled not in public but behind closed doors. I haven't seen the thread yet...I tend to say away from anything PM related hahahah... but my curiousity is aroused . ------------- The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip |
Posted By: mystic fred
Date Posted: September 10 2006 at 08:01
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i think anybody should be able to express their views here without the fear of interference from mods, there is nothing wrong with healthy heated discussion as long as no one is insulted, knowingly or unknowingly - under those circumstances the offenders should be warned publicly and made to apologise, without embarrassment to the thread starter by having his/her thread "locked", we are supposed to be grown adults not naughty children. A cause of many heated comments and arguments on PA seem to revolve around band submissions - i humbly suggest PA has a "glass door" policy on band submissions so everyone knows WHY this band or that have been included or declined, and less of a "secret society" masonic policy on such inclusion deliberations.
-------------  Prog Archives Tour Van 
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Posted By: micky
Date Posted: September 10 2006 at 08:23
interesting.... just what the hell is' Progressive Sludge Metal' anyway  my two cents... thanks to Oliverstoned and Philllipes lack of maturity and ...trollish posts.. the thread was lost.... the thread was descending into the abyss of name calling and bad feelings.. it was a good solution to close it and words need to be said to those who needless and maliciously bait .... I've been guilty of wrecking a few threads in my time... but in sense of fun and always with threads that were retreads or pure joke threads in the first place. This... to those who listen to 'Progressive Slude Metal' was a serious meaningful and up to Olivestones entry in it.. well discussed thread. ------------- The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip |
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: September 10 2006 at 08:56
No, not at all ... I've seen this numerous times on all sorts of topics, by many different admins. I just thought that maybe - by discussing the general problem - another solution can be found. ------------- https://awesomeprog.com/users/Mike" rel="nofollow">Recently listened to:
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Posted By: Raff
Date Posted: September 10 2006 at 09:03
OK - this is what I would wish for too. I understand that closing the thread was a drastic measure, but believe me, it was the best solution at the time. A closed thread can be easily re-opened, while deleting posts is something that should be done with much more caution. Especially on a Sunday morning (I believe you and I are in the same time zone), when you find yourself alone in doing your task. And it's not about power trips or treating grown people like children either... |
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: September 10 2006 at 09:05
How can it be a good solution to (EDIT: *close*) a good discussion because of a few posts (if we assume that the thread remains closed, just for the sake of this discussion)? I think it's safe to assume that you don't like Progressive Sludge Metal" ... would you also agree to closing the thread if it was about a genre which you like, and if you had put a considerable amount of time into writing posts? ------------- https://awesomeprog.com/users/Mike" rel="nofollow">Recently listened to:
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Posted By: micky
Date Posted: September 10 2006 at 09:17
hmmm... how long have you been here.... I assume a hell of a lot longer than I have... what you are in essence doing is questioning the policies of the admin team ... GR is not the only one to close threads.... Jody is a undisputed master of it... this should have been handled in the proper area... you saw the thread I started in the collab area earlier in regards to the symph team.. things were said... things were resolved.. and the affected parties were able to rejoiin the area... which out having dirty laundry spread out for all to see... as a ....whatever you are right now... I figure you would know that.. and appreciate that space where these things can be discussed.. amoung those who are involved.. ESPECIALLY when the 'guitlty' parties.. .are collabs themselves.... as far as is it a good solution... as I said before... the thread to my eyes was wrecked and heading downhill when the terrrible twosome came in and gave not opinions but posts intended to incite and inflame. That thread was dead the minute it happened. Anyway in genreal... it is a commen method employed by the admin team.... if it happened to mine.. .I'd start another.. and blame not the admins or the policy.. but those who needlessly try to piss people off and destroy the threads.. ------------- The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip |
Posted By: philippe
Date Posted: September 10 2006 at 09:50
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Ok, I leave this forum...no need to continue all these pointless discussions with a few little-heads...I'm going to take back my initial work here. Each time I use this forum I only hear the same self-indulgent melodies. -------------
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Posted By: micky
Date Posted: September 10 2006 at 10:00
your decision I guess.... if you feel like the need to spew venom about something you obviously don't like is worth giving up all the time you've spent here spent here discussing what you DO like then good luck and come back if you change your mind. ahhaha.. nice farewell post though... so 'prog' in nature..  ------------- The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip |
Posted By: Jimbo
Date Posted: September 10 2006 at 10:00
C'mon, Philippe. I'm sure nobody wants that to happen. You're a huge asset to the site. You just need to realize that everyone has his own idea of what constitutes progressive music. I'm sure there isn't a single person here who considers every band in the archives prog -- I sure as hell don't. The difference between us is that I really don't give a damn. Just relax a bit, and things will look a lot brighter. -------------
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Posted By: Raff
Date Posted: September 10 2006 at 10:04
| I suppose it is very hard to understand that no one here has been taking rather drastic action because they are paladins of one subgenre as opposed to the other. Aforesaid action was taken because of the use of unacceptably strong language towards other members. If any of you think it is acceptable to call other people "littleheads", then I'll just have to accept the fact that we are from different planets... |
Posted By: philippe
Date Posted: September 10 2006 at 10:07
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forum not the site...I think it's better for a large part of members...I will keep contact by PM. I'm just terribly tired and feel sorry... but I can't understand some controversial directions taken, that's too much especially if just a minority is speaking for others. -------------
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Posted By: Atkingani
Date Posted: September 10 2006 at 10:18
Sometimes only the deletion or hiding of an abusive post is enough but in other cases when the scene becomes very polluted with agressions being exchanged and a clear deviation from the topic subject the closing is the best choice. Maybe contenders could calm down and re-start the original discussion in another thread.
------------- Guigo ~~~~~~ |
Posted By: micky
Date Posted: September 10 2006 at 10:20
*puts on the white jacket and pulls out a chair* no one here is happy with everything that goes on here.... the stuff that doesn't interest me.... like the wholesale inclusion of anything metal with the slightest hint of prog.... into here bothers me.. but it's not my thing so I dont' sweat it. Other things are more dear to my heart.. and will fight tooth and nail for.. and have gone over the line in doing so. I'd just take a step back and fight when you can.. and accept what you can't fight... My two cents as always... ------------- The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip |
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: September 10 2006 at 11:22
Starting a new thread means that all the good content of the previous thread is lost. But I guess that's a general problem of forums. They're simply not a good platform for "static" content ... eventually all threads will fade into obscurity.  ------------- https://awesomeprog.com/users/Mike" rel="nofollow">Recently listened to:
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Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: September 10 2006 at 11:24
Please forgive me for saying that - but aren't oliver and you a minority as far as your opinion about prog metal is concerned? I mean, there were *numerous* polls about whether prog metal belongs here or not, and the result was beyond any doubt. What I really don't understand is: Why can't you just ignore prog metal? ------------- https://awesomeprog.com/users/Mike" rel="nofollow">Recently listened to:
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Posted By: Peter
Date Posted: September 10 2006 at 11:48
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I didn't read the thread (but I'm curious now, naturally), but I will say this in defense of GR: being a Mod is a tough job, and you'll never please all of the people you "police."
Also, I'm not saying that any "mistakes" were made by GR, but of course our hard-working moderators are human too. They can err, can arguably over-react, but they can also learn from experience, reconsider, etc.
I couldn't be a mod. I'd need a thicker skin, more patience, and even more time away from other important things (family, work, reading, etc). I appaud all of our moderators for their selfless dedication to this site. They care, and they try to help -- and 99.9% of the time, I think they do just that.  ------------- "And, has thou slain the Jabberwock? Come to my arms, my beamish boy! O frabjous day! Callooh! Callay!' He chortled in his joy. |
Posted By: Easy Livin
Date Posted: September 10 2006 at 12:19
If you wish to participate in an unmoderated forum, you'll need to look elsewhere MF. The admin team will continue to "interfere" when we think people have contravened the rules. We are committed to allowing/supporting/encouraging healthy, even heated debate, as long as it is civil and constructive.
Philippe, you can be your own worst enemy at times. If you would refrain from using abusive terms and names to refer to other members, I'm sure your would provoke useful discussion. The points you make are (almost) always valid, and intended for the betterment of the site. It is such a shame that you choose to detract from them by adding insults and side swipes at the members you feel are in in the wrong. Inevitably people will spend time defending themselves, protesting at your insults, and in the case of the admin team trying to calm things down, when we could all be talking about the points you raise.
Peter, thanks for the support, it is much appreciated!
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Posted By: bhikkhu
Date Posted: September 10 2006 at 12:53
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No matter what side of an opinion I may be on, abusive language, and childish mayhem add nothing to a discussion. It inflames people, and any usefulness of the thread gets lost. I stand behind the moderators for their efforts. The topic can always be started again. I do believe that the more obnoxious posters should be dealt with. It seems to me that there are some habitual offenders, who never face a reprimand. ------------- a.k.a. H.T. http://riekels.wordpress.com" rel="nofollow - http://riekels.wordpress.com |
Posted By: micky
Date Posted: September 10 2006 at 13:08
hahahha.. I know.... ------------- The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip |
Posted By: bhikkhu
Date Posted: September 10 2006 at 13:12
I wasn't referring to you buddy (although, I did think of you while writing it ). You're antics are in fun, and don't get specifically abusive. Heck, I'm right there with you a lot of the time.
------------- a.k.a. H.T. http://riekels.wordpress.com" rel="nofollow - http://riekels.wordpress.com |
Posted By: micky
Date Posted: September 10 2006 at 13:17
damnit... means I wasn't obnoxious enough... .back to the drawing board.... anyway... since I lost my partner to the corporate ladder... I've settled into a corner office and plot now global domination by all things RPI ahhahahah ------------- The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip |
Posted By: mystic fred
Date Posted: September 11 2006 at 15:16
I think you misunderstood my meaning, Bob, i did go onto say "as long as no one is insulted, knowingly or unknowingly - under those circumstances the offenders should be warned publicly and made to apologise, without embarrassment to the thread starter by having his/her thread "locked",
i would support the interference of mods when the occasion deems it, when posts become personally abusive, but not to unnecessarily interrupt the flow of a good discussion.
 ------------- Prog Archives Tour Van
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Posted By: Easy Livin
Date Posted: September 11 2006 at 16:54
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Noted MF.
As I'm sure you'll appreciate, the Admin team do indulge in a lot of discussion behind the scenes about the best way to handle specific situations.
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Posted By: Angelo
Date Posted: September 11 2006 at 17:04
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Great! Did anybody attempt to revive our good discussion yet?
------------- http://www.iskcrocks.com" rel="nofollow - ISKC Rock Radio I stopped blogging and reviewing - so won't be handling requests. Promo's for ariplay can be sent to [email protected] |
Posted By: NutterAlert
Date Posted: September 11 2006 at 17:17
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this thread should close now
------------- Proud to be an un-banned member since 2005 |
Posted By: TheProgtologist
Date Posted: September 11 2006 at 17:22
One thing I have to make clear about that statement... NOBODY here is untouchable,there are people who are walking a very fine line,thinking that we won't dare deal with them accordingly.And that is just not true. I don't like to close threads,but when one degenerates like the thread in question did,sometimes it's impossible to just delete posts and still keep the thread coherent.Especially when alot of people quote offensive posts,because if you are quoting a post that was offensive your post has to be deleted too.Better to just close it and hope another thread will be started again and not ruined by a bunch of people. -------------  |
Posted By: Sean Trane
Date Posted: September 12 2006 at 03:15
Damn you people, how dare you fight when my back is turned. ???
I wanted a piece of the action too!
 Now that all the fun is over........... On the more serious side of things:
Philippe, I tried time and time again to tell you that you go much farther in achieving your goals with diplomacy than open warfare. You keep digging your own grave.
A year ago, I saved your ass by being the only one defending you. But your repeated offensives against what YOU feel is right or wrong, is likely to make me regretting standing up for you.
I think that your stance held its own and was actually right. But your name calling makes you take away whatever rethorical advantages of your position.
As Bob says, you are your own worst ennemy.
More in PM if you wish
------------- let's just stay above the moral melee prefer the sink to the gutter keep our sand-castle virtues content to be a doer as well as a thinker, prefer lifting our pen rather than un-sheath our sword |