richardh wrote: Vangelis is a big one. I like most of his output the only ones I don't bother with are those very early avant albums (pre 'Earth') and the much later soundtracks for Alexander and El Greco. The other 32 albums I like to varying degrees but they get played at some point or other. Vangelis top five is nearly impossible but I'll have a stab: Heaven and Hell China Direct El Greco (the non film soundtrack) Voices subject to change at any given moment!

I'm finally getting round to giving his back catalogue some of the attention it deserves (I've not paid much attention to it for 30 years?). I can't remember a thread dedicated to an evaluation of his music, so thought I would use Rich's thoughts to commence a thread, which might help me and others navigate his works. I own and like:

L'Apocalypse Des Animaux, H&H, Albedo, Spiral, China, Opera Sauvage, Soil Festivities & Mask

I really struggled with Beaubourg (although may revisit for a 4th listen) and Invisible Connections, which will probably never be revisited.

Which of his disks do you enjoy?

Right from the start with his first album ... I am not sure I can even think/consider one album above any other ... along with Ryuichi Sakamoto, one of the great composers of the 20th century for my tastes.

I think they will be remembered for a long time.

Somewhere in the Space Pirate Radio lists is a promo LP for "Heaven & Hell" that can't be shared, where hs discusses his music, and what he says is far out ... and folks still don't believe me ... all his albums have "teaspoons" on it ... and he really puts down "commercial music" ... and he doesn't want to be a part of it.

I think it is very evident in his music all around. Lovely stuff, and it one person I shed a tear when he passed away ... I was glad to have been a part of his life and story from the days of Aphrodite's Child all the way to the end. And there still is some stuff not released that the folks in charge of his music are afraid to release, or say something about it. No artist of his ability lacks a lot of bits and pieces in their closets!

Hi,

I'm not sure I can think of a "favorite" at all ... I simply love the works the composer has created, and how it has always helped my imagination live.

I suppose of all the albums, the stuff in BLADE RUNNER is the one I love to listen to all the time, but I believe it is because the visuals from the film are so beautiful and well represented that it is hard to not enjoy them. Not quite the same, but "CHARIOTS OF FIRE has a similar touch. 

Again, I like all of the albums ... not just one. The composer is by far, one of the top ones in my thoughts, along with Ryuichi Sakamoto ... their visual nature and how the music was used added so much to their work, and it helped in all of their albums. It makes me think what would happen if Beethoven or Stravinsky were around these days ... although some pieces have been illustrated by FANTASIA and ALLEGRO NON TROPPO, and in the end, I would love to see more of that!

I'd recommend almost any Vangelis album - especially the sensational soundtracks - but I'd give Beaubourg, Hypothesis & Invisible Connections a wide berth, although you already know those three experimental albums are best avoided anyway. Vangelis and Avant Garde are not a good combination for me.   

Thank you, once more you've been very thorough and inciteful... 

If I had to pick one, Albedo would be my favourite and I too think Soil Festivities is a remarkable piece of music. I think I like Mask a little more than you, but then I've always been a sucker for choral works... 

I think there is... many will almost 'subliminally' rate slightly lower if an album has already been a low rating by others beforehand, while the opposite can also be true. I think someone like Vangelis can fall victim to this, as his music is incredibly subtle at times and requires more listens than many are prepared to give.

What a bunch of goons ... and no one is looking for the teaspoons in the albums, yet! 

C'mon ... have some fun! 

Yes, it is likely synthesized and touched up, but they are there in many places! Neat too! 

The story starts with the teaspoons hitting the glasses at the dinner table, btw, in Vangelis' younger years ... he said the magical sound was one of his inspirations! I keep telling you that "magic" ... sometimes, is more than just notes and chords ... 

I'm not the kind of music listener to simply "love" all of this or that artist body of work. If something fail to connect with me, it doesn't really matter if Vangelis, Morricone or whoever composed the music. I move on. Vangelis, like almost every composer/instrumentalist of his generation, loses me underways at some point. But he had 10-15 years of greatness. And that's more than enough for me.

5 The Dragon (1971), Odes (with Irene Papas) (1979)
4.5 L'Apocalypse des Animaux (1973), Blade Runner (1981/1982)
4 Sex Power (1970), Hypothesis (1971), Earth (1973), Heaven and Hell (1975), Opera Sauvage (1980)
3.5 Albedo 0.39 (1976), Spiral (1976), See You Later (1980), Soil Festivities (1984)
3 Ignacio (1975), La Fete Sauvage (1976), Beaubourg (1978), China (1979), Antarctica (1983), Mask (1985), 1492: Conquest of Paradise (1992)
2.5 Ραψωδιέ (Rapsodies) (1986)

Hi,

Mike, is not a composer in the sense that Ryuichi Sakamoto and Vangelis were ... and they did a lot of soundtracks which gives you an idea of how visual their work was for them, and how they illustrated it, not just how it was interpreted in film many times, for which Ryuichi Sakamoto deserves a lot of praise.

Mike, has redone too many TB's for my taste, and he has not exactly moved away from the mechanical style of composition that he is attached to, with the exception of AMAROK which was known to be a huge finger to the record company ... and yet it is appreciated much more than expected ... but he has not come back to that free form thing as far as I can tell.

Albedo 0.39

Direct

Heaven and Hell

Opera Sauvage

I should explore more. It's quite a large discography.

verslibre wrote: Do you like The City? That's a really underrated one in Vangelis' discography, IMO. It plays like an unofficial sequel to Blade Runner. I think I'll listen to it today.

I took a chance on that album on vinyl some years ago and I enjoyed it more than I thought I would (more than Direct). It has a couple of weaker tracks but since it's a concept album I'm more forgiving.

Vangelis is an artist I adore I've been listening for more than ten years, and there's still a lot of music I never heard from him, mostly soundtracks. I've been listening to "L'Apocalypse des Animaux" often at night since I bought it last year, it's very relaxing but doesn't fall into background music.

My favourite album is still the first one I heard, Spiral. I find fascinating that all the percussion is acoustic, in electronic music it's normally the first thing that's replaced with synthesizers.

Than I'd complete my top 3 with Heaven and Hell and China. I also really like Soil Festivities and The Dragon.

Other favorites: China, Opera Sauvage, Chariots of Fire, Soil Festivities, Mask, Voices, Oceanic.

Am I the only one who likes Invisible Connections?

Vangelis is one of my favorite artists ever. I've managed to purchase the two vinyls with Irene Papas and a collection of Forminx during a trip to Crete (there was a nice shop in Agios Nikolaos).

I have all his official releases and I still listen to him. Aphrodite's Child always put me in a sort of melancholic state, as they were actually very famous and I've listened to them a lot when I was a child.

Apart of that, my favorite albums are Heaven And Hell, Albedo 0.39 and China.

The Blade Runner 25th anniversary boxset features also Demis Roussos and I've never regretted the expense.

The only album that I don't like is See You Later. I think (by memory) that it's one of my very few one-star reviews. 

The City, mentioned above is another very good album. In particular Morning Papers gives me the sensation of going for a breakfast after a non-sleeping night. 

Luca, I simply can't get my head around how to listen to this one; it's so sparse and disjointed, almost devoid of any underlying melody with which to build on with repeated listens.. you merely seem to be hanging on for the next set of notes, then wondering how they connect to what you've just heard? I really struggle with Beaubourg, but that's a walk in the park compared to this!

I reluctantly came to the conclusion that it was just too intelligent for me?  

verslibre wrote: Glad you like The City. Do you have Juno to Jupiter? It's exceptional, was his best music in years.

Never heard it but I've been meaning to. I do have Rosetta and listen to it often as well. It has a great flow, I just find the title track distracting because the melody is similar to a Portuguese Pop song

octopus-4 wrote: Am I the only one who likes Invisible Connections?

I never dared to approach it, the Deutsche Grammophon label and the comparisons with Beaubourg say it's not for me. I hope I'm wrong.

Oh, Beaubourg is very accessible by way of comparison....

Heard some exciting news yesterday. Been waiting for years for this.

^Nice. This reminded me of a 16 minute previously unreleased track (until 2002). I got it of a collection titled Babylon the Great. I think it's basically Vangelis improvising and it sounds a little like Sex Power and Hypothesis combined (but easier on the ear than the latter album). Not everyone's cup of tea, but I love it. It says that it's recorded in 1969 during the 666-sessions, so to me it's strange that it's never been featured as bonus material for that album. Not this time either. Maybe Vangelis himself hated it, like he seemingly did with the mentioned Hypothesis (and the fantastic The Dragon):

HI,

It's quite large since he had been at it since the mid 60's ... which places things at the very least 50 years ... but his solo albums are the best thing, and it is clear how he "saw" a lot of music ... it was very "visual" and "film like" which really helped it get illustrated by several film directors, and eventually got him an OSCAR.

Listening to it all from the start is a treat ... from "Earth" to the last release, how he dealt with the new equipment, and then new music ... you have to say it was special, though there aren't enough specials on him that show/tell a whole lot about him, which would suggest not exactly a simple person at all, but one that lives according to his musical moods, which, of course, we know were far out and excellent.

I find that I can not select a single album as best or to make a suggestion at all ... in his later days, you could say he was more "classical" as a musician, but that was something that was in him, anyway, although I kinda thought that how "Heaven and Hell" came off was likely to be a sort of ... something ... about commercial music and the record companies. This is implied and suggested in the promo that was sent to many FM stations which Guy Guden played on his show in its entirety which explains a lot of his music and where it came from, up to and including such things as t-spoons that folks here don't believe in at all, but it shows a human side that we have a tendency to not believe at all ... he's "normal", just like we are, and sensitive to a lot of bits around us ... and he uses them ... we just ignore those things! And a rock musician, goodness me, he/she would never consider anything but a chord or note! Creativity at the DAW, as I call it ... not in the music living inside your head and heart!

I would think that not making a suggestion would be better ... so you can get surprised ... but I think that's more my own vision of "discovering" something new, instead of some more MOS stuff out there that is so commercial you want to go .....and formatted even worse .... 

agreed... I feel very similar about Soil Festivities; very delicate, subtle and beautiful... 

Hi,

In one of the Vangelis Documentaries there is a scene that is the perfect explanation of a lot of his talent and ability ... and it is a shot of him playing/composing the music for Blade Runner, and it goes on for a good minute or two  ... and all you can see is the film looking at the building and the camera moving upwards (think of whatshisname's mobile moving up to the sky) and the music follows ... and stays with it bit by bit ... and it fits beautifully ... and it shows/explains something about composing that is not everyone's thought or idea ... he's all visual, and he is literally following the visual in front of him ... and this is also very clear in Chariots of Fire ... when you can see his keys match the pace and the movement.

I suppose that you can suggest that the film director is the one that can see that and use it, but Maurice Jarre, also did that with his soundtracks and they fit beautifully in many places. Ryuichi Sakamoto might not have done the same but he had a magic touch for several moments and always came up with the far out bit, again, some of it might be the director of the film, but that is unlikely, since Ryuichi, like Vangelis and Maurice, had done this "touch" before and it was a matter of the director being smart enough not to waste some great music.

This is not "commercial" music, as Vangelis has suggested in many a special, and this is the hard part of explaining a lot of this ... we are way too attached to a lot of "commercial" works and materials, in order to be able to find/discern materials that are not onto the "commercial" sounding thing, and you can see this in a lot of Hollywood films with generic music at the start and at the end ... or worse ... during a romantic scene ... and sometimes some well known songs to make you think this is far out! The group Mogwai has also done a couple of things really well, also suggesting a touch of the appreciation of the visual side of things.

It's all about the touch ... and some have it and some don't ... the REAL composers always have it. The rest, for me, are merely doing notes and (sometimes) the worse ... the director is horrible at using the music ... Babylon 5 had this problem, and never used Christopher Frank's music to make the show better ... I don't think any of those directors ever knew what music was for other than sweeping the floors!

I would refer to his album Themes. Love that as a compilation album as it includes previously unreleased Vangelis music from the Bounty as well as a few other films.

http://www.progarchives.com/album.asp?id=7613" rel="nofollow - https://www.progarchives.com/album.asp?id=7613

There are other 'songs' such as Alpha, To The Unknown Man, Multi Track Suggestion plus everything off his lovely 90's album Voices which I personally adore.

Hi,

I think (do I think at all???) ... he had the best with a few directors and what Hollywood had to offer was not a director that knew music, and worse ... could use it. 

Hollywood, is not exactly "known" for music ... more likely what radio calls "jingles" in their films to help decorate the bathroom ... so to speak. I get really tired of that piece of music during the kissing scene ... goodness, how that seems ugly these days ... and so not sexy! I keep thinking that Prince Charles, drunk and kissing a lamp post would be more fun and the music more interesting ... but Hollywood? I would almost state that Hollywood is better known for MUSICALS, than the music, and both you and I can hum a few tunes off those .... easily enough!

But in the specials about Vangelis, both on video and LP (promos from the record company in the old days of FM) what he is against is what he calls "commercial music" ... and he wants his freedom, and both directors for "Chariot of Fire" and "Blade Runner" allowed him the freedom to look at the dailies and such. And it makes a difference, although I am not sure that Hollywood will allow that with any composer, as that is one person that is not in the "top tier" for a movie ... the producers first, the stars second, the coke dealers third, the caterers fourth, the extra girls fifth, the script handlers and page turning duty girls sixth ... and somewhere AFTER the film is made, comes the composer of the music, hopefully create something memorable ... I doubt that any of these movies will allow a composer a name anywhere near the Cruise! Other than a girl, of course!

Hi,

This is tough ... because SOUNDTRACKS are not exactly about "songs" and things for us to like or not like ... they are about pieces of music that decorate the picture even better, and I do not think this specific track used was meant to be a "song" for our enjoyment ... it is a part of the romantic notions and expressions that were used in this film, many of which are very different to our ears ... but to determine a soundtrack by its songs? I'm not sure it is the right thing at all ... 

And, in the end, Vangelis' talent ended up with an OSCAR and he will be remembered for a long time for his incredible musical legacy, soundtracks or not. 

This is specially important in regards to the very open and lively discussions that Vangelis offered many times in regards to "commercial music" ... and his work was very important in this area ... just hard to believe that all we can think of is a "song" ... and not even how it was used in the film, which was done beautifully and with a lot of care and appreciation for Vangelis' touch on the keys. Very few ... VERY FEW ... film directors have a love and respect for the music, to make sure it is VISIBLE in the whole thing and an important part of the film ... Maurice Jarre, Ryuichi Sakamoto and a couple of others, come to mind ... and all three have OSCARS in their closets! And they got those for a good reason.