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Middle Eastern Prog

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Category: Progressive Music Lounges
Forum Name: Prog Bands, Artists and Genres Appreciation
Forum Description: Discuss specific prog bands and their members or a specific sub-genre
URL: http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=126573
Printed Date: December 04 2024 at 13:11
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Topic: Middle Eastern Prog
Posted By: judahbenkenobi
Subject: Middle Eastern Prog
Date Posted: June 01 2021 at 19:53
Hi there! Anyone can recommend me a band with strong Middle Eastern or Arabic sounds? I have heard Myrath, and that is more or less what I mean, although I would appreciate something a little less metal. As I write these lines I am listening to Asia Minor's Points of Libration, a Franco-Turkish band. Although it is very good, the Eastern influences are minimal, at least for the layman's ears as far as I have heard it. Any recommendations?



Replies:
Posted By: tigerfeet
Date Posted: June 01 2021 at 20:21
Very interesting question and since there are a lot of middle and eastern influences on western prog, especially phych prog, it warrants a lot of research for sure. I found an old link here to bands from various countries listed on these forums. 

http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=51596&PN=1" rel="nofollow - http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=51596&PN=1

One of my favorite artists is Loreena McKennett, who, although is not prog, or from the middle east, has proggy elements through a lot of her work. I also like Orange Blossom, although again, small hints of prog but a lot of New Age influences. 


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Posted By: cstack3
Date Posted: June 01 2021 at 22:23
Interesting question! 

Some British bands like Brand X have had a bit of a Middle-Eastern influence, check out their LP "Masques."  Percy Jones' fretless bass gives the music a nice Eastern feel! 

I'm intrigued by Middle Eastern poly-tones and rhythms, but don't think much of it has come into Western music completely.  Check out this clip! 




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Posted By: judahbenkenobi
Date Posted: June 01 2021 at 23:50
Thanks for the help! I'll definitely check it out!


Posted By: Sean Trane
Date Posted: June 02 2021 at 00:10
Not prog per se, but there are plenty of JR/F artistes of middle-eastern roots who splash their music with "arabian" overtones:

Dhafer Youssef, Tigran Hamassyan, Ibrahim Maalouf, etc...

In prog the half-french/half-Turkish Asia Minor, the Armenian band Artsruni, and a few more.




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Posted By: Rick1
Date Posted: June 02 2021 at 04:21
Having lived in the Middle East for two years, I found prog thin on the ground.  Mind you, a presenter on Radio Oman was very open to my suggestions but was constrained by the play list (which meant I heard Kansas a lot...)


Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: June 02 2021 at 05:09



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Posted By: kenethlevine
Date Posted: June 02 2021 at 07:15
Originally posted by tigerfeet tigerfeet wrote:

Very interesting question and since there are a lot of middle and eastern influences on western prog, especially phych prog, it warrants a lot of research for sure. I found an old link here to bands from various countries listed on these forums. 

http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=51596&PN=1" rel="nofollow - http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=51596&PN=1

One of my favorite artists is Loreena McKennett, who, although is not prog, or from the middle east, has proggy elements through a lot of her work. I also like Orange Blossom, although again, small hints of prog but a lot of New Age influences. 

Loreena was mostly celtic in her early albums but "The Mask and Mirror", "Book of Secrets" and "Ancient Muse" explore various middle and far eastern themes.

Osiris is from Bahrain.  While their early albums don't show that much local influence, "Visions from the Past" shows more.  


Posted By: siLLy puPPy
Date Posted: June 02 2021 at 07:23
Although they are American, nobody has incorporated Middle Eastern sounds into prog better than the Secret Chiefs 3. They mixed surf rock, mariachi, prog, metal and other genres as well.

Second album


Third album





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Posted By: Nogbad_The_Bad
Date Posted: June 02 2021 at 07:32
That's who I was going to recommend

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Posted By: dougmcauliffe
Date Posted: June 02 2021 at 07:33
Rajaz by Camel of course is a classic in the desert prog genre, but try out King Gizzard and the Lizard Wizards Flying Microtonal Banana, if you like that they have two more albums released in the last year in that vein. All of it uses microtonal instrumentation and those harmonic minor scales, personally the afforementioned Flying Microtonal Banana is my favorite of the trilogy

Here's a sample from this years release "LW"



Lastly off the top of my head, Turkish band: Altin Gun - Gece 

another good one, a little more psychedelic rock leaning than prog.


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Posted By: HolyMoly
Date Posted: June 02 2021 at 07:35
Originally posted by Nogbad_The_Bad Nogbad_The_Bad wrote:

That's who I was going to recommend
Me 2

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Posted By: Logan
Date Posted: June 02 2021 at 07:40
I love Agitation Free's Malesch:


Various Area also has middle-eastern vibes.



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Posted By: dougmcauliffe
Date Posted: June 02 2021 at 07:55
Second both of those ^ forgot about Agitation Free

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Posted By: Logan
Date Posted: June 02 2021 at 08:09
Yeah, aside from that Area music on Arbeit macht Frei, there's quite a bit of of middle-easterny music on Crac! and Caution Radiation Area.  

Also, for those that like like progressive ethno folk with free jazz elements, Aktuala is good, I think.


Secret Chiefs 3, as mentioned, is a very good one, and is one of my favourite more modern bands.




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Posted By: Psychedelic Paul
Date Posted: June 02 2021 at 08:51
You may like the middle-eastern-themed Krautrock band, Between, in between listening to the other great suggestions here, or you could try Osiris, who really are from the Middle East: Bahrain to be precise. Smile


Posted By: MortSahlFan
Date Posted: June 02 2021 at 09:31
Everything I'm finding (especially the newer stuff) might not be considered prog, or even good. Mdou Moctar is from Texas, and the song "Tarhatazed" is repetitious, but because it's 11:23, some think "Oh it's prog - it's long".

Here's someone Middle-Eastern, one of the greatest voices, and its a long song, more progressive (and better) than the earlier reference.

Great thread idea!

Fairuz - Al Bosta



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Posted By: BrufordFreak
Date Posted: June 02 2021 at 09:43
Ofra Haza had some proggy Kate Bush-like stuff. 

Orphaned Land, Yossi Sassi, anything with lead singer Noa Gruman (Scardust, Soul Enema).

 


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Posted By: Mirakaze
Date Posted: June 02 2021 at 10:49
A little while ago I was specifically searching for prog from unexpected countries and among the things I found was this ethno-psychedelic track from 1970s Iraq:



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Posted By: judahbenkenobi
Date Posted: June 02 2021 at 11:12
^^ I was surprised to learn that Jethro Tull had those Eastern sounds, since I had never heard Roots to Branches.

The King Gizzard suggestion was very good, but Aktuala was the one I enjoyed the most.

Thanks to everyone for their suggestions! Keep 'em comin' Wink


Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: June 02 2021 at 11:25
You're welcome, but Tull has nothing on Peter Gabriel! "The Feeling Begins" from the Last Temptation soundtrack.


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Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: June 02 2021 at 11:30


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Posted By: BrufordFreak
Date Posted: June 02 2021 at 13:12
Great suggestions^^!



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https://progisaliveandwell.blogspot.com/


Posted By: mathman0806
Date Posted: June 02 2021 at 14:23
Consider the Source incorporates Middle Eastern scales into their brand of eclectic prog.



Posted By: zwordser
Date Posted: June 02 2021 at 17:47
There's a Neo-Prog band from Bahrain called Osiris.  They only have a little Middle Easter feel on the first album (the only one I've heard) but maybe more on some of their others(?).  Anyway, cool to have a really good band from the heart of the Middle East!

http://www.progarchives.com/artist.asp?id=277" rel="nofollow - http://www.progarchives.com/artist.asp?id=277


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Posted By: Hrychu
Date Posted: June 02 2021 at 19:28
In terms of actual Middle Eastern bands, check these out:

Egypt - Simplexity
Israel - Atmosphera, Project RnL

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Posted By: siLLy puPPy
Date Posted: June 02 2021 at 19:40
Hey for all those who suggested AREA (one of my favorite bands of all time), most of their ethnic sounds came from Balkan gypsy flavors not Middle Eastern but i guess there is some crossover since the Balkans were a crossroads of sort.

The prog metal BAK who is on PA was basically mixed black album era Metallica with Middle Eastern flavors

Entire album SCULPTURE



Prog metal band AMASEFFER mixes Israeli folk music with metal. Here's the album Slaves For Life.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tcfGtbvMwKs&list=OLAK5uy_nmtGYHI37NA2ke2u7W8_BG8OE_xP_FrZo" rel="nofollow - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tcfGtbvMwKs&list=OLAK5uy_nmtGYHI37NA2ke2u7W8_BG8OE_xP_FrZo



While not on PA, some consider the tech death metal band NILE progressive. They incorporate lots of ancient Egyptian musical scales and instruments into their brutal death metal.





Here's an old thread that brings up the same topic and has a few suggestions of artists i've never heard of.

http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=53968" rel="nofollow - http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=53968







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Posted By: siLLy puPPy
Date Posted: June 02 2021 at 19:46
Also MELECHESH mixed black metal, folk metal and prog with Arabic folk music





and MR BUNGLE had a few tracks which inspired the Secret Chiefs 3 project




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Posted By: Nogbad_The_Bad
Date Posted: June 02 2021 at 19:50
Of course there's this




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Posted By: siLLy puPPy
Date Posted: June 02 2021 at 20:44
^ that's also primarily Balkan folk music but i just looked up what exactly the parameters of Middle Eastern music includes and it turns out Balkan folk is a branch! So too is Armenian (such as Zartang), Persian, Kurdish and all the other ethnic music styles that evolved from the same parent stock.

So if Balkan music (such as Area and Charming Hostess) are permissible then so is

FARMERS MARKET



BTW, this is an excellent idea for a thread! I have always loved Middle Eastern and Balkan flavors in music especially prog and metal so i decided to make a list on RYM about it!

Please keep any suggestions rolling!


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Posted By: siLLy puPPy
Date Posted: June 02 2021 at 21:32
ALso forgot about this one..




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Posted By: Logan
Date Posted: June 02 2021 at 21:38
Originally posted by siLLy puPPy siLLy puPPy wrote:

^ that's also primarily Balkan folk music but i just looked up what exactly the parameters of Middle Eastern music includes and it turns out Balkan folk is a branch! So too is Armenian (such as Zartang), Persian, Kurdish and all the other ethnic music styles that evolved from the same parent stock.


So if Balkan music (such as Area and Charming Hostess) are permissible then so is


Probably doesn't need saying, but if course the specific Area track I posted starts off with Arabic speech.

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Posted By: siLLy puPPy
Date Posted: June 02 2021 at 21:56
^ true dat. I'm just referring to the musical scales!


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Posted By: Logan
Date Posted: June 02 2021 at 22:02
^ The only musical scales I know well involve the sound of me thumping a bass (a bass as in fish scales, not involving a bass guitar).

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https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLXcp9fYc6K4IKuxIZkenfvukL_Y8VBqzK" rel="nofollow - Duos for fave acts


Posted By: siLLy puPPy
Date Posted: June 02 2021 at 22:28
Just did some research and came up with this list. A lot more than i thought but still not a huge number.

http://rateyourmusic.com/list/siLLy_puPPy/middle-eastern-influenced-prog-folk_rock_metal/" rel="nofollow - https://rateyourmusic.com/list/siLLy_puPPy/middle-eastern-influenced-prog-folk_rock_metal/


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Posted By: Imperial Zeppelin
Date Posted: June 03 2021 at 05:01
Most of the stuff I've come across that are worth while were Psychedelic Rock or Jazz

Some Psych Rock:
Sunn Trio - Fayrus
Blaak Heat - The Arabian Fuzz EP & Shifting Mirrors
Al Doum & The Faryds - Positive Force

Some Jazzy stuff:
Embryo - Embryo's Reise & Ibn Battuta
Station One - Quartet Diminished
Yazz Ahmed - Polyhymnia
Naissam Jalal - Almot Wala Almazala
Elias Nardi - Orange Tree
Eyvind Kang - Alastor (Book of Angels, Volume 21)
Does Azerbaijan count? If so, Vagif Mustafa Zadeh - Themes Of Tofik Kuliev

Some weird/experimental stuff:
Johnny Kafta Anti-Vegetarian Orchestra - s/t
The Dwarfs Of East Agouza - Bes


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Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: June 03 2021 at 05:21



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Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: June 03 2021 at 05:24


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Posted By: siLLy puPPy
Date Posted: June 03 2021 at 07:34
Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:



Great song! But dude that's Indian (as in raga influenced) rather than Middle Eastern Embarrassed


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Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: June 03 2021 at 10:00
According to a Persian friend, the slower build up sections are Arabic with the billistic middle section being raga for Rajan Khan. For the first song I haven't a clue but I think the OP will like it. So just feel half embarrassed.

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Posted By: judahbenkenobi
Date Posted: June 03 2021 at 14:51
Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:

According to a Persian friend, the slower build up sections are Arabic with the billistic middle section being raga for Rajan Khan. For the first song I haven't a clue but I think the OP will like it. So just feel half embarrassed.


I happen to love Indian/Raga sounds too, so I really enjoyed those Renaissance songs.

You can check out my "Indo/Persian" version of Set the Controls for the Heart of the Sun here, if you'd like to:

https://www.bandlab.com/hiedravenenosa/set-the-controls-for-the-heart-of-the-sun-pink-floyd-cover-a5ee2657?revId=37e8d63d-ae3f-eb11-9fb4-501ac5b31de6" rel="nofollow - https://www.bandlab.com/hiedravenenosa/set-the-controls-for-the-heart-of-the-sun-pink-floyd-cover-a5ee2657?revId=37e8d63d-ae3f-eb11-9fb4-501ac5b31de6


Posted By: siLLy puPPy
Date Posted: June 03 2021 at 18:40
Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:

According to a Persian friend, the slower build up sections are Arabic with the billistic middle section being raga for Rajan Khan. For the first song I haven't a clue but I think the OP will like it. So just feel half embarrassed.


That may be so since the trend then was to borrow from anywhere possible but the sitar and overall thematic trend seem much more Indian to me than Middle Eastern. Of course Indian music is somewhat similar in many ways. One of my favorite Renaissance songs actually!


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Posted By: moshkito
Date Posted: June 08 2021 at 07:59
Hi,

I'm still listening to some of the stuff listed here.

However, I have reservations. For a band, any band, to simply have an instrument do something that is usually associated with Middle Eastern music, does not, and never will, make it "progressive" and thus a lot of the stuff listed does not really fit.

I don't consider the early AF progressive at all, as it was a school "study" (paid for too!) that was designed to mix various other elements in music, and specifically Middle Eastern music ... to me that does not make it "progressive".

Guy Guden, in his show, plays a lot of Middle Eastern music, going back so far as MONSOON and then Sheila Chandra, and even going so far as Ofra Haza and many others over the last 40 years! Not all of it is "progressive" but all of them include some western themes and song concepts that their culture might not exactly work on, unless it is simple pop music (and they have a lot of it!!!!) ... however, some of the things he plays these days, would/could/should be considered "progressive" since it is not just a "mix" and a touch of the sound anymore, and the stuff is way better integrated than it was before.

I would venture to say that some things are not "Middle Eastern Prog" and one example is RENAISSANCE, simple because of one song and one sound! 


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Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: June 08 2021 at 08:06
Pedro, this is the 24 minute title track to Scheherazade by Renaissance. This is middle eastern prog.

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Posted By: Progishness
Date Posted: June 08 2021 at 08:14
Not quite prog, but probably more like classical crossover - this has got a distinct hypnotic Middle Eastern feel to it.




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Posted By: Progishness
Date Posted: June 08 2021 at 08:28
As well as the excellent Renaissance track from SteveG, here are a couple of examples of songs with Middle Eastern influence from Annie Haslam's solo works (yes I know she's not in the database here - a moot point).





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Posted By: siLLy puPPy
Date Posted: June 08 2021 at 08:41
Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:

Pedro, this is the 24 minute title track to Scheherazade by Renaissance. This is middle eastern prog.


Not really. Lyrically and poetically for sure but not musically. From the composition standpoint this album is the true definition of symphonic prog more inspired by the classic Scheherazade by Rimsky-Karsakov based on the folk tales One Thousand and One Nights (aka The Arabian Nights).

I just went on a road trip and listened to this whole album like 5 times. There are no hints of Middle Eastern music scales or otherwise that i can detect. In the case of the tales of Scheherazade, they are compiled from Arabic folklore.

If you take the characteristics of Arabic music (and most Middle Eastern music for that matter) they are defined by a few common criteria:

Much of Arabic music is characterized by an emphasis on melody and rhythm as opposed to harmony and typically Arabic music is homophonic not polyphonic like most Western classical music which this album and track are based upon.

There are no musical scales based on the maqam system which features one tonic note. Also there are no traces of the polymorphic percussion styles nor the instrumentation that accents tones, textures and timbres.

So if you're referring to the lyrics and subject matter, you are correct but as far as the music is concerned, there's nothing Middle Eastern about this Renaissance track at all.



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Posted By: siLLy puPPy
Date Posted: June 08 2021 at 08:43
Originally posted by Progishness Progishness wrote:

As well as the excellent Renaissance track from SteveG, here are a couple of examples of songs with Middle Eastern influence from Annie Haslam's solo works (yes I know she's not in the database here - a moot point).





Now THOSE are definitely without any doubt based on Middle Eastern musical elements! Never really checked out Annie's solo output before. Sounds good. Reminds me of a more rockin' Loreena McKennitt!


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Posted By: Progishness
Date Posted: June 08 2021 at 08:46
^ Those are the only two Middle Eastern influenced songs in Annie's solo catalogue that I'm aware of.


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Posted By: Snicolette
Date Posted: June 08 2021 at 08:47
Not technically progressive, but from a psychedelic US band that combined various styles of music based on the band's players' mixed fortes: 

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Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: June 08 2021 at 08:49
Originally posted by siLLy puPPy siLLy puPPy wrote:

Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:


Pedro, this is the 24 minute title track to Scheherazade by Renaissance. This is middle eastern prog.


Not really. Lyrically and poetically for sure but not musically. From the composition standpoint this album is the true definition of symphonic prog more inspired by the classic Scheherazade by Rimsky-Karsakov based on the folk tales One Thousand and One Nights (aka The Arabian Nights).

I just went on a road trip and listened to this whole album like 5 times. There are no hints of Middle Eastern music scales or otherwise that i can detect. In the case of the tales of Scheherazade, they are compiled from Arabic folklore.

If you take the characteristics of Arabic music (and most Middle Eastern music for that matter) they are defined by a few common criteria:

Much of Arabic music is characterized by an emphasis on melody and rhythm as opposed to harmony and typically Arabic music is homophonic not polyphonic like most Western classical music which this album and track are based upon.

There are no musical scales based on the maqam system which features one tonic note. Also there are no traces of the polymorphic percussion styles nor the instrumentation that accents tones, textures and timbres.

So if you're referring to the lyrics and subject matter, you are correct but as far as the music is concerned, there's nothing Middle Eastern about this Renaissance track at all.

And what rule book stated that middle eastern prog was solely confined to music and not lyrics. Get off your high horse and chill out. And save your middle eastern prog 101 lessons for someone less musically aware.

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Posted By: dr wu23
Date Posted: June 08 2021 at 08:52
DCD can incorporate many trad and folk styles but they often do place middle eastern into the mix...
this is more eastern European but other tracks by them have a lot of other tones going on...
Try 'Realm, Serpents Egg, Aion, Labyrinth',,,,





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Haquin


Posted By: siLLy puPPy
Date Posted: June 08 2021 at 08:56
Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:

Originally posted by siLLy puPPy siLLy puPPy wrote:

Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:


Pedro, this is the 24 minute title track to Scheherazade by Renaissance. This is middle eastern prog.


Not really. Lyrically and poetically for sure but not musically. From the composition standpoint this album is the true definition of symphonic prog more inspired by the classic Scheherazade by Rimsky-Karsakov based on the folk tales One Thousand and One Nights (aka The Arabian Nights).

I just went on a road trip and listened to this whole album like 5 times. There are no hints of Middle Eastern music scales or otherwise that i can detect. In the case of the tales of Scheherazade, they are compiled from Arabic folklore.

If you take the characteristics of Arabic music (and most Middle Eastern music for that matter) they are defined by a few common criteria:

Much of Arabic music is characterized by an emphasis on melody and rhythm as opposed to harmony and typically Arabic music is homophonic not polyphonic like most Western classical music which this album and track are based upon.

There are no musical scales based on the maqam system which features one tonic note. Also there are no traces of the polymorphic percussion styles nor the instrumentation that accents tones, textures and timbres.

So if you're referring to the lyrics and subject matter, you are correct but as far as the music is concerned, there's nothing Middle Eastern about this Renaissance track at all.

And what rule book stated that middle eastern prog was solely confined to music and not lyrics. Get off your high horse and chill out. And save your middle eastern prog 101 lessons for someone less musically aware.


The author of the thread clearly stated an interest in Middle Eastern SOUNDS. Just clarifying for those interested. If that's not you then please disregard. In other words, if it don't apply then let it fly.


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Posted By: siLLy puPPy
Date Posted: June 08 2021 at 08:58
Originally posted by dr wu23 dr wu23 wrote:

DCD can incorporate many trad and folk styles but they often do place middle eastern into the mix...
this is more eastern European but other tracks by them have a lot of other tones going on...
Try 'Realm, Serpents Egg, Aion, Labyrinth',,,,





Dead Can Dance were brilliant in how they mixed different folk elements! It's been a while since i've delved into their music but i do believe the last album had some Middle Eastern sounds as well. Those early albums were pure magic!


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Posted By: Shadowyzard
Date Posted: June 08 2021 at 09:27
To the OP:





If you like Myrath, you might like this English delight too:



And you shouldn't miss this:




Posted By: Psychedelic Paul
Date Posted: June 08 2021 at 09:51
This is the best Middle Eastern Prog album I know of..... a recent discovery, found hiding in between my Krautrock collection. Smile

5 stars 1974: Between - Dharana -  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ieoiO46LCtI" rel="nofollow - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ieoiO46LCtI


Posted By: judahbenkenobi
Date Posted: June 08 2021 at 10:07
Originally posted by siLLy puPPy siLLy puPPy wrote:

Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:

Originally posted by siLLy puPPy siLLy puPPy wrote:

Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:


Pedro, this is the 24 minute title track to Scheherazade by Renaissance. This is middle eastern prog.


Not really. Lyrically and poetically for sure but not musically. From the composition standpoint this album is the true definition of symphonic prog more inspired by the classic Scheherazade by Rimsky-Karsakov based on the folk tales One Thousand and One Nights (aka The Arabian Nights).

I just went on a road trip and listened to this whole album like 5 times. There are no hints of Middle Eastern music scales or otherwise that i can detect. In the case of the tales of Scheherazade, they are compiled from Arabic folklore.

If you take the characteristics of Arabic music (and most Middle Eastern music for that matter) they are defined by a few common criteria:

Much of Arabic music is characterized by an emphasis on melody and rhythm as opposed to harmony and typically Arabic music is homophonic not polyphonic like most Western classical music which this album and track are based upon.

There are no musical scales based on the maqam system which features one tonic note. Also there are no traces of the polymorphic percussion styles nor the instrumentation that accents tones, textures and timbres.

So if you're referring to the lyrics and subject matter, you are correct but as far as the music is concerned, there's nothing Middle Eastern about this Renaissance track at all.

And what rule book stated that middle eastern prog was solely confined to music and not lyrics. Get off your high horse and chill out. And save your middle eastern prog 101 lessons for someone less musically aware.


The author of the thread clearly stated an interest in Middle Eastern SOUNDS. Just clarifying for those interested. If that's not you then please disregard. In other words, if it don't apply then let it fly.

You're right about that. I usually don't pay much attention to lyrics. That's why I am more interested in Middle Eastern sounds.

Anyway, I hadn't really heard much from Renaissance, so besides all the good (and not so good ) suggestions I have heard so far in this thread, I appreciate the fact that I was introduced to that band Renaissance. I will definitely have to dedicate some time in the near future to explore them.


Posted By: Progishness
Date Posted: June 08 2021 at 10:17
Originally posted by judahbenkenobi judahbenkenobi wrote:


Anyway, I hadn't really heard much from Renaissance, so besides all the good (and not so good ) suggestions I have heard so far in this thread, I appreciate the fact that I was introduced to that band Renaissance. I will definitely have to dedicate some time in the near future to explore them.


All the studio albums from 'Prologue' through to Azure d'Or' plus 'Live at Carnegie Hall'  are highly recommended.

http://www.progarchives.com/artist.asp?id=603" rel="nofollow - http://www.progarchives.com/artist.asp?id=603


-------------
"We're going to need a bigger swear jar."

Chloë Grace Moretz as Mindy McCready aka 'Hit Girl' in Kick-Ass 2


Posted By: moshkito
Date Posted: June 08 2021 at 20:38
Originally posted by siLLy puPPy siLLy puPPy wrote:

Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:

 
Pedro, this is the 24 minute title track to Scheherazade by Renaissance. This is middle eastern prog.

Not really. Lyrically and poetically for sure but not musically. From the composition standpoint this album is the true definition of symphonic prog more inspired by the classic Scheherazade by Rimsky-Karsakov based on the folk tales One Thousand and One Nights (aka The Arabian Nights).
...
So if you're referring to the lyrics and subject matter, you are correct but as far as the music is concerned, there's nothing Middle Eastern about this Renaissance track at all.


Hi,

Thank you ... I was about to write the same thing. Just because it IS about this and that, so what? It does not make it Middle Eastern Prog. I'm not sure that Steve G has a good idea of what "Middle Eastern Prog" is all about, since the majority of folks here do not even bother to listen to different things other than their top ten or so, with an occasional something or other in the middle.

There is a LOT of Middle Eastern music around, however I am not sure that much of it could/should/would be considered "prog" or "progressive", otherwise someone like DamoX (here on PA) would be creating a thread/blog about many of these bands, and there are a lot of them that are way far and beyond the touch of music that we are so familiar with. It's the same thing for DamoX's blog ... we don't touch or discuss much the many bands that he lists and his doing this over the years is totally insane, and far out! We do not have the equivalent of someone doing Middle Eastern music at all ... and I, for one, wish we had one.


-------------
Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
www.pedrosena.com


Posted By: siLLy puPPy
Date Posted: June 08 2021 at 21:03
I just heard some Middle Eastern sounds on Pendragon's Believe album. THat's such a beautiful album. Not sure why it is rated so low.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GGT8on8HFNM&list=PLFXrsVDC8Iw-UT4A6b3mvtBkmqGSuc1vh" rel="nofollow - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GGT8on8HFNM&list=PLFXrsVDC8Iw-UT4A6b3mvtBkmqGSuc1vh



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https://rateyourmusic.com/~siLLy_puPPy


Posted By: siLLy puPPy
Date Posted: June 08 2021 at 21:09
Originally posted by judahbenkenobi judahbenkenobi wrote:

Originally posted by siLLy puPPy siLLy puPPy wrote:

Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:

Originally posted by siLLy puPPy siLLy puPPy wrote:

Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:


Pedro, this is the 24 minute title track to Scheherazade by Renaissance. This is middle eastern prog.


Not really. Lyrically and poetically for sure but not musically. From the composition standpoint this album is the true definition of symphonic prog more inspired by the classic Scheherazade by Rimsky-Karsakov based on the folk tales One Thousand and One Nights (aka The Arabian Nights).

I just went on a road trip and listened to this whole album like 5 times. There are no hints of Middle Eastern music scales or otherwise that i can detect. In the case of the tales of Scheherazade, they are compiled from Arabic folklore.

If you take the characteristics of Arabic music (and most Middle Eastern music for that matter) they are defined by a few common criteria:

Much of Arabic music is characterized by an emphasis on melody and rhythm as opposed to harmony and typically Arabic music is homophonic not polyphonic like most Western classical music which this album and track are based upon.

There are no musical scales based on the maqam system which features one tonic note. Also there are no traces of the polymorphic percussion styles nor the instrumentation that accents tones, textures and timbres.

So if you're referring to the lyrics and subject matter, you are correct but as far as the music is concerned, there's nothing Middle Eastern about this Renaissance track at all.

And what rule book stated that middle eastern prog was solely confined to music and not lyrics. Get off your high horse and chill out. And save your middle eastern prog 101 lessons for someone less musically aware.


The author of the thread clearly stated an interest in Middle Eastern SOUNDS. Just clarifying for those interested. If that's not you then please disregard. In other words, if it don't apply then let it fly.

You're right about that. I usually don't pay much attention to lyrics. That's why I am more interested in Middle Eastern sounds.

Anyway, I hadn't really heard much from Renaissance, so besides all the good (and not so good ) suggestions I have heard so far in this thread, I appreciate the fact that I was introduced to that band Renaissance. I will definitely have to dedicate some time in the near future to explore them.



Sorry if it sounds like i'm trying to be confrontation with SteveG. Not the case at all. Just trying to have a conversation since Middle Eastern music is one of my favorite ethnic styles. By all means check out Renaissance. Scheherazade is a true masterpiece from beginning to end but it is the perfect example of symphonic prog with a real orchestra. I listened to the album 5  times on a recent road trip! THAT's how good it is and the side long title song really DOES tell the beautiful tales of ancient Arab folklore so from a lyrical point of view, it really does an excellent job! Just don't expect any Middle Eastern instruments, musical scales or polyrhythmic percussion.


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https://rateyourmusic.com/~siLLy_puPPy


Posted By: moshkito
Date Posted: June 09 2021 at 10:31
Originally posted by siLLy puPPy siLLy puPPy wrote:

...Just don't expect any Middle Eastern instruments, musical scales or polyrhythmic percussion.

Hi,

Which by our standards, would make it "progressive" from their point of view specially. Sadly, we think a touch of a cardboard sound is good enough to make it, instead of realizing that it is just giving us the "idea" that it is this and that, and it isn't. It's just an idea!


-------------
Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
www.pedrosena.com


Posted By: Shadowyzard
Date Posted: June 09 2021 at 11:01
Well, this is surely a progressive metal song with some clear Middle Eastern tunes. In general, there's a delightful blend of the Eastern and Western music in the song (and the album where this song is).

From my country, Turkey:






Posted By: kenethlevine
Date Posted: June 09 2021 at 21:22
Originally posted by siLLy puPPy siLLy puPPy wrote:

I just heard some Middle Eastern sounds on Pendragon's Believe album. THat's such a beautiful album. Not sure why it is rated so low.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GGT8on8HFNM&list=PLFXrsVDC8Iw-UT4A6b3mvtBkmqGSuc1vh" rel="nofollow - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GGT8on8HFNM&list=PLFXrsVDC8Iw-UT4A6b3mvtBkmqGSuc1vh


my fave Pendragon album...and it's not even close



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