Can it be Prog if I like it at 1st listen
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Forum Description: General progressive music discussions
URL: http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=10794
Printed Date: February 11 2025 at 01:41
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Topic: Can it be Prog if I like it at 1st listen
Posted By: hdfisch
Subject: Can it be Prog if I like it at 1st listen
Date Posted: August 27 2005 at 20:52
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Maybe a really stupid question to all Progfans around, but might be a basic one: Can an album called a real Prog one, if I like it immediately at the very first listening? I came to this idea listening to the new OPETH output and I've to say, I liked it immediately, as well their previous one, which was in fact quite different from this one. I've to admit, I didn't listen much to their other albums although I've got them all in my collection, only once each and I found all of them not that captivating in the beginning. Although they still use the growling death metal vocals on the new one, I don't find it that much disturbing (although usually I don't favour such vocs). But overall it's very very versatile (maybe that's the reason I like it immediately). I'm currently trying to get into really experimental stuff like Captain Beefheart - Lick My Decals Off, Baby (uploaded by Joren,thanks!), Doctor Nerve -Skin or Centipede - Septober Energy, but although being aware that all that stuff needs definitely several listens for digging it, I've to say that those albums don't give me one tiny hint for another listening, it's just too far out (of my mind I DON'T KNOW ANY MORE WHAT'S PROG OR NOT! ------------- To be prog or not to be, that's not the question! Sillyam Likesbeer |
)! I like a lot of intricate music right from the first (or second) listen, but especially some really experimental and adventurious music just fails to hit my attraction. On the other hand there are really some here around considering more or less pop rock bands (I'm counting most of NeoProg and many Art Rock ones as such) as Prog (with CAPS P) what I can't follow at all. To come to a conclusion:Replies:
Posted By: OldFatherThames
Date Posted: August 27 2005 at 20:56
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Can an album called a real Prog one, if I like it immediately at the very first listening?
.................Yes.........nothing else to say |
Posted By: Fantômas
Date Posted: August 27 2005 at 21:00
What the f**k? 
------------- And above all, is punk 
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Posted By: hdfisch
Date Posted: August 27 2005 at 21:09
You're just repeating my question!
------------- To be prog or not to be, that's not the question! Sillyam Likesbeer |
OldFatherThames wrote:Posted By: cobb
Date Posted: August 27 2005 at 21:20
| Of course progressive music can be accessible on first listen. By my experience, though, the ones that need time are the ones I treasure the most. Take your example- Opeth - I liked it first time as well, but I know it won't get played as much in the future as say, pig farm on the moon. The ones I really like (as compared to ones that intrigue me) on first listen are usually the ones that I tire of easily. This doesn't make them not prog. |
Posted By: Borealis
Date Posted: August 27 2005 at 21:24
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------------- Vive le Québec libre!... |
Posted By: hdfisch
Date Posted: August 27 2005 at 21:32
That's exactly the experience I made. Usually the stuff I like at once I'll not listen many times later on.So stuff like Opeth might be some kind of "easy-listening"-Prog, but what about some stuff that's supposed to be very highly rated Prog and I find it completely boring (I don't mean NeoProg) and not inviting me for a further investigation?
------------- To be prog or not to be, that's not the question! Sillyam Likesbeer |
Posted By: hdfisch
Date Posted: August 27 2005 at 21:39
I liked this one as well at the first listen,maybe it's their best accessible one.I failed to like any other album by CAN (and I listened to couple by them several times). Think Krautrock is just not "my cup of tea" (as is "Post-Rock" or "Indo-Prog" (apart of Quintessence) or Electronic Prog).
------------- To be prog or not to be, that's not the question! Sillyam Likesbeer |
Posted By: cobb
Date Posted: August 27 2005 at 21:40
Just a matter of personal taste. Some things just bore me as well. No two proggers have the same taste in progressive music. That's why we love it so much. It isn't like punk or metal, where all the songs run to basically the same formula. There is a wealth of different sounds, techniques and styles with the progressive genre. I doubt whether there are any here who like all the styles. |
Posted By: Biggles
Date Posted: August 27 2005 at 21:41
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From my experience, the first time you listen to progressive music in general you have to get used to it. If you listen to and end up liking a particularly challenging album, like say Larks' Tongues in Aspic or Close to the Edge, after that it becomes much easier to like other prog music. I liked Dream Theater's "Metropolis Part 2" and Jethro Tull's "A Passion Play" albums from the first moment I heard them, but that was because I'd already been listening to complex music for a while. ------------- The crux of the biscuit is the apostrophe. http://www.last.fm/user/sbonfiglioli/?chartstyle=red"> 
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Posted By: hdfisch
Date Posted: August 27 2005 at 21:45
I can't find both of them that complex!(Maybe for APP I can understand, but for Metropolis?
------------- To be prog or not to be, that's not the question! Sillyam Likesbeer |
Posted By: Nipsey88
Date Posted: August 27 2005 at 22:00
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Is it prog if you like it the first time? Absolutely not. Love of prog must be earned like six-pack abs or an Olympic medal. I never said it was gonna be easy... 
------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Nipsey88/?chartstyle=myspace02" rel="nofollow"> 
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Posted By: cobb
Date Posted: August 27 2005 at 22:06
Of course it is Nipsey. You have deadwing as your avatar- that was certainly likeable on first listen. |
Posted By: Biggles
Date Posted: August 27 2005 at 22:18
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It's called a joke, cobb. ------------- The crux of the biscuit is the apostrophe. http://www.last.fm/user/sbonfiglioli/?chartstyle=red">
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Posted By: cobb
Date Posted: August 27 2005 at 22:20
| Sorry Nipsey... I'm a bit slow on subtlety |
Posted By: Nipsey88
Date Posted: August 27 2005 at 22:33
------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Nipsey88/?chartstyle=myspace02" rel="nofollow">
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Posted By: Nipsey88
Date Posted: August 27 2005 at 23:21
Oh and by the way, I did like Deadwing on first listen. Once you decide that you will no longer place boundaries on what music you will or will not enjoy, I believe that the possibility exists for any music to be instantly appreciated. Whether or not all intricacies of truly complex progressive music can be adequately sussed on the first listen is certainly subject to debate though. ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Nipsey88/?chartstyle=myspace02" rel="nofollow">
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Posted By: Fritha
Date Posted: August 28 2005 at 10:49
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Can't claim to have exactly loved any prog records on the first listening. I would say that for me the most crucial period of listening takes place between the second and fifth time -if I still don't like the record by the fifth time I hear it, the chances of really growing to love it seem fairly slim. Not much empirical evidence yet to support this theory of mine but Relayer is the one example so far. What can I say, I have been lucky with my prog purchases! (*knocks on the wood just in case*) Then there are records that I'm pretty certain I won't like any better with further listenings. (Images and Words -which a friend gave me- comes readily to mind, though I did give the record a second chance recently, out of kindness ------------- I was made to love magic |
No dice.) Yet I do try to listen to all the records I get and buy several times, with perhaps a lengthy pause in between. Occasinally the passing of time works wonders on one's ears...Posted By: Snow Dog
Date Posted: August 28 2005 at 10:59
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I liked both Lizard and Tales from topographic Oceans on first listen.. ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/Snow_Dog" rel="nofollow"> 
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Posted By: stonebeard
Date Posted: August 28 2005 at 12:12
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simple answer: yes ------------- http://soundcloud.com/drewagler" rel="nofollow - My soundcloud. Please give feedback if you want! |
Posted By: King of Loss
Date Posted: August 28 2005 at 13:35
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I liked Close to the Edge, 2112 and BE on the first listen So... Really..... |
Posted By: OldFatherThames
Date Posted: August 28 2005 at 13:49
No, I answer ! |
Posted By: Arnold Layne
Date Posted: August 28 2005 at 13:52
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all the bands that i liked happened immediatly and this includes van der graaf generator, king crimson, The flower kings, and pink floyd ------------- HELP! |
Posted By: Logos
Date Posted: August 28 2005 at 14:00
I've gotten very quickly into most of the albums I love. Close to the Edge was VERY hard tho; I must have listened to it 20 times and thought it was utter sh*te, now I love it more than anything! 
Mostly tho I don't bother with albums I don't like after a few listens. |
Posted By: Sir Hogweed
Date Posted: August 28 2005 at 14:48
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Consider each album as a musical jigsaw puzzle with two basic qualities:
There is also the issue of missing pieces. Sometimes you need other albums by the same band to finish the puzzle. For instance: I didn't like early Yes very much when I tried it at first with TFTO, even after 7 times or so. I tried The Yes Album next and this helped a lot to grow into their musical language. I even started liking side 1 and 4 of TFTO a bit. Right now I'm really enjoying the complex GG puzzle, but I'm still not sure if I will be moved by the end-picture. |
Posted By: Dick Heath
Date Posted: August 28 2005 at 15:28
| Of course................................................daft question really |
Posted By: Dick Heath
Date Posted: August 28 2005 at 15:33
If you must start with some hard ones that demand many listens and then you might be still trying to absorb it , especially Centipede, small wonder. Tony Williams Lifetime's Turn It Over, still does that for me 30 years after first having the album - at least I haven't got bored by the album and hear something new every time. The Yes Album and ITCOCK got me first go, and still have my attentions, they are complex but much more accessible than Beefhear.t |
Posted By: Odd24
Date Posted: August 28 2005 at 15:41
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I liked Genesis' The lamb lies down on broadway at first listen. I was 16 back then (I am 32 now). ------------- Right down the line |
Posted By: Dan Yaron
Date Posted: August 28 2005 at 16:12
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I totally disagree. I can decide on the first introduction what can be liked because I know what I like. |
Posted By: hdfisch
Date Posted: August 28 2005 at 17:59
fIVE times is a pretty good number I think, although - I've to say there are some albums I just can't support for that many listens (if I don't find anything attractive in the beginning). Relayer, yes (YES ) I think I learnt to love it with less than five times. Strangely, Images and Words I used to like in the beginning, meanwhile I don't listen to all DT albums at all anymore, I don't consider them to be very progressive or intricate honestly. I think they're just a matter of taste (mine is always changing from time to time).
------------- To be prog or not to be, that's not the question! Sillyam Likesbeer |
Posted By: transend
Date Posted: August 28 2005 at 18:01
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in a word..YES. I loved 'Spocks beard's' 'The light ' the second I heard it! Same with 'Wish you were here' by Floyd and MANY others.. |
Posted By: hdfisch
Date Posted: August 28 2005 at 18:08
Wow 20 times for CttE, that's tough! Not sure whether I listened any album that often (just not enough time with 5000+ collected)I think I needed 2 or 3 listens for this one,definitely less than for Relayer. CttE is quite accessible (especially if one has seen them performing it live)!
------------- To be prog or not to be, that's not the question! Sillyam Likesbeer |
Posted By: hdfisch
Date Posted: August 28 2005 at 18:11
2112 and BE did it for me as well at the very first time!
------------- To be prog or not to be, that's not the question! Sillyam Likesbeer |
Posted By: hdfisch
Date Posted: August 28 2005 at 18:27
The Yes Album and ITCOCK did it the first time as well for me, their later stuff needed a few more listens, but these are bands (almost) any prog fan should love.Tony Williams is a tough case, I'm trying to like his music every now and then, but mainly the strange vocals are putting me off each time. Usually I love jazz-fusion, but this guy.....anyway a great drummer!
------------- To be prog or not to be, that's not the question! Sillyam Likesbeer |
Posted By: hdfisch
Date Posted: August 28 2005 at 18:30
Not surprised at all!These are just "easy-listening prog" IMO!
------------- To be prog or not to be, that's not the question! Sillyam Likesbeer |
Posted By: floydaholic
Date Posted: August 28 2005 at 21:45
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Yes, but the most rewarding music is the stuff that grows on you. ------------- I'll see you on the Darkside of the moon... |
Posted By: DarioIndjic
Date Posted: August 28 2005 at 21:50
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There is some albums that catched me on the first listening and never annoyed me.There is also albums that i love more and more the more i listen to them and never getting bored with them. ------------- Ars longa , vita brevis |
Posted By: anotherbrick
Date Posted: August 28 2005 at 22:12
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Posted By: penguindf12
Date Posted: August 28 2005 at 23:21
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yesterday I scared myself. I listened to Captain Beefheart's "Lick my Decals Off, Baby" and liked it at first listen!! It's getting easier, I guess...I've essentially immersed myself in prog, so even RIO seems natural now... |
Posted By: Trotsky
Date Posted: August 29 2005 at 01:56
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Answer to you question, Dieter, is of course yes ... because most prog albums you listen to, you already approach as a prog fan ... If you can cast your mind back to the days before full-fledged prog fandom though ... what is very unlikely is that the first time you hear a kind of prog that you haven't heard before, you will enjoy it straight away ... I remember having difficult moments with part of Queen - Queen (I was outraged that Jesus and Doing All Right wasted such excellent melodic beginings, with non-melodic hard rock jams), Genesis - Selling England By The Pound (mainly Battle Of Epping Forest), Henry Cow - Legend, Soft Machine - Third ... and most ironic of all, Gentle Giant - Acquiring The Taste By the time, I patiently waded through those albums and became a fan, I had already gone through a process that enabled me to enjoy "difficult" stuff like VDGG instantly ------------- "Death to Utopia! Death to faith! Death to love! Death to hope?" thunders the 20th century. "Surrender, you pathetic dreamer.” "No" replies the unhumbled optimist "You are only the present." |
Posted By: Fritha
Date Posted: August 29 2005 at 06:28
Yes, a person's listening history does often play a big part in this matter, I agree. I have certainly noticed how it gets easier to get into different kind of musical landscapes once the ear has been "trained" to hear prog in the first place. But what it really seems to come down to is attitude. If you are ready to be exposed to something completely different, even as a complete "prog dummie" it is easier to embrace it from the start. I remember hearing Hemispheres for the first time and even though it was certainly weird (Led Zep was the most intricate music I had been listening to thus far), it still got my attention because I was, well, EXPECTING weird. I took an almost childlike delight in all those time signatures and odd meters and truly wanted to figure them out; not drumming-wise -apart from tentatively trying to air-drum along with Neil, lol- but to make sense of them as an integral part of the songs. Someone here compared prog music to a musical jigsaw and that's it, exactly: the desire to put all those pieces together in your mind. When I say that I haven't been able to fall in love with any prog records on the first listen, it doesn't mean that they didn't excite me and intrigue me from the very beginning -they did. But I definitely needed at least two or three spins before I could admit to true love. Of course, I forgot the wonderful exception called Wish You Were Here...so far the only record in my collection that WAS true love at first hearing. ------------- I was made to love magic |
Posted By: Ray Lomas
Date Posted: August 29 2005 at 07:13
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Listening to prog or any music becomes 'easier' when you're more 'experienced', that's true. Having said that I have had some difficulties getting to bebob Miled Davis. It seems just very confusing music. The most difficult experience for me so far. And I have already listened and liked some Magma, Amon Düül II etc. So does anyone have any experience with Miles Davis? Maybe I should approach this the same as to prog and listen more 'easy' jazz music first. Any suggestions? I know that this isn't exactly prog but relates to the topic. |
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: August 29 2005 at 07:16
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Try tribute albums ... they're often not as "hard-core" as the original albums. John Coltrane is another case of rather inacessible yet absolutely divine ground-breaking music. I like Karrin Allyson's album "Ballads - remembering John Coltrane" ... it prepares you for the rather "giant steps" of the man. ------------- https://awesomeprog.com/release-polls/pa/aotm-2025-1/vote" rel="nofollow - 2025 Monthly Release Poll Listened to: 
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Posted By: Ray Lomas
Date Posted: August 29 2005 at 07:24
OK, thanks MikeEnRegalia. I hadn't even thought of that. I think I'll try some of the tribute albums, then.
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