Europeans' opinions on UK's EU Referendum...
Printed From: Progarchives.com
Category: Topics not related to music
Forum Name: General discussions
Forum Description: Discuss any topic at all that is not music-related
URL: http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=106969
Printed Date: February 22 2025 at 10:28
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 11.01 - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: Europeans' opinions on UK's EU Referendum...
Posted By: Dean
Subject: Europeans' opinions on UK's EU Referendum...
Date Posted: June 10 2016 at 07:49
|
That the full title of this thread should read: Europeans' Opinions on UK's EU Membership Referendum ...but that was too many characters for a thread title Please note that there is a http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=105977" rel="nofollow - Brexit ¹ poll for UK people to rant about whether to Remain or Leave and frankly, I couldn't care less about the knee-jerk thoughts of people who are actually entitled to vote in this referendum. If I wanted to join that debate I would have back in March - I didn't then and I don't now. That is not the purpose of this thread, there is sufficient debate (happening on Facebook and elsewhere) from both sides in the UK that has thrown up so many half-truths, idle speculation, unsubstantiated guessing and outright fibs if I hear another I'll probably puke. So, I would like to hear the thoughts of the European members of this site about whether the UK should remain in the EU or whether it should go. Of course that will no doubt involve your personal thoughts on the EU in general and whether your own country should remain or leave if it is itself an EU member, or join or not if it currently isn't. However, that is not the question I am asking. I'm not that interested in whether you personally think the EU is a good thing or the worst idea in the history of the world. A country leaving the EU is unprecedented and has never happened before and it is not without consequences and repercussions. Here are a few of the questions that are running around in my head over this...
[Non-Europeans can chime-in if they wish but really that's a whole different topic] ¹Personally I object to the use of "Brexit" in that poll's title as this referendum is not called The Britain Exit of the EU Referendum anymore than it is called the Britain Remain in the EU Referendum. Brexit is merely the name given to those campaigning to leave the EU. ------------- What? |
Replies:
Posted By: Finnforest
Date Posted: June 10 2016 at 08:44
|
Answer to #13: One can dream. ------------- ...that moment you realize you like "Mob Rules" better than "Heaven and Hell" |
Posted By: Vompatti
Date Posted: June 10 2016 at 10:49
I hope you make the right decision and get out before the EU completely collapses, and I hope that that will speed up the process for the rest of us.  Also, I wouldn't mind a bit or in fact a lot of recession for the whole Europe, since what's bad for the economy is generally good for the world as a whole.  |
Posted By: someone_else
Date Posted: June 10 2016 at 11:01
My thoughts as well. A Brexit is to prefer above a Bremain and I hope that the Netherlands and 26 other countries will follow soon after. Answer to #4: A united Europe is not possible at all. Not as a superstate anyway. Throughout history peoples always wanted to govern their own affairs. Answer to #6: The greatest risk for Europe's stability may be an EU that dose not collapse. Answer to #18: They may try to do so. Don't expect Junck and his gang to applaud.
------------- 
|
Vompatti wrote:Posted By: The T
Date Posted: June 10 2016 at 13:31
|
I'm not European. But what the hell now that I'm 'Murican I can meddle into the problems of any part of the globe and bring you some freedom if you complain... 
------------- 
|
Posted By: infocat
Date Posted: June 11 2016 at 02:22
|
What is this "Europe" you speak of? ------------- -- Frank Swarbrick Belief is not Truth. |
Posted By: Flight123
Date Posted: June 17 2016 at 06:16
|
I want us to remain in Europe, for many, many reasons. The debate has got venomous here and I am of the opinion that there should not be a referendum. The hatred appeared to overspill yesterday with the tragic murder of Jo Cox - and it has got to stop. I am still in shock. |
Posted By: Guldbamsen
Date Posted: June 17 2016 at 07:19
|
I seriously question whether I, or any civilian for that matter, have enough information to actually care one way or the other. The EU climate in Europe, and Denmark, is plagued with far too much unnecessary sh*te that it becomes increasingly difficult to take a stance one way or the other. I am a firm believer of nations working together, but I fear that the actual glue that EU binds us all together with sadly amounts to the foulest of bureaucracies. Things that took a week to decide in the old days now take years. As a fan of music, art and litterature one could hope for a European meltdown. History has time and again proven that adversity spawns greatness in those aforementioned areas As for Britain leaving the EU? Maybe it's a healthy thing, I'm not sure, but at the very least it'll lead to a much needed debate in other countries, where we hopefully could address some of the more fundamental reasons for politically driven collaborations between nations. ------------- “The Guide says there is an art to flying or rather a knack. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.” - Douglas Adams |
Posted By: The T
Date Posted: June 20 2016 at 10:10
|
http://www.slate.com/blogs/browbeat/2016/06/20/john_oliver_insults_europe_while_making_the_case_against_brexit.html" rel="nofollow - John Oliver is a European so I'll put his opinion here. Also, he's the best thing to have come to the US from Britain in the last century
-------------
|
Posted By: Guldbamsen
Date Posted: June 22 2016 at 02:16
|
After having discussed this matter further with my good friend Davy (UK citizen) I have come to the conclusion that I'd prefer Britain to remain in the EU. For all it's flaws and infinite amount of red tape, EU still stands for something more (whatever that may be), and I fear the consequences of leaving far outweigh the negatives of staying. Also: I am rather partial to Scotsmen - especially when they bring the drink ------------- “The Guide says there is an art to flying or rather a knack. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.” - Douglas Adams |
Posted By: someone_else
Date Posted: June 22 2016 at 03:21
The full list of answers that fit my humble opinion best:
-------------
|
Posted By: ClemofNazareth
Date Posted: June 22 2016 at 06:40
|
Good luck to our British members on your referendum tomorrow. Best wishes whichever way the vote turns out. ------------- "Peace is the only battle worth waging." Albert Camus |
Posted By: Icarium
Date Posted: June 22 2016 at 07:27
|
as a non-Eu member, but European , we still follow lot of the EU laws and regulations ass part of EEF (ETA?) SO even if we are not in EU we sort of is, accidentaly -------------  
|
Posted By: The T
Date Posted: June 22 2016 at 09:01
|
If UKIP wins, You keep that sh*t. We already have our own...  -------------
|
Posted By: Dean
Date Posted: June 22 2016 at 10:56
Understandably the "Norway Option" has received a fair bit of press coverage over here. It seems that you pay around £100 per person a year to not be a member, which coincidentally is pretty much what each Brit pays to be a fully-paid up member. Of course the real maths wouldn't work out quite like for many reasons too boring to go into. ------------- What? |
Posted By: The T
Date Posted: June 22 2016 at 11:02
|
A case of "taxation without representation" if there has ever been one.... -------------
|
Posted By: Dean
Date Posted: June 22 2016 at 11:03
No kidding there, UKIP and the Tea Party are equally nasty. Now, if only we could ship Nigel out to Alaska....
What you also have is a "Boris":  ...and since our Boris was born in New York you're welcome to him too. ------------- What? |
Posted By: Dean
Date Posted: June 22 2016 at 11:05
...technically there http://www.historynet.com/debunking-boston-tea-party-myths.htm" rel="nofollow - wasn't before  ------------- What? |
Posted By: The T
Date Posted: June 22 2016 at 12:05
|
Oh don't bring Tea Parties here... I'm no Tea party fan. Damn, I don't even like T parties too much... -------------
|
Posted By: The T
Date Posted: June 22 2016 at 12:06
-------------
|
Posted By: Icarium
Date Posted: June 22 2016 at 12:37
|
Richard Branson want to stay inside EU -------------
|
Posted By: A Person
Date Posted: June 22 2016 at 14:19
Alaska is far too close to the rest of humanity to place someone like that. |
Posted By: silverpot
Date Posted: June 22 2016 at 14:47
Oh my, be careful what you wish for. Ever heard of World War I? |
Posted By: silverpot
Date Posted: June 22 2016 at 15:06
|
I really hope UK will stay. There is nothing to gain in the long run to not have a union. What says that domestic politicians make so much better decisions than those in Brussells? Farage or Boris in the UK, Le Pen in France, Orbán in Hungary, just to mention a few scary guys and gals that must be stopped. EU government neesd to reform, I agree on that, but let's do it together. Make it better. As for the European song contest; be proud of your null points.  |
Posted By: Blacksword
Date Posted: June 23 2016 at 01:37
|
Well, the time has come. The polls are open in the UK. Tomorrow we will know whether are going to be shafted by the EU or shafted by our own leaders. A historic day. A day when the British government turned to its people and asked them to vote on something that no one in the country has a f***ing clue about and could potentially destroy the country, and bring about a global crash. Good times :-) ------------- Ultimately bored by endless ecstasy! |
Posted By: JJLehto
Date Posted: June 23 2016 at 03:24
|
As a non euro I shall respect the wishes of the OP and hey, guess it technically doesn't impact me though ya know, potential economic impacts of a Britain exit certainly would. As it would all of us. Anywho, I'll just say the EU is an imperfect union. The drawbacks of trying to form a union exist, but without the benefits (economically) of central mechanisms. Thus this kind of policy handcuffing which has proven dangerous when some members slip and fall into a lake with 20 others attached... Also countries still play the old games of trade, meaning Germany's surplus is others deficit, and places still trying to fight for position. All understandable but as I once heard, no one measures the trade balance of California... A better working EU would require more integration, to the point of countries being actual states to a central power, an extremely difficult goal to say the least. Until such a thing, or reforms of some kind, happen Europe may be stuck in this "hand tied but all still independent" issue. The UK has it a bit better by not being on the Euro, though (I am not sure how binding it is?) there are still EU laws mandating austerity, which I'll leave alone. I get why people may be skeptical/upset of giving up political and economic control to an "outside" power, in a way feels like here and "moneyed interests" and the oligarchy etc which guide our policies and the people seem to have little real input. That said, no one really has any idea what would happen with an exit, and what may result economically to the UK, EU and world. So yeah, my rambling on the generic situation, thoughts on how to vote, as a non Euro I shant touch it. Best of luck to whatever the outcome is
|
Posted By: JJLehto
Date Posted: June 23 2016 at 03:32
|
Sorry, you all have to keep Boris! And Le Pen, and Wilders, and UKIP, Lega Nord and all the right wing populist movements popping up I can't keep track of. The US is insane and disturbing, but finally we all are in the same boat, as citizens of the world we all must suffer together
 |
Posted By: CPicard
Date Posted: June 23 2016 at 05:41
|
So, today is the day, and I can't help having a bad feeling: I fear that the exit of UE by UK would start a chain reaction of other "exits", leading not only to the collapse of UE, but to the destruction of the geopolitical "equilibrium" on the European continent. The UE is already a non-existent entity on the diplomatical level, but if it was to be reduced to the core of its founding members (and I even suspect some people already dreaming of a "Frexit"), it will have no power on the geopolitical field, leaving the only powers being the USA, Russia, China and a fourth player (India? Iran? A nationalistic Japan building its military power???) And that would not be good news for world peace... (maybe not so exagerated) |
Posted By: Blacksword
Date Posted: June 23 2016 at 06:29
I predict we'll vote to remain, but I agree with you regarding a possible chain reaction. If the vote is very close then this could tempt the skeptics in other member states to start pushing their nations towards the door. In the possible chaos that ensues, Putin will move his pieces on the great chessboard. ------------- Ultimately bored by endless ecstasy! |
Posted By: A Person
Date Posted: June 23 2016 at 08:02
|
I think the Bremainers will win, personally |
Posted By: JJLehto
Date Posted: June 23 2016 at 22:48
|
Seems "leave" is winning. The EU is very poorly designed and a bad deal for many of the countries involved I'd say, but it's also like the mafia: When you join you're in for life and leaving may result in your death. I'd say probably better to reform the EU instead of countries leaving, but now that leave seems like it'll win...what would happen? I hear it's a non binding vote and maybe they simply will stay even if leave wins. If so...what would happen to Cameron? Is this simply a protest vote or do people really want/expect to leave? If so, I'd imagine there would have to be negative results for Cameron and co for ignoring the vote. Perhaps staying is important enough to risk this?
|
Posted By: lazland
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 00:06
|
Just got up to have a cup of tea and shower before going to work. Leave vote is on 52%, and is certain to win, a seismic vote in the UK. As it is only just 6.00 a.m. I am not in much of a state to comment in detail, , but looking at the results this vote confirms to me a point I have made a number of times here, that is the massive gap in attitudes towards politics and the world between the metropolitan world of London and the rest of us. From what I can make out, only Scotland and Northern Ireland outside of London voted to stay in in any numbers, which also raises some very interesting implications for the future.David Cameron. Rich twit from Eton, responsible for the breakup of one Union, and quite possibly more. He and Osborne are utter toast. Hopefully, so will Corbyn be as well. Idiots. Interesting times ahead. To our American comrades. Don't underestimate the depth of this. This explains Trump just as equally. ------------- Enhance your life. Get down to www.lazland.org Now also broadcasting on www.progzilla.com Every Saturday, 4.00 p.m. UK time! |
Posted By: JJLehto
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 00:11
|
I agree 100% on the Trump thing. So many people bemoan populism, mock it (always a bad idea in my book) but Trump, the UK vote, what's happening all over Europe. It aint coming from nothing. I think governments all over the world are failing their people, (in my eyes thanks to the Friedman/Reagan/Thatcher neoliberalism) and the result is a global Sanders and Trump rebellion. Change some names, maybe a few ideas here and there but largely its a global response to the same issues
|
Posted By: rogerthat
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 00:31
| I was watching the run up to the brexit with interest. Esp the tv pundits almost unanimously predicting a close win for Remain. I feel amused and sad that sitting in India I had a better feel for how the voting would go than these well paid pundits. I sold equity holdings yesterday in anticipation of a brexit. My rule of thumb was simple: People who didn't MIND remaining in EU wouldn't turn up in large enough numbers to vote while the leave vote would get mobilised. A CNBC expert was saying that armageddon doesn't happen once in every few years and this time (unlike 2008) politicians would work to resolve the crisis (like Grexit). That's dead wrong because a referendum puts the power in the hands of the people. Whether the govt then obeys the mandate is another matter but they cannot control and 'resolve' a referendum unless they rig it. Can't believe how clueless some of these people are. Do they like never step out of their air conditioned comfort (that's a very Indian expression, sorry, because it is a luxury rather than a necessity in most of India)? |
Posted By: ALotOfBottle
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 01:35
|
Fun fact: Brian Eno voted for Bremain. ------------- Categories strain, crack and sometimes break, under their burden - step out of the space provided. |
Posted By: JJLehto
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 02:13
|
All very excellent points Roger. Boy, I have railed against the EU, and I do think there are many issues with it, and while I do get the anger, frustration and desperation I have to admit didn't actually think this would happen. Guess like the pundits I made an assumption and am eating my words. It's kind of sad to see so many people turning their backs on each other and wanting to wall off. This is not just UK I mean, it's happening all over and certainly here in the states. The knee jerk will be bad, markets tumbling and I hear the Dow will open the day already in the toilet but we shall see how things shake out. What I am curious about is, besides potential economic ramifications, what about other "exits"? I'd imagine France at the least is gunna want a referendum? |
Posted By: Dean
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 02:34
Fun fact: Farage now says this was "a mistake"... what he means is it was "a blatant lie" I wonder wow many more of their slogans and promises will turn out to be "a mistake" ------------- What? |
Posted By: JJLehto
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 02:35
|
Any hope that Scotland holds their own referendum to exit the UK and stay in the EU? While at it, can they vote to expel Donald Trump and seize his land? EDIT: Joking btw, but wouldn't mind if they did vote to kick Trump out |
Posted By: Dean
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 02:39
|
I think the more pressing issue is what happens to Northern Ireland, they also voted to stay in the EU and they will now share a land-border with an EU country. Closing that border will have serious implications to the Anglo-Irish agreement that brokered the fragile peace in the province. ------------- What? |
Posted By: BaldFriede
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 02:39
|
The Brits will very soon regret their decision; the effect on the economy will be considerable. The Pound already plummeted deeply. Even the politicians that propagated the Brexit will soon wish they hadn't because the effects this decision will have will lead to a loss in popularity. Wise after the event... -------------  BaldJean and I; I am the one in blue. |
Posted By: JJLehto
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 02:55
Certainly an intriguing situation. I have no idea the mechanism/timeline for this but surely there must be a way to figure out a solution?
|
Posted By: rogerthat
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 03:00
My father works with Europeans a lot and an English acquaintance of his said he was voting leave and also that his friends in Denmark and Sweden were watching the UK referendum (so if UK voted leave maybe these countries follow suit). Worst case scenario is the entire postwar multilateral org-led order is upended. Because if EU gets broken up, it indicates a rejection of economic integration and free trade. So orgs like WTO could also be threatened. Of course that's the worst case scenario. We have to wait and see how it unfolds.
|
Posted By: Dean
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 03:14
|
Hopefully the rest of the EU will re-group and stand together. It will certainly shake things up a lot because they've just lost the third largest contributor to their budget and that is going to hurt all the member countries financially. ------------- What? |
Posted By: Icarium
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 04:02
|
Will UK part with Gibraltar is the big question -------------
|
Posted By: someone_else
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 04:05
|
Who's Nexit? -------------
|
Posted By: Dean
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 04:05
They voted 95.9% in favour of remaining in Europe, they should be granted that wish. ------------- What? |
Posted By: Icarium
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 04:17
-------------
|
Posted By: JJLehto
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 04:23
Hmm, yeah I know we've discussed before the issue with a monetary union that lacks a central mechanism for fiscal policy. All the 50 states are bound by the US dollar, but there's at least a central gov to somewhat counter act that. Europe, far as I know please anyone correct me if I'm wrong, lacks that so each is on their own..while still having their hands tied. One way to hold things together may be to develop such a thing? It of course comes with its own issues...here a red state can cut taxes and services, because Uncle Sam can step in with its own aid to cover the gap, BUT Uncle Sam is really states like New Jersey, New York, California...states that give more to the federal gov than they receive, so us in affluent high tax NJ help Mr Tea Party in Kansas get away with his slashing From what I gather, many in the UK felt this type of pressure, an earlier picture was a great example, so it's not exactly easy to willingly give up more sovereignty when many Europeans may already feel jipped. I do think some stronger central force is needed, so Germany isn't the de facto central government of Europe...and trade would have to perhaps happen as a bloc so no more trade wars between Euro countries. Hopefully the shock of this will have an upside and Europe does pull together, tries to hammer out some reforms, instead of pulling apart.
|
Posted By: Dean
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 04:23
...just like Andorra isn't ... or was that Endor? Then again, Spain has enough separatist problems of its own one more won't make much difference. ------------- What? |
Posted By: JJLehto
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 04:27
Ah but does that mean Scotland and Northern Ireland should be parted with?
|
Posted By: Icarium
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 04:42
|
uniting the ireland -------------
|
Posted By: Dean
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 05:17
Perhaps but Scotland and Northern Island weren't quite as emphatic about remaining as Gibraltar was. A greater percentage of Londoners voted remain than Scots or Northern Irish so if we're talking about splitting up the country then the ancient Kingdom of Middlesex ought to be the first to be granted independence. /edit: http://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/analysis-and-features/could-london-become-a-separate-city-state-9089179.html" rel="nofollow - referendum was a 52:48 split vote compared to a 38:62 split in Scotland - Nicola Sturgeon has called that "unequivocal" but since over a third of Scots wanted out I say she's being presumptive. By comparison the Scottish Independence referendum was a 45:55 split vote, which like the EU referendum isn't an unequivocal or emphatic vote one way or the other - either way just under half the country is going to be pissed off about the result. Unfortunately all these things are fuelled by historical and deeply ingrained hate and distrust that has little basis or validity in modern reality. And that's too depressing to even think about at this particular moment in time. Frankly, if we could eradicate nationalism, patriotism and jingoism the world would be a far better place to live in.
That's not going to happen, at least I cannot see it happening in my lifetime.
------------- What? |
Posted By: Quinino
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 05:22
|
"Frankly, if we could eradicate nationalism, patriotism and jingoism the world would be a far better place to live in." Come to my arms!  |
Posted By: Dean
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 05:32
Only if you have an unlimited supply of pastéis de nata  ------------- What? |
Posted By: rushfan4
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 05:46
Ugh....there goes my retirement account....again!!! 
------------- 
|
Posted By: Quinino
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 05:52
|
I love you more for that, Dean, now you conquered my heart |
Posted By: CPicard
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 05:56
|
Good job, British voters: with your stupid shenanigans, now the far-right-wing French party Front National is going to show off its huge boner on every TV political show, annoying us with their "Frexit" nonsense! Really, thanks again to you!  I just hope that the Dutches and the Austrians won't join the dance.Tssk, tssk. |
Posted By: silverpot
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 06:08
|
Depressing. And I must say, this has been an example of extraordinarily bad leadership. Throwing crap and lies at each other instead of serving facts and reason. The campains have been utterly awful from both sides, shame on them. And as an answer to Roger upthread; No, Sweden aren't leaving any day soon. Those who want a swexit are mostly clowns on the left and right fringes. |
Posted By: Nogbad_The_Bad
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 06:16
|
Bad day for Britain and Europe should case a major shake up in both. I'd be fine with that if the leaders of the breakup weren't such racist idiots. The ruling elite have misjudged how much they are mistrusted. This certainly foreshadows the upcoming US election ------------- Ian Host of the Post-Avant Jazzcore Happy Hour on Progrock.com https://podcasts.progrock.com/post-avant-jazzcore-happy-hour/ |
Posted By: someone_else
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 07:14
-------------
|
Posted By: Sean Trane
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 08:04
|
|
Posted By: progaardvark
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 08:09
|
This is all small potatoes compared to Trexit (no, not Turkey). http://newsthump.com/2016/05/20/trexit-could-mean-intergalactic-war-warn-klingons/" rel="nofollow - http://newsthump.com/2016/05/20/trexit-could-mean-intergalactic-war-warn-klingons/ ------------- ---------- i'm shopping for a new oil-cured sinus bag that's a happy bag of lettuce this car smells like cartilage nothing beats a good video about fractions |
Posted By: The T
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 09:03
I understand where you're coming from, but isn't this the same as saying democracy doesn't work? (I'm not saying it does, I'm just asking). Also, isn't this saying only the privileged ones should have a say? -------------
|
Posted By: Luca Pacchiarini
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 09:05
|
For years, I've spent my time -our time- projecting our move to the Uk.
I've done my master degree in England (2014-15) and I was looking to go back there in september/october.
The reason why I directly didn't stay there, instead deciding to work for six months in Italy, was that I didn't want to be accused on intellectual dishonesty. There's plenty of mediterranean people that moan about how terrible it is in Italy or Spain despite having never worked there, and just go abroad. I wanted to try first, and then possibly go away. And maybe, some work experience in Italy would have been beneficial for my cv, to find something better once in the Uk..
My girlfriend is a Nigerian citizen with an Italian passport (she came here when she was 6). She couldn't find a job in Italy despite having a degree with great marks because apparently she's too brown for a lot of peoples' taste. So she decided to go and work for a year in Thailand (she does like to work, we don't give a sh*t about getting benefits etc etc). SO we basically waited each other...she would end her year in september, my contract would expire in september, and i the Uk together we'd go.
Far from all the racists, far from Berlusconi and Renzi, far from our families that do not want us to see each other because of the colour of the skin, happy to work for England and pay our taxes there. Now everything is in peril: my industry is tourism, the one that will likely be damaged the most by this horrific outcome. How come is a tour operator/travel agency going to employ an italian/spanish/german/portuguese speaker if international tourism will plummet? (Yes, I speak 5 different languages contrarily to the Sun-reading, ManUnited-supporting fascists that voted leave)
You never had to worry about going to leave in another country, you never did: you soon will have to.
And this dream was obliterated by this band of prostate-farting old retards that yearn for the empire wheraes they will be dead before brexit becomes a reality You killed both our lives and I hope to see the Uk turned into a barren, poverty stricken landscape, I will hate you forever, enjoy your holidays in Blackpool
We're going to Ireland, b*****ds If this means a ban or a warning, I don't care Viva la libertà! There you have my opinion on the Uk referendum |
Posted By: lazland
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 09:58
|
^ thanks for that supremely balanced view, Luca. Can anyone find, and post, a link to a video, or photo failing the vid, to a prostate farting old retard? I will not rest until I get to see one in action ------------- Enhance your life. Get down to www.lazland.org Now also broadcasting on www.progzilla.com Every Saturday, 4.00 p.m. UK time! |
Posted By: The T
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 09:58
|
Make Britain Great Again -------------
|
Posted By: rogerthat
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 10:09
Phew, so the guy my dad's acquaintance spoke to was hopefully one of those clowns. I'd only add that UKIP started out a far right fringe clown too and then it grew into a monster. Not that I want Swexit but I fear we are entering all-bets-are-off zone now. On a related note, the Oracle of Delphi crawled out of the woodwork to deliver an utterly gloomy prognosis. And...short of using the word that begins with K, he is basically asking for stimulus. Go eat humble pie, free market wrecketeer.
|
Posted By: AZF
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 10:16
|
Well I worked all day yesterday at my local Polling Station (Try it! If you don't think you'll like the outcome look into Poll Clerk work, it sweetens the pill!) and I think we had about 7 or 10 people who bought a pen! Look, after all the results are counted they are put into a sack which can only be opened on the orders of a Judge, so the idea of rubbing out results on an industrial scale are ludicrous! Anyway, some people on my Facebook are inconsolable over this. I wish the EU well, would of been great if we could of worked together better, but this wasn't to be. And should France, Sweden, the Netherlands and Italy decide on their own referendums don't rely on fear! And the irony of the people who used pens yesterday was wasted as my area was one of the few to unanimously vote for "Remain"! Well it made me laugh and let's face it, we could do with some of that today. |
Posted By: Flight123
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 10:40
|
I am totally depressed by the result (and I lived in one of the few areas of England outside of London to vote remain). It will unleash hell. |
Posted By: lazland
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 11:02
No, it won't. It really won't. In the short term, it means being governed by a bunch of metropolitan tosspots in London rather than Brussels. The real test is when someone comes along to challenge properly the political consensus run by said metropolitan tosspots. Then it will become very interesting. In fact, I welcome very much the fact that all bets are off, and suddenly politics has become dynamic and interesting again. All possibilities are now open. A lesson from yesterday. For the first time in many years, every single vote counted. Every single one, without fear or favour, and the people of the country voted in their droves to celebrate that fact, whether you agree with the result, or not. What a refreshing thing, eh? How we could properly transform our politics and country if every single election or vote carried as much weight. When it did, the people, by a clear majority, took the opportunity to deliver a massive great big raspberry to our ruling establishment. Two fingers up, and sod the consequences. As a libertarian, and former political activist of many years standing, I welcome that with great big open arms. It's called democracy in action, and it is a wonderful thing. ------------- Enhance your life. Get down to www.lazland.org Now also broadcasting on www.progzilla.com Every Saturday, 4.00 p.m. UK time! |
Posted By: Luca Pacchiarini
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 11:25
|
good luck to you all. I've got to know many british people, some of whom I consider true friends, on the other hand today I'd quite fancy seeing the Uk face the destiny of Atlantis
The best way I can define this referendum is "an ill-advised excess of democracy" We should call back all our cooks, then after 3 months you'll be crying to get back in again
|
Posted By: lazland
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 11:38
I'm sorry, Luca, but wishing us the destiny of Atlantis is way over the top, sorry. My father's family is Maltese. I have visited Italy on a couple of occasions. I was born in West Germany, albeit when my father was serving in the British Army there. I love Europe. I am exceptionally proud of my family heritage, and will be going back there again on family holiday in August. I adore Italian history and culture. Great Britain can still learn a great deal from European culture, especially that of the southern part of the continent. I wish nothing but the best for all peoples of all nations. That does not mean that I, or many people in this country, want to share the same government as you. I am afraid that the mistake that many people who backed Remain made is that a vote to come out, and concern over numbers of inward migration into the country, is to equate that with racism. The vast majority of people are not racist. Like me, they want us all to get along in peace and harmony. ------------- Enhance your life. Get down to www.lazland.org Now also broadcasting on www.progzilla.com Every Saturday, 4.00 p.m. UK time! |
Posted By: Luca Pacchiarini
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 12:05
Would make for a great concept album, though
I never thought (not even for a moment) that the majority of Uk residents are racists. I lived there for one year and I never, never, felt treated as a foreigner. I do however feel that many of you do not realise how a big part of Britain's success (yes, you were one of the best economies in the EU, you might not feel that way, but maybe from an outsider perspective it's evident) was attributable to your ability to draw high-skilled immigration. Hell, here in Italy (and Spain is similar I think) university marks are calculated from 1-110, once you have more than 105 they tell you "oh you're ready for England" You basically had brilliant minds (I'm NOT including myself in this group) come over to you, give you their knowledge, pay your taxes, and integrate well into your society. The same with greece, Portugal, etc. I'm not sure you can replace these people with UK nationals, if they are on the same level of preparation, how come did we get all the jobs in the tourism/food/events/creativity/ sectors? Not to mention the staggering amount of people employed in the sanitary sistem (hell, I could speak sicilian or andaluz in the hospitals)...the same with researchers...we're the second country with more research funding grants in Europe (see graph) but almost noone of these researches are conducted in Italy, ALL the best researchers go to the UK and work there. Now your system will not have the European grants, no brilliant researchers, not even their taxes.  With different sectors and jobs I suppose you could say this about other EU countries. I chose the Italian expatriates example because it's the one I know best. Besides, I think a lot of people from other EU states feel sort of betrayed as this will probably have as much an impact on our economies as on yours...and we didn't get to vote. You were doing fine!!! Brussels was not governing anything, otherwise you would have been in the same state as Portugal Greece Italy etc.. Do you seriously think there was need to change? |
Posted By: Dean
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 12:31
As a EU supporter and Remain voter I can honestly say you can keep your stroppy cooks and chefs, and your "authentic" trattoria and pizzeria, we can live without them. British chefs and English food were never bad, (just look in any Edwardian or Victorian cook book), it just suffered greatly for the first half of the 20th century because of two world wars and a world depression - we simply forgot what good food and good produce tasted like because we couldn't have it.
------------- What? |
Posted By: Modrigue
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 13:09
I think the main reason why more and more European citizens from different countries turn anti-UE is that they want to take revenge and punish their incompetent and 'beyond the law' political leaders and technocrats, as they seem disconnected with people's everyday life, no matter the country. The citizens have lost confidence... Having a president (Jean-Claude Juncker) within a fiscal scandal is not very glorious for Europe. The numerous lobbies at Brussels are also a pain. Furthermore, taking the Cyprus citizens' money in 2013 abruptly, without any vote or consultation, is simply called... robbery. In Swiss, this would have required a democratic vote for such decision to be taken. Europe was initially a great human project, synonym of hope, freedom, collaboration and peace. It's a pity it has been done poorly, without consulting the citizens or having a genuine vision... ------------- https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLqf2srRfppHAslEmHBn8QP6d_eoanh0eW" rel="nofollow - My compositions |
Posted By: npjnpj
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 13:52
|
I'm quite amused by the result. You may not like your life support machine, but it's a bit foolish to switch it off. |
Posted By: npjnpj
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 15:43
|
Come to think of it, 2016 has generally been the worst year for world affairs in general that I can remember, and it's only June. Now all that's needed is Donald Trump as president of the USA, and, judging by how things have been going, he can't fail. |
Posted By: BaldFriede
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 15:44
|
The Brexit may take place again on a smaller scale in the UK. Maybe there will be a Scexit and a Nexit for the UK. Then the United Kingdom will turn into Dissected Kingdom. ------------- BaldJean and I; I am the one in blue. |
Posted By: A Person
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 16:07
|
I blame this ad campaign for Remain losing the referendum: |
Posted By: Atavachron
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 16:31
|
Poor Winston must be rolling over. ------------- "Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought." -- John F. Kennedy |
Posted By: Atavachron
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 16:40
Heck yeah-- Yorkshire pudding, Stilton, fish&chips, Shepard's Pie, Cotswold just to start; British fare is among the most tasty and evolved. As much as I love Italian, Brit cuisine is far more developed. ------------- "Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought." -- John F. Kennedy |
Posted By: Nogbad_The_Bad
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 16:43
The young did vote to Remain, it was the wrinklies who voted enmasse to exit ------------- Ian Host of the Post-Avant Jazzcore Happy Hour on Progrock.com https://podcasts.progrock.com/post-avant-jazzcore-happy-hour/ |
Posted By: Modrigue
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 16:46
I'm really surprised by this vote repartition, how can it be explained? I may be wrong, but I think that, in most of the other European countries, the vote repartition would have been the opposite... ------------- https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLqf2srRfppHAslEmHBn8QP6d_eoanh0eW" rel="nofollow - My compositions |
Posted By: A Person
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 16:52
True, but it might've inspired the old people to vote leave. |
Posted By: Nogbad_The_Bad
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 16:53
|
The old guys are the little englanders remembering when Britain was great. The youth have limited job opportunities and are looking for work across Europe. ------------- Ian Host of the Post-Avant Jazzcore Happy Hour on Progrock.com https://podcasts.progrock.com/post-avant-jazzcore-happy-hour/ |
Posted By: Tillerman88
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 17:31
So, 'to each his own' is just all I can get from your pretty jingoistic thoughts, IMO. Alas, it seems to stand for the majority of your people... If I'm wrong, tell me then who to blame for this Europe's fate (not yours too??) if not who decided for this damn 'voted' referendum?? 'Cause those who lost proved to be too dumb to face the ones who ran a much more dynamic, interesting and clever 'campaign' throughout the whole UK regions.........simple as that . |
Posted By: The Dark Elf
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 17:57
It's funny, Dean, I had thought to post comparative photographs of these two demagogic twits, but I was too lazy. I thank you for contributing further to my slothfulness. ------------- ...a vigorous circular motion hitherto unknown to the people of this area, but destined to take the place of the mud shark in your mythology... |
Posted By: The Dark Elf
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 18:05
Here's one contemplating the Brexit vote:  And here are several celebrating after the vote:  ------------- ...a vigorous circular motion hitherto unknown to the people of this area, but destined to take the place of the mud shark in your mythology... |
Posted By: Padraic
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 20:03
Trump looks like a Boris but acts like a Farage. Lucky us!
 |
Posted By: Epignosis
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 20:11
|
Lindsay Lohan apparently has an opinion on this matter.
------------- https://epignosis.bandcamp.com/album/a-month-of-sundays" rel="nofollow - https://epignosis.bandcamp.com/album/a-month-of-sundays |
Posted By: The Dark Elf
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 20:16
"Like, the Brits should leave Britain. I, like, never cared for their drug policies, ya know? It's like when George Washington beat the Redheads at that Gettysburg address. They, like, went to Canadia after that. Which was cool for us."
------------- ...a vigorous circular motion hitherto unknown to the people of this area, but destined to take the place of the mud shark in your mythology... |
Posted By: infocat
Date Posted: June 24 2016 at 22:50
------------- -- Frank Swarbrick Belief is not Truth. |
Posted By: Dean
Date Posted: June 25 2016 at 00:05
|
The word you're reaching for is "Untied". Another good word is "Fuxit"
------------- What? |
Posted By: Dean
Date Posted: June 25 2016 at 00:34
Laughing probably. [Churchill was the right person to be in charge during wartime but not the right person to have in charge in peacetime.]  ------------- What? |
Posted By: Atavachron
Date Posted: June 25 2016 at 00:42
|
Interesting, but how does that square with his vision of a United States of Europe? Maybe just a pipedream... ------------- "Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought." -- John F. Kennedy |
Posted By: Dean
Date Posted: June 25 2016 at 01:55
Churchill appeared to contradict himself quite often, but that is because he was smarter than most politicians then and now. In is Zurich speech he called for a "kind of" United States of Europe and even said that "The structure of the United States of Europe, if well and truly built, will be such as to make the material strength of a single state less important. Small nations will count as much as large ones and gain their honour by their contribution to the common cause." ... which kind of sounds like the current EU. However, he wasn't talking about a system of governance (or at least a system with a central governing body). He envisioned the USofE as a union of European nations in the same general form as the United Nations (he even obliquely refers to that in his speech by way of the Atlantic Charter), with no central governing body and not like a national Union (as in India), a Federation (as in USA) or a Unity (as in the UK). [In that regard the EU is at present a Confederation]. /edit: Note that in the quote from 1953 he said "if we must choose" - (that is, given an either-or choice), in the Zurich speech he advocated having all options (United Europe, United Nations and British Commonwealth of Nations).
------------- What? |
Posted By: lazland
Date Posted: June 25 2016 at 02:29
Sigh..... I have not made any jingoistic statements on this, or any other, thread. Further, you are, of course, right. It is absolutely and utterly shocking when you give those ignorant, lay, unwashed, masses a say in running the country. Ignorant buggers, the lot of them, eh? Thus, the liberal mentality.  ------------- Enhance your life. Get down to www.lazland.org Now also broadcasting on www.progzilla.com Every Saturday, 4.00 p.m. UK time! |
Posted By: JJLehto
Date Posted: June 25 2016 at 02:41
|
Perhaps the sobering hangover is now hitting? Just like any other there are regrets had and confusion about what they actually did http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-switch/wp/2016/06/24/the-british-are-frantically-googling-what-the-eu-is-hours-after-voting-to-leave-it/" rel="nofollow - http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-switch/wp/2016/06/24/the-british-are-frantically-googling-what-the-eu-is-hours-after-voting-to-leave-it/ The youth thing, who knows but I imagine (like here or anywhere else) younger folk are generally more international oriented? Also while simplistic perhaps there is some truth the theory that the older you are, the less time you have to live with your decisions?
|
Posted By: Flight123
Date Posted: June 25 2016 at 02:54
|
^I would agree - and last night I argued with my Dad who voted to leave. We have been regaled with 'vox pop' interviews with pensioners carping on about immigration and it makes me sick. Cameron was an idiot for caving in to the strident voices calling for a referendum and gambling his leadership on it. Today, we are a country divided and I hate it and I am ashamed. People have forgotten why the EU is there in the first place. |
Posted By: JJLehto
Date Posted: June 25 2016 at 03:48
|
Interesting read by one of my favorite economists. http://www.pbs.org/newshour/making-sense/column-in-the-wake-of-brexit-will-the-eu-finally-turn-away-from-austerity/" rel="nofollow - http://www.pbs.org/newshour/making-sense/column-in-the-wake-of-brexit-will-the-eu-finally-turn-away-from-austerity/
Reminded me that austerity used to be the hot button issue before it became immigrants, and if the EU is intelligent they will take this a sign to ditch austerity and instead focus economic growth driven by infrastructure investment, education, green energy and re-embrace Keynesian (he doesn't use the word) economics and allow fluctuating deficits, opposed to strict budget balancing. Disturbingly, it seems Wolfgang Schauble is claiming he will punish the UK for this. A move that I'd imagine may guarantee the death of the EU. I can only assume he's trying to intimidate other EU countries/show the world he will stay tough but Schauble has also proven to be quite inflexible. Germany, as de facto head of the EU, has shown a pretty rigid and dogmatic response to everything honestly..so who knows. I do hope the EU learns from this and proceeds wisely |