The best discography?!
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Category: Progressive Music Lounges
Forum Name: Prog Music Lounge
Forum Description: General progressive music discussions
URL: http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=106873
Printed Date: February 05 2025 at 19:08
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Topic: The best discography?!
Posted By: Hemis
Subject: The best discography?!
Date Posted: May 31 2016 at 17:25
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I have been thinking about doing a poll in which I present you with two ficticious bands and something else occoured to me. Imagine you have two bands, A and B, both with 8 albums in their discographies. And imagine that the rating I'll give them are truly fit for the quality of the albums. Band A: 1st album - 4.56 2nd album - 4.11 3rd album - 4.46 4th album - 3.99 5th album - 3.12 6th album - 3.25 7th album - 2.76 8th album - 2.75 Band B: 1st album - 3.30 2nd album - 3.49 3rd album - 3.75 4th album - 3.46 5th album - 3.50 6th album - 3.45 7th album - 4.01 8th album - 4.04 Both bands have the same average rating, 3.625. However, it's clear that Band A started off better, with 4 great albums (4+), but then they started declining and eventually their carreer ended with two shameful records (2.76 & 2.75). The Band B started with a normal album (3.30) and after that they have been slowly improving, even achieving 2 great albums (4+). Having all this in consideration who has the best discography?!
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Replies:
Posted By: Atavachron
Date Posted: May 31 2016 at 18:01
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In this case averages are irrelevant-- Band A has two albums you rate under 3, but all of band B's albums are 3.30 or higher. Further, band A started spectacularly and has been declining ever since, leaving a lot of disappointment, whereas Band B is on a seemingly perpetual upswing. Band B has the best discography. ------------- "Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought." -- John F. Kennedy |
Posted By: Magnum Vaeltaja
Date Posted: May 31 2016 at 18:08
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Band A has the better discography. Their first 3 albums are veritable masterpieces, true desert island discs. If I had the choice of owning the complete discography of both bands, I'd pick A just for those first 3 or 4 albums. Who cares if they had one or two duds? When I consider two bands I'll usually compare peak to peak. It looks like B has just released 8 lukewarm or good albums, so there's not really much of a peak to look at. I suppose that this is a bit like comparing bands a band like Yes to some obscure symphonic prog band that had a string of 5 decent albums. Sure, Yes may have released some really weak material, but I'd still consider their discography to be superior on the merits of Fragile, Close To The Edge, etc.
------------- when i was a kid a doller was worth ten dollers - now a doller couldnt even buy you fifty cents |
Posted By: Hemis
Date Posted: May 31 2016 at 18:14
| Both points of view are good. If one is to follow the course A does from the beginning, he would, as the albums are released, become very disappointed. But, The truth is that no album from B would ever appear on top 100 PA albums. One can not say that about A |
Posted By: Atavachron
Date Posted: May 31 2016 at 18:34
No because at the end of the day Band B did not have '8 lukewarm or good albums', they had the higher volume per release of quality material. ------------- "Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought." -- John F. Kennedy |
Magnum Vaeltaja wrote:Posted By: Atavachron
Date Posted: May 31 2016 at 18:36
Whether a band appears in the PA Top 100 is useless because, 1) the list changes & is in flux, and 2) is wrong. ------------- "Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought." -- John F. Kennedy |
Posted By: Nogbad_The_Bad
Date Posted: May 31 2016 at 19:32
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I'd go with band A and focus my listening on the first 4 albums. I have several bands like that in my collection and typically go with A. ------------- Ian Host of the Post-Avant Jazzcore Happy Hour on Progrock.com https://podcasts.progrock.com/post-avant-jazzcore-happy-hour/ |
Posted By: Atavachron
Date Posted: May 31 2016 at 19:38
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The question is "who has the best discography". ------------- "Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought." -- John F. Kennedy |
Posted By: Star_Song_Age_Less
Date Posted: May 31 2016 at 19:52
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Atavachron had me convinced, then Magnum convinced me otherwise, then Atavachron re-convinced me again. Am I incapable of independent thought?!?! I guess on reflection I have to go with "neither band has the better discography." Both are equally good, one just more consistent than the other. When I think about two bands I looove love love that fit that type of scenario (Yes - case A, Type O Negative - case B) I would in fact lean toward saying they are equal (even though I think Yes' best is much better than Type's best). Yes, I know, Type's not prog. Just seemed to fit the profile for me. ------------- https://www.facebook.com/JamieKernMusic |
Posted By: Hemis
Date Posted: May 31 2016 at 19:56
| The Top 100 PA albums is important for some. Having an album there is a great accomplishment, considering there are over 50k albums rated in the site.. It's like the albums everyone here should at least try to listen. I guess, one has to think 'If I had a band, what would be the best course for our albums?'. I honestly can't choose properly. Both answers are good. I guess, maybe, A would be more famous, but B would be a better choice. At least they are getting somewhere. A are just losing themselves due to what appears to be their early success. |
Posted By: LakeGlade12
Date Posted: June 01 2016 at 04:12
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Band A easily for me. They released 3 very highly rated albums which meant they had something truly unique going on along with a high general musical quality. However some artists are one trick pony's and are only good at playing to their unique strengths. Once that well of inspiration runs dry they either run out of ideas completely or they try to go into another genre and fail miserably. Band B however spent almost their entire career in mediocrity releasing albums that in 100 years will be forgotten about completely. Yes they got better in the end but never to the level of being truly significant. Its much better to have a short lived but golden period as those few albums will remain classics for generations to come. Band B however will quickly fall in obscurity and only have the odd cult follower.
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Posted By: Hemis
Date Posted: June 01 2016 at 05:25
| I think LakeGlade12 may have a strong point. Recently (about a year or so) I listened to 'Ok Computer' By Radiohead, mainly due to the comparisons to Dark side. The thing is: after that I've only listened to The Bends and A moon shaped pool. I intend on discover their other albums but just for those 2 (ok and bends) they earned a very special place in my music taste. Oh I heard half of Kid A, it's a 2-3 for me :) so I assume they went downhill! |
Posted By: progaardvark
Date Posted: June 01 2016 at 07:45
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One could consider taking the median instead of the mean since the distribution doesn't appear to be bell-shaped, in which case Band A has the higher median. Another possibility of determining who was better is rating the individual songs. One could either take a median of those values or which band has the most songs over a certain rating. That's probably a bit time consuming, but it might afford a bit more granularity. This can get really complicated, if you want it to be. ------------- ---------- i'm shopping for a new oil-cured sinus bag that's a happy bag of lettuce this car smells like cartilage nothing beats a good video about fractions |
Posted By: Lewian
Date Posted: June 01 2016 at 12:22
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Questions like this imply that there has to be an answer but there may be none. Anyway, personally I would go for A because I care more about the best albums than about the worst. But then this may be changed by more information, for example, band B may have the top 5 songs out of these, even hidden on 3.something albums... |
Posted By: Lewian
Date Posted: June 01 2016 at 12:27
I'd say that whether the distribution is bell-shaped or not doesn't matter at all; what matters is whether one personally values consistency and an upward trend rather than producing a number of top albums and the waning. The median seems to be quite inappropriate here because it doesn't depend on how good the best albums exactly are (and neither on the worst), it just depends on what goes on in the core of mediocrity. |
Posted By: Man With Hat
Date Posted: June 01 2016 at 12:31
I agree with this. ------------- Dig me...But don't...Bury me I'm running still, I shall until, one day, I hope that I'll arrive Warning: Listening to jazz excessively can cause a laxative effect. |
Posted By: twalsh
Date Posted: June 01 2016 at 12:59
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I'm sorry, but this is silly. Some questions have absolutely no meaning in the abstract. What do PA ratings have to do with my personal taste? They are a useful guide to be sure, but my personal tastes may differ. Are there not people who enjoy Love Beach? If I did not know either band, I would be inclined to look at those peak recordings from Band A first. I don't need to appreciate an entire discography to admire an outstanding album, even if it was the only one of quality they released. ------------- More heavy prog, please! |
Posted By: Rednight
Date Posted: June 01 2016 at 14:04
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Someone shoot me. ------------- "It just has none of the qualities of your work that I find interesting. Abandon [?] it." - Eno |
Posted By: gerunding
Date Posted: June 04 2016 at 18:11
| Kanye been killin' it for years. |
Posted By: gerunding
Date Posted: June 04 2016 at 18:14
| Up to, and including G.O.O.D. Music productions, along with TIDAL thangZ, it's more or less an extension of the artist, tantamount to how the more prominent The Mars Volta musicians branched out to make a cohesive library. |
Posted By: gerunding
Date Posted: June 04 2016 at 18:15
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Posted By: TheLionOfPrague
Date Posted: June 04 2016 at 18:20
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Band A. EASILY. They have THREE albums that are better than anything Band A did, and in the end we judge bands by their great material, not their worst. People will remember Jethro Tull because of Thick as a Brick, not Under Wraps, ELP because of Brain Salad, not Love Beach, Genesis because Selling England, not Calling all Stations, etc. The best output of a band is what matters to me, not their worst. If a band makes 3 masterpieces they can make 10 awful albums for all I care, and I'd take them over a band that makes 13 OK albums. ------------- I shook my head and smiled a whisper knowing all about the place |
Posted By: Finnforest
Date Posted: June 04 2016 at 18:26
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Band A for me. I've made no mystery of the fact that I love debuts and bands in their youth. The early years when bands are "brothers", when they are hungry, those years have a spark and spice to the creativity that no amount of later "mature refinement" is going to best, at least not in the world of rock and roll. ------------- ...that moment you realize you like "Mob Rules" better than "Heaven and Hell" |
Posted By: BaldFriede
Date Posted: June 04 2016 at 21:35
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This question actually leads to a kind of meta-rating. You have to keep in mind that these ratings are given by the average member of the archives. After all these average ratings for band B could mean the band is highly controversial - there are either those who hate the band or those who love it, with the corresponding ratings. On the other hand band A might have done some rather mainstream albums ("keep in mind that "mainstream" here means "mainstream in prog") which are loved by many for exactly this "mainstreaminess", if I may invent this word. -------------  BaldJean and I; I am the one in blue. |
Posted By: Mellotron Storm
Date Posted: June 11 2016 at 18:07
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Band A for me because I would buy four of them while I might buy three from band B but probably two. I'm not a completist by any means so I'm only concerned with albums I might enjoy. ------------- "The wind is slowly tearing her apart" "Sad Rain" ANEKDOTEN |
Posted By: BrufordFreak
Date Posted: June 11 2016 at 21:52
This^ ------------- Drew Fisher https://progisaliveandwell.blogspot.com/ |
Posted By: BrufordFreak
Date Posted: June 11 2016 at 22:03
Great attitude that I often find true and look for--especially with regards to debut albums as these are often compilations of a few years of very creative, energetic, optimistic music that has been polished by that hard-working enthusiasm of unproven youth (The Doors, Spirit, Chicago Transit Authority, Elton John, Nina Hagen Band, U2, Art in America, Babylon, Icehouse, Tears for Fears, Sade, Everything But the Girl, Swing Out Sister, Iona, Pearl Jam, Alanis Morissette, The Mars Volta, Moth Vellum, iamthemorning, Homunculus Res, etc., etc.,) . . . but not always . . . not ususally. ------------- Drew Fisher https://progisaliveandwell.blogspot.com/ |
Posted By: The Dark Elf
Date Posted: June 11 2016 at 22:07
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I think the simplest answer is, which band do you prefer? There are any number of bands that receive high ratings which I find mystifying. ------------- ...a vigorous circular motion hitherto unknown to the people of this area, but destined to take the place of the mud shark in your mythology... |
Posted By: Finnforest
Date Posted: June 11 2016 at 22:29
Yep, it is often true about debuts and earlies but as you say, not always....there are some where mid period is my fave. Billy Joel would be one where I would pick mid period. Turnstiles through 52nd Street is his best run in my opinion. Special mention to Songs in the Attic that pulls the best live versions of his early material. That's a GREAT live album. ------------- ...that moment you realize you like "Mob Rules" better than "Heaven and Hell" |
Posted By: Sean Trane
Date Posted: June 12 2016 at 02:54
I'd say that 90% of the bands or artistes in the "rock realm" I listen to are that way - beit 70's or 90/00's... Most of the bands are at their most inventive early in their career, because they've got things to say... and after they've run out of r-original ideas, they go: "OK, what do we do now??" ... and it goes usually crap!!! And if there would some case B likely to please me, I'd probably not know of the band, since I generally set them aside once & for all, once I assessed them early on. It's quite different for jazz though, but it won't resemble case B either. |
Posted By: Manuelmoreno
Date Posted: June 21 2016 at 10:42
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Slightly OT: What would be two real bands who fits this question? Anyone dares to put a name to A and B?
I feel that the band "B" scenario is very rare, while we can find many bands like "A". |
Posted By: Finnforest
Date Posted: June 21 2016 at 11:04
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PT might be a Band B for me personally, I prefer their 2000s albums to their 90s ones and generally think they got better over time. ------------- ...that moment you realize you like "Mob Rules" better than "Heaven and Hell" |