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FunkyM View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 09 2011 at 16:50
I'm not sure how to answer this either. I believe everyone is entitled to their opinion, but IMO Genesis is one of the greatest bands of all time in both composition and playing, so I have to say no.

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 09 2011 at 21:13
We have been visited by the snowman. Big smile


Edited by Slartibartfast - January 09 2011 at 21:13
Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 10 2011 at 11:18
I'm courious to know what kind of prog are you into?
I look up, I'm almost blinded

by the warmth of what's inside me

and the taste that's in my soul,

but I'm dead inside as I stand alone...
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 10 2011 at 18:57
Sarge, there is a saying in Mexico that says: "En gustos se rompen generos" which may be translated as "Taste breaks genres"... I love Genesis, so I'm biased and I won't defend them. Enough said by others (plus hundreds of magazines, books, interviews, critiques, etc). Also, if I don't like something I don't immediately label it as "overrated"... I just don't get it and that's all... I love Opeth but I don't get easily into other Extreme Metal bands, I don't get Gentle Giant or Peter Hammill, even though I love VdGG...
 
My question to you, and I think we deserve to hear the answer, is: What do you like? What bands do you consider to be Underrated?
 
 
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axeman View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 10 2011 at 21:45
Originally posted by sarge sarge wrote:

Is there something I'm missing?

I'm guessing so.

You're entitled to your own opinion, but when you gripe about what other people spend their time posting about, you're really not just "expressing your own opinion". It's pretty easy to see that this the one-in-every-forum version of "I hate that people don't talk about what I want to talk about" so you're ragging on a band that you think people talk to much about.

I'm guessing a lot of people don't share the following opinion:
Originally posted by sarge sarge wrote:

I think I can safely say that a band that can't keep an 8 minute song interesting should never venture out to the territory of the 20+ minute epic


If it's just your opinion, why couldn't you "safely say it"? As far as I know nobody has threatened to find where you live and take a contract out on you. Also, that sentence is probably true, but  how many people think that applies to Genesis? Regardless of whether or they particularly like SR, that applies to songs like Fountain of Salmacis.

If you don't want to listen to their 8 minutes songs, of course you might not bother listening to their 20-minute songs. But why should they have "never venture[d]" to the delight of many other proggers?

Sure you can anticipate the usual "that's your opinion" posts. A lot of people confuse "opinion" for boorishness.

Genesis is my favorite, it doesn't have to be yours--you don't even have to like them. When I first came to this site, I never thought Genesis was the greatest prog band, just my favorite. I thought King Crimson was, except for repeating their first album with their second, the real deal. I was more impressed with the musical arrangements of Yes more often. I thought there was a real good case for Yes as the best prog band. But reading the stuff on this site, I found a lot of people also put a value on the accessibility of Genesis and mostly un-matched lyrical ability--and the controlled creation of a consistent and audible atmosphere that a focus on manipulating musical theory doesn't necessarily tap into in the same way. So musical technique is one part and tapping into archetypes is another. While Tales of Topographic Oceans impresses me some with ingenuity, it doesn't invoke Giants and Rites or Dawn or any of the other Iconography suggested.


-John
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 11 2011 at 04:05
Originally posted by sarge sarge wrote:

Genesis facilitated the rise of disco. 

 
Ah well, gotta go - supper's ready, shame it's always ordinary.

ABSURD.

You're quite out of tune. The silliest things I chanced to read...
Please don't forget that Genesis INVENTED prog.


Edited by pied piper - January 11 2011 at 04:07
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 11 2011 at 05:14
Trespass, Foxtrot and Selling England by the Pound (particularly the latter for me) are 3 of the best prog. rock albums ever composed/released/performed. ... So I've gotta join with about everyone on this one: no, Gabriel-era Genesis is not overrated IMHO, in any way shape or form!
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 11 2011 at 08:04
Originally posted by pied piper pied piper wrote:

 
Please don't forget that Genesis INVENTED prog.

LOL


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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 11 2011 at 10:36
SmileHaving grown up with Genesis I remember being as proud as punch when buying my brand new copy of their
newly released Selling England by The Pound. Today, some thirty seven years later I still enjoy its wonderful moments like Firth Of Fifth. Be it the piano introduction or the amazing guitar finale that always made my hair stand on end. Maybe you need to turn up the volume a bit.
The Cinema Show is another classic especially when Phil Collins erupts into that offbeat jam sequence towards the end. I have seen all of the so called top drummers and have seen Collins with both Genesis and Brand X.
He was (has had to retire due to back problems) one of the very best.
Still, I donīt care much for a lot of King Crimson. I have always found them totally overrated. But that is a different forum. If we are honest we need to be listening to what we like best.
  
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 11 2011 at 11:00
I also happen to think Genesis is bit overrated. The recording quality of almost all their albums is below average, the drums of Collins often sound amateurish on many albums and the cheesiness/romantic vibe of any album after Foxtrot can be annoying.

Still they are one of the better progressive rock bands and above all important pioneers. I must admit I think they made some very qualitative masterpieces (albeit with their flaws).
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 11 2011 at 12:09
I can see where you are coming from Friso; I felt sometimes production wise things were a bit iffy but I can't really complain, the music is the focus. If I could only choose one Genesis album to listen to, "Selling England By The Pound" is without a doubt my top choice.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 11 2011 at 13:44
Your comments are nonsense.  Other than YES from 1971 to 1979, Genesis from 1970-1980 is the best ever.  You sound like someone who never saw them in concert.  Either way, Suppers Ready  is revolutionary,  One of the greatest epics ever!  Have you ever listened to The Fountain of Salmacis or The Musical box from Nursery Cryme?Los Endos or Dance on a Volcano from A trick of the tail. Some of the best drumming ever is on that album.  The Album that you say is no good, Selling England by the pound, was voted #1 progressive album ever.  In fact Genesis has 3 or 4 albums in the top 10,  and that includes Foxtrot.  They say the reason Foxtrot is in the top 10,  2 words.  SUPPER'S READY. Have you watched any concert footage from the 1970's on youtube. 1977 has maybe the greatest lightshow and music ever.  In 1977 I saw them in concert with some people that didn't want to go. 34 years later they are still thanking me.  The comments were, other than YES, these guys are the best ever! Everyone is a backup band compared to these guys. Tony banks is as good as rick Wakeman. 
Go to youtube and listen to Phish's Trey Anastasio's speech from the induction of Genesis to the Rock and Roll hall of fame.  As he says "there are so many people that i'm speaking for tonight that know exactly what i'm talking about." 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 11 2011 at 14:00
bottom line...opinion is opinion.....however...fact is fact..fact is the more you post your opinion the more factual becomes your utter patheticness(not a word....case closed
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 11 2011 at 16:22
I am the only Genesis fan I know or indeed have ever known in real life.
I'd say they are underrated if anything.
If it wasn't for the internet I'd assume not one human being on earth liked them
Let the maps of war be drawn !

http://kingcrimsonprog.wordpress.com/
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 11 2011 at 16:45

You're saying Supper's Ready  is no biggy. That's like saying Muhamed Ali isn't a legend.  As classic Magazine says, with Supper's Ready Genesis unleashed a genuinely brilliant musical beast whose effects on the prog genre would be felt for decades. Where the Omen meets the hall.  Electrifying guitar coda, jazzy time signatures, beautiful melodies, and classical disipline.  Magic on a disc. Anyway,  The question was. Is Genesis overated? They are 1,000,000% underrated.  And here is why. MAD MAN MOON, CAN UTILITY AND THE COASTLINERS, THE FOUNTAIN OF SALMACIS, MAN OF OUR TIMES, THE MUSICAL BOX, SQUONK, STAGNATION, SUPPER'S READY, DOWN AND OUT,  RIPPLES, SNOWBOUND, FIRTH OF FIFTH, THE KNIFE, THE RETURN OF THE GIANT HOGWEED, VISIONS OF ANGELS, RIDING THE SCREE, DUKE'S TRAVELS/ DUKE'S END, UNDERTOW, LOS ENDOS, THE LAMB LIES DOWN ON BROADWAY, THE CINEMA SHOW, ONE FOR THE VINE, LIKE IT OR NOT, CUL-DE-SAC, THE LADY LIES, DANCE ON A VOLCANO, LOOKING FOR SOMEONE, WATCHER OF THE SKIES, DANCING WITH THE MOONLIT KNIGHT, CASE CLOSEDDDDDDDDDDDDDD

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 11 2011 at 16:48

You're saying Supper's Ready  is no biggy. That's like saying Muhamed Ali isn't a legend.  As Classic Rock Magazine says, with Supper's Ready Genesis unleashed a genuinely brilliant musical beast whose effects on the prog genre would be felt for decades. Where the Omen meets the hall.  Electrifying guitar coda, jazzy time signatures, beautiful melodies, and classical disipline.  Magic on a disc. Anyway,  The question was. Is Genesis overated? They are 1,000,000% underrated.  And here is why. MAD MAN MOON, CAN UTILITY AND THE COASTLINERS, THE FOUNTAIN OF SALMACIS, MAN OF OUR TIMES, THE MUSICAL BOX, SQUONK, STAGNATION, SUPPER'S READY, DOWN AND OUT,  RIPPLES, SNOWBOUND, FIRTH OF FIFTH, THE KNIFE, THE RETURN OF THE GIANT HOGWEED, VISIONS OF ANGELS, RIDING THE SCREE, DUKE'S TRAVELS/ DUKE'S END, UNDERTOW, LOS ENDOS, THE LAMB LIES DOWN ON BROADWAY, THE CINEMA SHOW, ONE FOR THE VINE, LIKE IT OR NOT, CUL-DE-SAC, THE LADY LIES, DANCE ON A VOLCANO, LOOKING FOR SOMEONE, WATCHER OF THE SKIES, DANCING WITH THE MOONLIT KNIGHT, CASE CLOSEDDDDDDDDDDDDDD

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 11 2011 at 16:55
I'd say maybe you need to be in the right place at the right time for Genesis.  I worked at a CD store and one day a customer brought in Foxtrot, Selling England, and Lamb, and I bought all three for under ten bucks.  However, I didn't like them until quite a bit later.  Foxtrot was the first one to break through.  And honestly, I'm not wild about 1/3 or so of Selling England and am wild about maybe even less than that of Lamb.  But Foxtrot (and now, Nursery Cryme) excite me to know end.  And honestly, in the case of Foxtrot in particular, drugs helped.  Sorry if that sounds blunt, but being high and hearing that soaring "Yooooooooooooou.... can't you see he's fooled you all?" in "Supper's Ready" was enough to bring me literally to my knees.  I don't have a hard time understanding why a person might not like Genesis, but I don't think you've got any right to dismiss them until you've given them a chance.  Have you listened to "A Trick of the Tail"?  Maybe "Los Endos" will convert you (that's one of my favorites of theirs, along with that album's title track).  The appeal, for me at least, lies in Gabriel's - and, to a big extent, Hackett's - ability to engage the listener emotionally, a trait typically overlooked, actively ignored, or, worse, frowned upon in so much prog music.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 11 2011 at 18:57
Genesis is not overrated, they are one of the all time top bands.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 11 2011 at 21:54
I don't really like them either.  I thought it was going to be a situation like Yes was for me.  I'd heard all the poppy Yes and was never a big fan (nor did I think Fragile was all it was cracked up to be), but then I heard Close to the Edge and saw where people were coming from.  (Yes still isn't my favorite, but that is a damn good album certainly).  I'd heard Genesis and not cared about them much and thought that Selling England by the Pound would change my mind.  It really didn't.  I got really bored listening to it and I still don't see the fascination with Genesis.  I don't understand why people blow the musicianship out of the water either, it's good but I feel like it's not crazy in prog standards.  (Musicianship isn't what makes good music I know, but it's so frequently praised for Genesis that I don't get it).  
*General Disclaimer Time*-  Thats how I feel about it, I am not nor am I intending to pass this off as fact or substantial evidence, it is simply an opinion.  


Edited by himtroy - January 11 2011 at 21:58
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 12 2011 at 01:29

Man, I'm really late to the party, but gee, sarge ... your inquiry, as a few people here have already pointed out, really does come off as somewhat confrontational, maybe even a bit condescending -- but clearly provocative.  Of course, the big question (and a few have asked):  what DO you like??   You've indicated you're a big Beatles fan ("underrated"), so, what is it about the Beatles that you like?

Shedding a little light on what you actually like (and WHY, if you know) would be a no-brainer, if you're really looking for why you DON'T like Genesis (although, as other's here have said;  if you don't like 'em, don't listen to 'em).
 
As for Collin's drumming:  I LOVE his HH work, and his drumming style in general.  He handles different time signatures brilliantly (especially 11/8, 7/8 in "Nuclear Burn" by Brand X), and is also all over the map on the Gabriel-era Genesis.  If you see the Belgium TV videos, he's blowing whistles and handling the backing vocals, as well as cooking on the kit.  Collins was a HUGE fan of Keith Moon, too -- another brilliant drummer (a little sloppy, but brilliant just as well).
 
Of course, that's just me.  What is it you're looking for in a drummer, or Prog in general?
 
Peace.
Gary
"... people will always be tempted to wipe their feet on anything with WELCOME written on it"
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