A health care question... - Progressive Rock Music Forum

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The T

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Posted: March 21 2010 at 21:50

^No country has free health care. No one is asking for that.

jammun

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Posted: March 21 2010 at 22:05

I don't think anyone is suggesting it will be free. As someone mentioned above, if we paid the Fire Department on a per use basis, well the unfortunate few would be bankrupt, and the rest of us would have a few extra dollars in our pockets. So as to avoid that scenario, we all pay local taxes that fund the Fire Departments, who are then there when we need them. It's insurance, actually...spread the risk over thousands of property owners. We're all not wealthy enough to live in gated communities that can afford their own police/fire protection. Nationalized health insurance would ideally provide the same thing...the normalizing of risk.

But of course, all of us here live in politically correct America. This one is fat, it's his own fault he's sick. This one smokes. It's her fault she's ill. This one drinks too much. It's his fault. This one's an idiot and got up on his roof to try to clean out his gutters, and now he's got two broken legs...maybe he's that one who drank too much. Why should we pay for them? Because they are us?

I don't know. I think we're all going to jail, because we can't afford health insurance. At which point we'll have free (taxpayer funded) health care. Up until that point where we're all in jail, at which point I don't know who's going to be paying the taxes.

As Hunter S. used to say, "How long Lord, how long?"

Can you tell me where we're headin'?
Lincoln County Road or Armageddon.

ExittheLemming View Drop Down

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Posted: March 21 2010 at 22:20

Raff wrote:

I am always very wary of using the word 'genes' as regards cultural behaviour, since something similar could be said about Italians (and I've heard some people say it in the past) - that is, that we have dishonesty in our genes. Now, if somebody said something like that to my face, I'd probably rip their own face to shreds. I am a very honest person, and so was all my family - my dad was the most honest person I've ever known - though I was born and bred in Italy from Italian parents. I believe cultural conditioning can be extremely strong, but to talk about genes is potentially very dangerous.

Notwithstanding the face macrame that Raff threatens to perform on a miscreant Confused

, such caution re 'genetically driven behaviour' is well founded. I guess if culture can be defined as say 'shared indigenous practices and beliefs' then she is correct. Many people I meet are strangely disappointed upon learning that I'm Scottish when I don't immediately start fighting, swearing, drinking and blaming the English for everything that is even remotely disagreeable in the universe.

Interestingly (or not, no-ones forcing you to read this Wink

) Stereotype was a printer's term for a duplicate impression of an original used for printing to preserve the longevity of the latter. Similarly, the word cliché was another printer's term and is synonymous with Stereotype.

Time for my nap.

thellama73 View Drop Down

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Posted: March 21 2010 at 22:26

ExittheLemming wrote:

Many people I meet are strangely disappointed upon learning that I'm Scottish when I don't immediately start fighting, swearing, drinking and blaming the English for everything that is even remotely disagreeable in the universe.

But you do wear a kilt and eat lots of haggis, right? Shocked

ExittheLemming View Drop Down

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Posted: March 21 2010 at 22:31

thellama73 wrote:

But you do wear a kilt and eat lots of haggis, right? Shocked

Almost, I eat the kilt and wear the haggis.

Negoba

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Joined: July 24 2008
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Posted: March 21 2010 at 22:51

thellama73 wrote:

Epignosis wrote:

A basic localized health care system is, I guess, a moderate view. I swing hard right on most things, but I in earnest think our health care is too expensive, but it's not because of greedy doctors or evil corporations (that's one popular reductive fallacy). We need a combination of tort reform (first), so that doctors can lower their fees (and afford to be competitive rather than hamstrung because of malpractice insurance), and then I think we could explore letting local governments manage a health care system that would benefit whomever needed basic care (instead of being told, "Your child just has a ______; it will go away in a few days on its own. That will be $200").

That's why I think we should expand access to nurse practitioners. They charge a whole lot less and perfectly competent, especially for little things. Let the doctors worry about brain surgery and broken bones. Nurses can handle everyday illnesses for much less money. Unfortunately, there's a bit of a stigma against them. "I'm not taking my child to a nurse! I demand a real doctor!."

Oh my lord!!! Two people I'm usually opposed to making complete logical sense!

You are quite a fine person, and I am very fond of you. But you are only quite a little fellow, in a wide world, after all.

Negoba

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Posted: March 21 2010 at 22:54

This is my current facebook status...my opinion on this momentus night.

Jay Brieler is very sad that so much politics was involved in such a simple human problem. But I see tonight as our leadership at least accepting that the problem is real and needs to be addressed. Hopefully, there will be many revisions to come. But the monstrosity that was American health care economics got a big kick in the arse tonight.

You are quite a fine person, and I am very fond of you. But you are only quite a little fellow, in a wide world, after all.

Man With Hat View Drop Down

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Posted: March 21 2010 at 23:11

Negoba wrote:

This is my current facebook status...my opinion on this momentus night.

Agreed.

And if facebook was working for me I'd post something similar. But its not, so to PA I go!

A nice first step that will hopefully lead to a further steps in the future.

Dig me...But don't...Bury me
I'm running still, I shall until, one day, I hope that I'll arrive
Warning: Listening to jazz excessively can cause a laxative effect.

ExittheLemming View Drop Down

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Posted: March 21 2010 at 23:39

Negoba wrote:

This is my current facebook status...my opinion on this momentus night.

Mmm...interesting use of the UK (c/f US) vernacular for botty methinks ?

Negoba

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Posted: March 21 2010 at 23:45

It's a world culture now. Bollocks to the naysayers.

You are quite a fine person, and I am very fond of you. But you are only quite a little fellow, in a wide world, after all.

Atavachron View Drop Down

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Posted: March 22 2010 at 00:21

don't forget your sporran, Iain, and if you're a Tull fan it must be at least 21 celsius

stonebeard View Drop Down

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Posted: March 22 2010 at 00:41

Yay new things happening with health care! Do I know what the f**k at all is going to happen? NOPE! I just support this thing with reckless abandon because the Republicans in Congress now are c**ks.

Write to your Congressman if you disagree, you say?

Loser.

I find not giving a sh*t about politics liberating, and it allows me to laugh at people who get caught up in srs bsns that they can only mildly influence every2 or 4 years. Enjoy your useless stress.

Edited by stonebeard - March 22 2010 at 00:42

My soundcloud. Please give feedback if you want!

Henry Plainview View Drop Down

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Posted: March 22 2010 at 00:49

I have to admit that while I follow the news fairly closely, I don't really understand the health bill either. I figure if it turns out to suck I can always complain about it later. ;-)

if you own a sodastream i hate you

Qboyy007

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Posted: March 22 2010 at 00:53

Republican Congress next election. Feels good man.

Atavachron View Drop Down

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Posted: March 22 2010 at 00:55

maybe, or just different Dems

Qboyy007

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Posted: March 22 2010 at 01:29

Atavachron wrote:

maybe, or just different Dems

Doubtful.

Atavachron View Drop Down

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Posted: March 22 2010 at 01:46

Qboyy007 wrote:

Atavachron wrote:

maybe, or just different Dems

Doubtful.

so was everything else about the last year or so

Qboyy007

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Posted: March 22 2010 at 01:54

Atavachron wrote:

Qboyy007 wrote:

Atavachron wrote:

maybe, or just different Dems

Doubtful.

so was everything else about the last year or so

Not really.

Equality 7-2521 View Drop Down

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Posted: March 22 2010 at 05:12

Its funny we people come go around excited about party swings in the government like it will really change anything. Deficits, war, and state power are bipartisan positions.

Further the Republican, even the "conservative", political strategy over the past 50 years has been a failure. Merely stopping the encroachment of liberty devouring policy does nothing but delay the inevitable, for a decade if you're incredibly lucky, before the other party is in favor again.

I'm starting to become disillusioned that any change on the health care issue will come through peaceful means in normal times. One side admits no problem, while the other notices a broken system and adds more of the same poison that sickened in the beginning.

"One had to be a Newton to notice that the moon is falling, when everyone sees that it doesn't fall. "

Finnforest View Drop Down

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Posted: March 22 2010 at 05:42

C'mon Pat, lighten up! Utopia is here dude. Liberty is so yester-century anyway, all that matters is what's in in for me. Just kick back now and watch the magic happen. Clap

...that moment you realize you like "Mob Rules" better than "Heaven and Hell"