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The Whistler
Prog Reviewer
Joined: August 30 2006
Location: LA, CA
Status: Offline
Points: 7113
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Topic: Coldplay, Vida la Vida, Progiest Album of the Year Posted: June 23 2008 at 03:58 |
Let me tell you all a little story. It’s about a man whose car broke down on the highway, so he stopped at a farmer’s house. The farmer tells him he can stay over, but not to go near his daughter...
Wait, no, that’s not right. Aha. This story is about me ‘n my friend. We’re sorta funny in that we both hate each other’s music (aka, “don’t really mind each other’s music, but don’t particularly love it, and occasionally like something and grudgingly admit that it’s ‘okay’”). You know the score.
Anyways, I learned something from her. Namely, that I will always, always, always (most of the time) go for something artsier when it’s offered to me, even when I don’t realize it. Case in point: I “grudgingly admitted” that I liked the band My Chemical Romance. A little research, however, showed that the songs of theirs that I liked all seemed to come off this one album. And it was a rock opera. Oh yeah. You know the one; Queen covers The Wall? It’s pretty sweet.
The other amusing anecdote was Radiohead. Radiohead, Radiohead, Radiohead. Whenever I liked one of “her” songs, it turned out to be...crap, Radiohead. “Talk Show Host.” “Karma Police.” Whatever. When I heard a song that I liked, I stopped asking who it was, and just hung my head low and said, “Yeah...it’s Radiohead, idn’t it?”
Basically, I don’t know if I’m unconsciously trying to keep my snooty reputation, or maybe I actually LIKE this crap (believe it or not), but what the crap does this have to do with the title of the damn thread? Oh yeah, Coldplay, right...what’s a “Coldplay” anyway? Is it like a cold read in radio?
For the past so many years, I have actively disliked and/or ignored Coldplay. Their brand of arena-piano pop has never struck me as all that “good.” So when I heard the single “Violet Hill” off Viva la Vida, I was pleasantly shocked. The lyrics were clever, the sound was grittier, and the video wasn’t bad at all. So I bought the album, and guess what? It’s pretty damn decent! I mean, it ain’t ALL gold or nothin’, but I think it’s a bit deeper and more intelligent than their usual stuff, so I’m sold.
Lo and behold a couple days later, I read in a newspaper article (LA Times, wish I’d kept it) that the album was produced by Brian Eno, who had “tricked Coldplay into thinking they were creating classic art rock.” (sic)
Crap. I did it again, huh?
All Coldplay had to do was get pretentious, and let Brian f**kin’ Eno produce their album, and suddenly I like the damn band.
Now, what does this have to do with anything? Nothing really. It’s just that whenever people (here particularly) think that prog rock is dying, they seem to be missing the point. Prog isn’t a sound; it’s a way of doing things. Or rather, it’s an ideal.
Recently, Death Cab For Cutie (a band I’ve always liked, even BEFORE I knew that they were butt buddies with The Decemberists (they was in thu “Sixteen Milit’ry Wives” VIDEYO!!!)) released the single “I Will Possess Your Heart.” Of course, the damn thing had to be “edited for the radio,” since the album version is, like, nine minutes long. It’s still a fairly standard pop song (by Death Cab standards at least), but when it’s chopped in half, you lose this slow, moody build that’s very nice. Damn radio.
Similarly, Panic! (At the Disco) (dunno if that’s the EXACT band name, but it’s a Ween-esque take, and that’s good enough for me) recently did a Sgt. Pepper rip off (it’s a tradition), and one of the tracks, “Nine in the Afternoon,” got snipped for radio play; which meant that a lovely little orchestral coda was castrated. Poor thing. Uh...don’t ask me how I know that one.
Now, I’m not suggesting that any of these bands are the new Emerson, Lake, or even Palmer, and that they should be admitted to the archives posthaste, oh no...except for Ween, go Ween...but barring THAT, I’m sort of rambling, and sort of trying to prove a point.
And I guess what that point is, is that as long as people in popular music are trying to be musically deep, or lyrically intellectual, or get produced by Brian Eno, or have to be chopped up by coke-stained radio execs, there will always be some form of progression in music. It might not have the pipe organs and flute solos and twelve minute guitar/sax jams of the golden past, but it’s still the same in spirit.
So the rules have changed a little, and the game is “art-pop” instead of “prog-rock” some of the time. So what? It’s still music that seeks to break beyond the two-minute pop standard, or move away from chicks and cars just a bit. In other words, it’s music that CHALLENGES; challenges the artist, and challengers the listener. And that’s all that matters to me...oh yeah, and melody and stuff.
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"There seem to be quite a large percentage of young American boys out there tonight. A long way from home, eh? Well so are we... Gotta stick together." -I. Anderson
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Blacksword
Prog Reviewer
Joined: June 22 2004
Location: England
Status: Offline
Points: 16130
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Posted: June 23 2008 at 05:58 |
Nice blog, sir..
I like the single. It's pretty good. What I've read about the album both here on these forums, and elsewhere also sounds promising. However, for me, a pattern has emerged with Coldplay. I have liked all their singles. I thought 'In my place' 'Clocks' and 'Yellow' were absolute pop classics. When I bought their respective albums, I was just left yawning by the end of it all. As far as all things commercial go, Coldplay aren't bad, but the principle of their musical template remianed basically unchanged for three albums IMO.
I'm sure Eno has helped them do something different with Viva La Vida, and I do find it promising that the critics on BBC Newsnight review disliked the album BECAUSE of the Eno influence (if I ever needed a stamp of approval on music, it would be that those self important kn0bheads on Newsnight hate it!) so I'll probably give it a go. But it''s quite away down on my albums list, behind all the prog stuff that simply must priority, as I'm sure you'll understand.
With regard to 'Art Pop' well, I'm all for it of course, but these artists need to keep their heads screwed on and not lose their sense of 'cool' and accessability. A band like Coldplay can make a decent 'Art pop' album in a few months, but a handful of sadistic clueless music journos could undo all their hardwork with one swift lash of their pomposity pen!
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SilverAnubis
Forum Groupie
Joined: March 27 2007
Location: Spain
Status: Offline
Points: 47
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Posted: June 23 2008 at 06:42 |
Coldplay are good! I think they are "Prog Related" some time ago. On radio never put the other material of the band...
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Priamus
Forum Newbie
Joined: June 15 2008
Location: Germany
Status: Offline
Points: 4
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Posted: June 23 2008 at 09:06 |
I really like the new album. Hell, it gonna be my favourite record this year .
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E-Dub
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: February 24 2006
Location: Elkhorn, WI
Status: Offline
Points: 7910
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Posted: June 23 2008 at 09:19 |
Viva La Vida is the best album of the year, IMO.
E
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moreitsythanyou
Forum Senior Member
VIP Member
Joined: April 23 2006
Location: NYC
Status: Offline
Points: 11682
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Posted: June 23 2008 at 13:18 |
I like the Art Pop idea. Generally a good set of bands making worthwhile music. Except MCR, they're dreadful. A well written entry
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<font color=white>butts, lol[/COLOR]
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King Crimson776
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 12 2007
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 2779
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Posted: June 23 2008 at 16:34 |
Haha, that was pretty good, I love the Radiohead bit. Although I wouldn't say that a band adding orchestral codas and ripping off Sgt. Peppers and getting produced by Brian Eno and "trying to be arty" means that there is still progression going on in music, it just means that bands are trying to put out that image.
Btw, I think Coldplay's old stuff is way catchier, Clocks owns the new stuff.
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chamberry
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: October 24 2005
Location: Puerto Rico
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Points: 9008
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Posted: June 23 2008 at 16:54 |
Great post sir! As a fan of the band I've always found some of their songs to be very "artsy" specially the ones on their debut. Spies is my favorite song from them, they reminded me about those shoegaze, dream pop artists on their debut. But when you look at their first single from that album, Yellow, it sound as if it was cleansed from all the things that made the album good just so it could be fit for the radio. Their second album was bit colder (no pun intended) because of the clearer production and there were even more of those radio friendly songs. But apart from it their sound was still quite epic like the opener and A Rush Of Blood To The Head. Their third album was horrible. Too generic and clean. The music sounded formulaic too. Even their first single for the album had the same chord progression as Clocks! Viva La Vida was a pleasant surprise! Ever since I saw that Eno was going to produce their album I had high expectations for it. The music on it sounds well elaborated and very different from what you would normally hear on the radio or even on their past albums. The songs reminded me of a "lite" or a "diet" version of prog with all the string arrangements, song structure, shifting time sigs and all, but less prominent and poppier. And even then you can hear them going all at it in songs like 42, Death And All His Friends, and Yes. I applaud Coldplay for making such a wonderful and highly enjoyable album while at the same time trying to move pop music one step farther from conventionalism. (not saying good = prog, by the way) Coldplay isn't the only band like this. You mentioned a few of them and I could also add 30 Seconds To Mars to it from my personal experience.
E-Dub wrote:
Viva La Vida is the best album of the year, IMO.
E
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So far it's one of my favorite album of the year for me. A top 3 for sure!
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The Quiet One
Prog Reviewer
Joined: January 16 2008
Location: Argentina
Status: Offline
Points: 15745
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Posted: June 23 2008 at 17:02 |
I like very much X&Y to sleep or also Rush of Blood to the Head(?). Parachuttes leaves me cold with some boring stuff.
Viva la Vida seems very different. The cover, the name of the album, etc.
I've no respect to the band now, since I read an article(interview) with the band that they said that they took ideas from bands and then turned them into their own songs, kinda of rippers.
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Rivertree
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator / Band Submissions
Joined: March 22 2006
Location: Germany
Status: Offline
Points: 17627
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Posted: June 23 2008 at 17:45 |
Yes, I like their first album too - and 'Spies' is my favourite - much proggieness and melancholy Have to check out the new one in any case ...
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ClassicRocker
Forum Senior Member
Joined: March 02 2007
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 894
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Posted: June 23 2008 at 18:02 |
Great blog! You definitely informed me about Panic! and Death Cab (both of which I've always been very opposed to); it's nice to hear that some bands I thought were the 2-3 min pop standard have some lengthier/(at least a little bit) different songs. In the vein of the "challenging art pop" that you characterize as some of today's modern music, do you have any comment on Animal Collective or Flaming Lips (I think my spam count for them is up to the double-digits by now ). Those two bands define "challenging art pop" for me in the last decade (ok, well in the case of the Flaming Lips... not so challenging) and really stand out as something special. I'd consider them more interesting and original than other "modern prog" bands, such as Porcupine Tree, TFK , etc...
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Moatilliatta
Prog Reviewer
Joined: December 01 2005
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 3083
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Posted: June 23 2008 at 18:06 |
I like Coldplay a lot. Parachutes in particular is one of my favorite albums. I was pleasantly surprised by the new album as well.
Way to point out that progressive isn't a sound. That's something I say all of the time. It's true.
About those other bands you named. I like Death Cab a lot, but I didn't get into the new album too much, surpringly. I like that they were trying out some new ideas, but as a whole the album lacks the emotional power of their previous album. It is a transitional album to be sure, and the next one should be great.
Panic, as I see it, is a pretentious Fall Out Boy. But it's empty pretension. They try too hard to make their music sound sophisticated after they write the songs. The songs, when you shed all of the studio fluorishes are mediocre pop songs with lyrics that try too hard to be clever. I'll be darned if some of their melodies aren't catchy, but Fall Out Boy manages to be more catchy, emotional and sophisticated without all of the pomp. They're both pop bands without exception, and their songs reflect that, what with the formulaic structures and simple music, so I can't listen to much of them, but I can enjoy some songs on occasion.
Edited by Moatilliatta - June 23 2008 at 18:14
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www.last.fm/user/ThisCenotaph
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el böthy
Prog Reviewer
Joined: April 27 2005
Location: Argentina
Status: Offline
Points: 6336
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Posted: June 23 2008 at 20:53 |
E-Dub wrote:
Viva La Vida is the best album of the year, IMO.
E
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Ok, what twilight reality is this and what has become of ProgArchives...? ...but I think I will check the album out...
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"You want me to play what, Robert?"
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peskypesky
Forum Senior Member
Joined: September 25 2005
Location: Texas
Status: Offline
Points: 359
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Posted: June 23 2008 at 21:51 |
I totally agree with you. I never cared for Coldplay before. In fact, I kind of actively disliked them. But then I heard a song off "Viva La Vida" and I was like, "Whoa, that is pretty damn good." So I decide to take a chance and get the album, and guess what? The whole album is pretty damn good! I'm finding myself in this weird position now where I'm the one raving about Coldplay and trying to get people to listen to it.
Is Eno really that good of a producer? I mean, I know he's a great producer, but how did he turn Coldplay into this? It's freaking alchemy.
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Man With Hat
Collaborator
Jazz-Rock/Fusion/Canterbury Team
Joined: March 12 2005
Location: Neurotica
Status: Offline
Points: 166178
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Posted: June 23 2008 at 21:58 |
Interesting.
I love coldplays "A Rush Of Blood To The Head". Excellent album almost all the way through. Got their debut was disappointed. Some good, some bad. X&Y was really a let down for me and I really haven't listened to them since.
Maybe, just maybe, if I find it for cheap I'll have a looksie...or a listensie.
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Dig me...But don't...Bury me I'm running still, I shall until, one day, I hope that I'll arrive Warning: Listening to jazz excessively can cause a laxative effect.
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1800iareyay
Prog Reviewer
Joined: November 18 2006
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 2492
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Posted: June 23 2008 at 22:04 |
I have to agree with those calling the album of the year. I've been so disappointed with the prog releases this year. Watershed, Trisector, Ayreon's new album (haven't picked up the new Kayo Dot or Sigur Ros yet) were all letdowns, and yet Coldplay, a band I've erstwhile loathed, put out an album I can not only stomach, but love. This has been a strange year.
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E-Dub
Special Collaborator
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Joined: February 24 2006
Location: Elkhorn, WI
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Posted: June 23 2008 at 22:35 |
el böthy wrote:
E-Dub wrote:
Viva La Vida is the best album of the year, IMO.
E
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Ok, what twilight reality is this and what has become of ProgArchives...?
...but I think I will check the album out...
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Not my thread, so why single out my one and only post? E
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Yorkie X
Forum Senior Member
Joined: July 04 2007
Status: Offline
Points: 1049
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Posted: June 24 2008 at 01:38 |
I thought it was just OK nothing special.
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SilverAnubis
Forum Groupie
Joined: March 27 2007
Location: Spain
Status: Offline
Points: 47
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Posted: June 24 2008 at 04:23 |
Add Coldplay to PA? buffff... If it happens, after having added David Bowie, all people kills everyone xD
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VariousArtist
Forum Newbie
Joined: June 09 2008
Status: Offline
Points: 11
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Posted: June 24 2008 at 13:05 |
The Whistler wrote:
...It’s just that whenever people (here particularly) think that prog rock is dying, they seem to be missing the point. Prog isn’t a sound; it’s a way of doing things. Or rather, it’s an ideal.
...And I guess what that point is, is that as long as people in popular music are trying to be musically deep, or lyrically intellectual, or get produced by Brian Eno, or have to be chopped up by coke-stained radio execs, there will always be some form of progression in music. It might not have the pipe organs and flute solos and twelve minute guitar/sax jams of the golden past, but it’s still the same in spirit.
So the rules have changed a little, and the game is “art-pop” instead of “prog-rock” some of the time. So what? It’s still music that seeks to break beyond the two-minute pop standard, or move away from chicks and cars just a bit. In other words, it’s music that CHALLENGES; challenges the artist, and challengers the listener. And that’s all that matters to me...oh yeah, and melody and stuff. |
Great post! I do believe that I completely get what you are saying...
The old sounds of early Genesis, Pink Floyd, Yes, are forever ingrained in me, but there's a lot of music out there that I like that goes beyond that stuff too. And when I examine these other songs from other genres I, too, find that there is a common theme -- and it's definitely something "progressive", even if not really "progressive rock".
I could name a number of artists that have done songs that I feel have some merit, but that would make many fellow progressive rock fans run for the hills. I would try to say that it's not the artist that I care for, but rather a particular song that is something out of the ordinairy -- and invariably I discover later that there was a different producer or musician or writer involved. Unfortunately many of us can't get past accepting a certain artist and will therefore not listen to anything by them with open ears.
And as much as I love Genesis, i think we'd all agree that they've done the opposite to us on occasion (for me, it's a song like "Anything She Does") where they fell short of using their aptitude for something more interesting and...progressive. So the converse argument applies too. And sometimes I find that even stuff that is characterized as true progressive rock leaves me wanting -- I'm sure others feel the same way too.
My band, Evolve IV, has a real progressive rock heritage and there's no doubt that we like to write and play in that vein, sometimes with longer pieces. Often though we'll have a shorter song but we inevitably and unwittingly will throw quirks in there that make it something more than just your ordinairy short song.
And don't underestimate the power of production in all of this -- just as the original post alluded to, a different producer can totally re-shape the sound in ways that can pull in your progressive rock sensabilities even if the material would not normally be thought of in that genre...
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