Forum Home Forum Home > Progressive Music Lounges > Prog Recommendations/Featured albums
  New Posts New Posts RSS Feed - Liking Marillion, but hating Greta van Fleet
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Events   Register Register  Login Login

Liking Marillion, but hating Greta van Fleet
 Post Reply Post Reply
Author
Message
  Topic Search Topic Search  Topic Options Topic Options
GoldenNoseSlim View Drop Down
Forum Newbie
Forum Newbie


Joined: June 19 2023
Location: Norway, Germany
Status: Offline
Points: 28 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote GoldenNoseSlim Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Liking Marillion, but hating Greta van Fleet
    Posted: September 15 2023 at 00:16
Hi, 

I was thinking about this lately. 

Recently I have FINALLY managed to get into early Marillion. I do love Genesis albums from the Peter Gabriel era. 

The fact that they sound so much like those used to put me off. But this time, my brain was tricked into thinking "Well, turns out that there are more Genesis albums I didn't know about. Happy days!"

Someone on PA recommended Wobbler. Loved it, although they also sound quite a bit like early Genesis.

I feel the same way about, for example, Jesus & Mary Chain records and The Velvet Underground (think "Almost Famous") and even Oasis is alright with me even though they never bothered writing an original tune. :))

But, man, oh, man, do some bands like Greta van Fleet or Wolfmother annoy me. And I've tried giving them a fair shake too.

Having said that Led Zeppelin is my favorite band and a group that has flirted with prog I would say. 

Do I have a bias problem? LOL

And where do you stand on "clone bands"?
Back to Top
Saperlipopette! View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: December 20 2010
Location: Tomorrowland
Status: Offline
Points: 11597 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Saperlipopette! Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 15 2023 at 00:58
I do enjoy some Jesus & Mary Chain. But although inspired by... they don't sound much like Velvet Underground to me. They got their own spin and feel distinctly 1980's in the 1980's and 1990's in the 1990's. I don't really have a problem with "clone bands" if the song material is strong enough. That said I'd much rather a band scome across like they are part of a movement of the past, like Kosmischer Laüfer kind of feel like they made all their music in Berlin/Düsseldorf/Germany ca. 1973-1978 - or Needledrop that remind me of early 1970's Canterbury Scene. They feel like an extention of a familiar approach to making music rather than being a being copy of a specific band (like the Wolfmother or Greta van Fleet I've heard). The only reason I don't care for the lion's share of the bands you mention, is because I don't find what they bring to the table memorable or interesting enough. So I choose the original(s) over the copy 10 out of 10 times.
Back to Top
Cristi View Drop Down
Special Collaborator
Special Collaborator
Avatar
Crossover / Prog Metal Teams

Joined: July 27 2006
Location: wonderland
Status: Offline
Points: 43519 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Cristi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 15 2023 at 02:43
I don't think you have a bias problem. Greta Van Fleet and Wolfmother don't do much for me either LOL
I will say I like the German band Kingdom Come which was ridiculed because they sounded like Led Zeppelin. (And yet a few bands in the 21 century sound like Zeppelin and they've got no ridicule, I don't get it). Kingdom Come's 1991 album Hands of Time is one of my favorite albums. Big smile

Marillion never sounded exactly like Genesis, they had other influences in their music as well. And at some point those Genesis influences went away for good. 

The clone bands type don't bother  me, depends on the song-writing, performance, vocals. For example I've listened to my share of Dream Theater clones, some I disliked, but some I enjoyed. 

The Italian band The Watch was a Genesis clone, or shall I call it pastiche. But they starting doing their own thing at some point. Do check them out. Smile




Edited by Cristi - September 15 2023 at 03:35
Back to Top
Hrychu View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: November 03 2013
Location: poland?
Status: Offline
Points: 5353 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hrychu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 15 2023 at 02:48
I like Great Van Fleet but I feel in terms of retro rock vibin' it can't really compete with some of the best artsy modern retro prog acts, like Ring Van Mobius. It's super duper amazing when you confront it with other popular mainsteramish stuff though. To me Greta's always been retro rock on easy mode. :) But what's cool is that it can act like a gateway for many to delve into this sorta music and explore the top of the line prog shіt!


Edited by Hrychu - September 15 2023 at 02:50
“On the day of my creation, I fell in love with education. And overcoming all frustration, a teacher I became.”
— Ernest Vong
Back to Top
edefakiel View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: February 17 2013
Location: Dos hermanas
Status: Offline
Points: 293 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote edefakiel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 15 2023 at 03:59
I think that Wobbler is considerably closer to Yes than to Genesis.
Back to Top
SteveG View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: April 11 2014
Location: Kyiv In Spirit
Status: Offline
Points: 20604 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SteveG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 15 2023 at 05:43
Well good on you, son! Clap
This message was brought to you by a proud supporter of the Deep State.
Back to Top
Gerinski View Drop Down
Prog Reviewer
Prog Reviewer
Avatar

Joined: February 10 2010
Location: Barcelona Spain
Status: Offline
Points: 5154 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (2) Thanks(2)   Quote Gerinski Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 15 2023 at 06:48
I think that many if not most of the "clone bands" (at least the good ones) only sound like their reference on the first listens. As you listen more and more, you start to appreciate their own character and the "clone feeling" fades away quite a bit.

For example the album "Somewhere but Yesterday" by Citizen Cain sounds very much like Gabriel-era Genesis, but now after many listens it is a favourite of mine.

The same with Fish-era Marillion, on first listen they sounded very much like Genesis, but now not anymore (to me at least).

Or Cathedral or Wobbler with respect to Yes.

Or Triumvirat with respect to ELP.

The existence of bands like The Darkness or Greta Van Fleet is positive at least in that they may awaken the interest of young people for classic Rock and make them discover the greats of the 70s.
Back to Top
Hrychu View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: November 03 2013
Location: poland?
Status: Offline
Points: 5353 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hrychu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 15 2023 at 13:37
Somewhere but Yesterday both does and doesn't do the Genesis thing. There are parts in it which sound nothing like Genesis to me and parts that bear almost a cover-level resemblance to said band. Besides, Cyrus' singing has some Gabriel-like qualities to his voice, but that voice is way more powerful and his "in character" singing or spoken word parts have so much more power and are better performed in terms of the acting.
“On the day of my creation, I fell in love with education. And overcoming all frustration, a teacher I became.”
— Ernest Vong
Back to Top
mellotronwave View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: January 30 2021
Location: Belgium
Status: Offline
Points: 9964 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mellotronwave Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 15 2023 at 17:19
It is better to listen to Greta and/or WM ( they still exist ?) rather than soup/molasses offered by official/commercial radios. Rock no longer represents by far the best sales in music.He is far behind, dance , electro and pop mainstreams.
So, if a teenager listening for the first time to LZ ever tells you that they look/sound very much like GVF or WM , don’t be offended because he is on the right track

Edited by mellotronwave - September 15 2023 at 17:29
Back to Top
richardh View Drop Down
Prog Reviewer
Prog Reviewer
Avatar

Joined: February 18 2004
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 27956 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote richardh Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 15 2023 at 20:42
I'm not sure about the whole clone band thing. There is just music. The Darkness were an asbolute hoot and were copying Queen I guess , Muse have been accused of the same thing quite often but would anyone think that Muse and The Darkness are alike??!

Lots of so called Genesis clones out there especially IQ who are one of my favourite bands, but they kinda of represent a path that Genesis could have taken but decided not to. They took up the batten. Wobbler and Yes are similar but I guess we would rather Yes were doing what Wobbler do now!
Back to Top
Saperlipopette! View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: December 20 2010
Location: Tomorrowland
Status: Offline
Points: 11597 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Saperlipopette! Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 15 2023 at 23:23
^ Yes a lot of the "clone band"-thing is created by rock journalists and general a****le behaviour by people who seem to enjoy trying to hurt certain bands with certain sounds. I'm no saint myself, and probably been simliarly dismissive here on these boards at times. And while I'm not the biggest fan out there (because I'm not the world's biggest fan of Yes, I suppose) I surely prefer Wobbler over the four last decades of music by Yes.

I'd rather have a band with the feel, energy, musicality and groove of late 1960's Stones, early 1970's Tull, 1980's Metallica etc... over the current touring and album releasing version of any of them.

Btw: I have no issues with any of these ageing rockers still touring and recording. They've done this practically all their lives, so why not keep doing it until your heart stops. It' just that I personally choose their peak era. Most of them have sort of become their own clone bands anyway, haven't they?     

Back to Top
richardh View Drop Down
Prog Reviewer
Prog Reviewer
Avatar

Joined: February 18 2004
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 27956 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote richardh Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 16 2023 at 03:55
I thought that about Yes a long time ago but personel changes helped for a while (until 1983 mayube) then after that they've had no direction. I prefer almost anything by Glass Hammer over anything Yes did post 70's. Albums liek Fragile and Relayer are admittedly untouchable but we can't just sit around listening to the same 5 albums ad nauseum (or maybe we can LOL)
Back to Top
Dapper~Blueberries View Drop Down
Prog Reviewer
Prog Reviewer
Avatar

Joined: November 06 2021
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 352 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dapper~Blueberries Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 02 2023 at 10:13
Originally posted by GoldenNoseSlim GoldenNoseSlim wrote:

Do I have a bias problem? LOL

And where do you stand on "clone bands"?

I do not think you have a bias, but more like an understanding between having an inspired sound from a band and being a rip off. Essentially speaking, Marillion, at least in the Fish era is a band that took the Genesis sound they knew and loved, and decided to give it their own spin, which evolved into something a lot more original by Misplaced Childhood. Greta Van Fleet, to put it bluntly is merely a group of wannabe glam rockers in ugly mullets claiming they are reviving rock (even though rock never really died anyways lol) and playing Led Zeppelin parody songs.
D~B
Back to Top
UnderGround View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: May 20 2022
Location: Hellas
Status: Offline
Points: 356 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote UnderGround Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 11 2023 at 15:14
No you have no problem, I do not like GretaVanFleet at all!
https://antonisadelfidis.bandcamp.com/album/zantea-chronicles-the-nightmare-awakens
Back to Top
omphaloskepsis View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: October 19 2011
Location: Texas
Status: Offline
Points: 6339 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote omphaloskepsis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 11 2023 at 15:31
Originally posted by Saperlipopette! Saperlipopette! wrote:

I do enjoy some Jesus & Mary Chain. But although inspired by... they don't sound much like Velvet Underground to me. They got their own spin and feel distinctly 1980's in the 1980's and 1990's in the 1990's. I don't really have a problem with "clone bands" if the song material is strong enough. That said I'd much rather a band scome across like they are part of a movement of the past, like Kosmischer Laüfer kind of feel like they made all their music in Berlin/Düsseldorf/Germany ca. 1973-1978 - or Needledrop that remind me of early 1970's Canterbury Scene. They feel like an extention of a familiar approach to making music rather than being a being copy of a specific band (like the Wolfmother or Greta van Fleet I've heard). The only reason I don't care for the lion's share of the bands you mention, is because I don't find what they bring to the table memorable or interesting enough. So I choose the original(s) over the copy 10 out of 10 times.

The Jesus & Mary Chain is my favorite non-prog band. Wink  
Back to Top
Psychedelic Paul View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: September 16 2019
Location: Nottingham, U.K
Status: Offline
Points: 39936 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Psychedelic Paul Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 12 2023 at 03:29
I don't know who Greta van Fleet is, but I'm sure I would have heard of her if she was in Marillion. Embarrassed
Back to Top
moshkito View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: January 04 2007
Location: Grok City
Status: Offline
Points: 17497 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote moshkito Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 12 2023 at 04:22
Originally posted by GoldenNoseSlim GoldenNoseSlim wrote:

Hi, 
...
Do I have a bias problem? LOL
...
And where do you stand on "clone bands"?

Hi,

This is one issue with "tastes" and us specifying that we like one thing and we don't like another. In the end, that's unfair to the person/musician who worked what they did. Their expression, and ability to bring it to us, is a gift, whether we like it or not, and we should not "deprive" them of that ability.

Similarly to your comment is this ... does your bias extend to other music, like classical, jazz, you name it ... because if it does, then you are NOT listening to music. You are simply listening to the 5 or 10 things you like, and you will soon forget them!

You either like MUSIC or you don't. I admit that growls and metal are not my specialty but I don't have the heart to dislike them ... that's an important expression, like it or not!

Clones! Weird ... so all the orchestras and various groups playing classical music that is hundreds of years old are "clones"? It might be too soon to bring about many works that some of us were not around to see, or hear, but to not appreciate the beauty of the music and how it stands up, for you to learn about a different expression ... and you call it "clone"? Methinks you dislike music ... because you can't do it, or have it inside?

Please evaluate your discussion of music, now ... and remember that not liking Stravinsky or Beethoven has nothing to do with the music ... has to do with you! So liking/disliking something is, generally, very overrated ... it's just weird to see folks posting on it.
Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
www.pedrosena.com
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down



This page was generated in 0.188 seconds.
Donate monthly and keep PA fast-loading and ad-free forever.