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LearsFool 
Prog Reviewer
Joined: November 09 2014
Location: New York
Status: Offline
Points: 8642
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 Posted: July 04 2016 at 21:44 |
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Anyone looking for synoptic rundowns of the subgenre's bands' careers and works could try David Stubbs's Future Days.
Based on interviews of the artists involved, the book describes the
background of the movement and covers in detail ADII, Can, Kraftwerk,
Faust, Neu, TD/Schulze, Kluster/Cluster, Harmonia, Popol Vuh, and ART,
plus has a chapter that squeezes in talk about Xhol Caravan, Limbus,
Anima, Floh, Guru Guru, Kraan, Nektar, Embryo, and Gunter Schickert.
Also boasting a chapter connecting all this to the later Neue Deutsche
Welle and groups like Einsturzende Neubauten, and an early talk with
this one fellow who, in discussing the legacy of these bands, uses
cultural delineations to hold up the likes of Eloy, Jane, and
Grobschnitt instead, it's worth a look.
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2dogs
Forum Senior Member
Joined: December 03 2011
Location: England
Status: Offline
Points: 705
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Posted: July 04 2016 at 23:43 |
 LearsFool wrote:
Anyone looking for synoptic rundowns of the subgenre's bands' careers and works could try David Stubbs's Future Days.
Based on interviews of the artists involved, the book describes the
background of the movement and covers in detail ADII, Can, Kraftwerk,
Faust, Neu, TD/Schulze, Kluster/Cluster, Harmonia, Popol Vuh, and ART,
plus has a chapter that squeezes in talk about Xhol Caravan, Limbus,
Anima, Floh, Guru Guru, Kraan, Nektar, Embryo, and Gunter Schickert.
Also boasting a chapter connecting all this to the later Neue Deutsche
Welle and groups like Einsturzende Neubauten, and an early talk with
this one fellow who, in discussing the legacy of these bands, uses
cultural delineations to hold up the likes of Eloy, Jane, and
Grobschnitt instead, it's worth a look. |
I had a look at this one in a shop not long ago, but didn't buy as fully half of it was ADII, Can, Kraftwerk, Faust and Neu i.e. the ones that got released in the UK at the time and are well known to UK music writers. I used to have Julian Cope's Krautrocksampler but sold it in the end as I nearly knew it by heart and had bought all the albums on his list. It's a really funny book but totally bigoted in his hatred of heavy rock such as Birth Control and intellectual, carefully composed works like Dark Side of the Moon, Yes or Henry Cow. La Dusseldorf in particular seem to have been included more for their throwaway attitude than musical interest. I found a lot more fantastic music through the CD box sets Krautrock: Music for your Brain  .
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CPicard
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 03 2008
Location: Là, sui monti.
Status: Offline
Points: 10841
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Posted: July 05 2016 at 05:06 |
BaldJean wrote:
CPicard wrote:
^I could always ask to my brother and my sister to translate it for me... If I can find it!
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I will describe two scenes which made me think "this should be made into a movie".
scene 1: Amon Düül 2 played at a festival in Paris. before them Hawkwind had played their gig, and they needed a lot of time to get their gear off the stage, so the audience grew impatient. one spectator broke off the back of a chair and threw it on stage where it hit synth player Kalle Hausmann, a very thin guy, on the shoulder. this made bassist Lothar Meid mad, and he threw it back into the audience where it hit a spectator right in the face. the audience really became angry after that, and to save the situation Meid plugged in his bass and played the Marsellaise. what followed was one of the best Amon Düül 2 gigs ever.
scene 2: Amon Düül 2 played a concert in Frankfurt. when they returned to their hotel a buffet for bankers and businessmen took place on the ground floor, and the Düüls in their totally stoned condition decided to crash the party in their hippie clothes, picking up chicken drumsticks and other food stuff with their hashish-stained fingers. a fight broke out. one of the bankers went mad shouting "you just hit my brother who is suffering from a lung complaint". the stoned Düüls decided to take a powder and ran into the streets, but the bankers and businessmen were really angry now, got into their cars and tried to run them over or squeeze them to the walls.
hours later Ingeborg Schober and Rüdiger Nüchtern drove all around Frankfurt picking up the frightened Düül members who had hid themselves in the streets.
I think you will agree that these episodes would be great scenes for a movie
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Indeed. That's the kind of anecdotes which make me think that a book about the French band Barricades could be interesting... Now, to make a movie about AD2... I still think it lacks some explosions and superpowers to appeal Hollywood. 
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BaldJean
Prog Reviewer
Joined: May 28 2005
Location: Germany
Status: Offline
Points: 10387
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Posted: July 05 2016 at 05:12 |
CPicard wrote:
BaldJean wrote:
CPicard wrote:
^I could always ask to my brother and my sister to translate it for me... If I can find it!
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I will describe two scenes which made me think "this should be made into a movie".
scene 1: Amon Düül 2 played at a festival in Paris. before them Hawkwind had played their gig, and they needed a lot of time to get their gear off the stage, so the audience grew impatient. one spectator broke off the back of a chair and threw it on stage where it hit synth player Kalle Hausmann, a very thin guy, on the shoulder. this made bassist Lothar Meid mad, and he threw it back into the audience where it hit a spectator right in the face. the audience really became angry after that, and to save the situation Meid plugged in his bass and played the Marsellaise. what followed was one of the best Amon Düül 2 gigs ever.
scene 2: Amon Düül 2 played a concert in Frankfurt. when they returned to their hotel a buffet for bankers and businessmen took place on the ground floor, and the Düüls in their totally stoned condition decided to crash the party in their hippie clothes, picking up chicken drumsticks and other food stuff with their hashish-stained fingers. a fight broke out. one of the bankers went mad shouting "you just hit my brother who is suffering from a lung complaint". the stoned Düüls decided to take a powder and ran into the streets, but the bankers and businessmen were really angry now, got into their cars and tried to run them over or squeeze them to the walls.
hours later Ingeborg Schober and Rüdiger Nüchtern drove all around Frankfurt picking up the frightened Düül members who had hid themselves in the streets.
I think you will agree that these episodes would be great scenes for a movie
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Indeed. That's the kind of anecdotes which make me think that a book about the French band Barricades could be interesting...
Now, to make a movie about AD2... I still think it lacks some explosions and superpowers to appeal Hollywood.
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Wim Wenders could do the Amon Düül 2 movie. he was part of the crew for the "Amon Düül 2 plays Phallus Dei" movie already
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 A shot of me as High Priestess of Gaia during our fall festival. Ceterum censeo principiis obsta
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WeepingElf
Forum Senior Member
Joined: August 18 2013
Location: Germany
Status: Offline
Points: 373
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Posted: July 05 2016 at 13:25 |
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I can recommend two good ones I have read:
David Stubbs: Funny Days. Krautrock and the Building of Modern Germany. London: Faber & Faber, 2016.
Henning Dedekind: Krautrock. Underground, LSD und Kosmische Kuriere. Höfen: Hannibal, 2008. (In German.)
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... brought to you by the Weeping Elf
"What does Elvish rock music sound like?" - "Yes."
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Logan
Forum & Site Admin Group
Site Admin
Joined: April 05 2006
Location: Vancouver, BC
Status: Offline
Points: 35804
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Posted: July 05 2016 at 13:44 |
BaldJean wrote:
CPicard wrote:
BaldJean wrote:
CPicard wrote:
^I could always ask to my brother and my sister to translate it for me... If I can find it!
|
I will describe two scenes which made me think "this should be made into a movie".
scene 1: Amon Düül 2 played at a festival in Paris. before them Hawkwind had played their gig, and they needed a lot of time to get their gear off the stage, so the audience grew impatient. one spectator broke off the back of a chair and threw it on stage where it hit synth player Kalle Hausmann, a very thin guy, on the shoulder. this made bassist Lothar Meid mad, and he threw it back into the audience where it hit a spectator right in the face. the audience really became angry after that, and to save the situation Meid plugged in his bass and played the Marsellaise. what followed was one of the best Amon Düül 2 gigs ever.
scene 2: Amon Düül 2 played a concert in Frankfurt. when they returned to their hotel a buffet for bankers and businessmen took place on the ground floor, and the Düüls in their totally stoned condition decided to crash the party in their hippie clothes, picking up chicken drumsticks and other food stuff with their hashish-stained fingers. a fight broke out. one of the bankers went mad shouting "you just hit my brother who is suffering from a lung complaint". the stoned Düüls decided to take a powder and ran into the streets, but the bankers and businessmen were really angry now, got into their cars and tried to run them over or squeeze them to the walls.
hours later Ingeborg Schober and Rüdiger Nüchtern drove all around Frankfurt picking up the frightened Düül members who had hid themselves in the streets.
I think you will agree that these episodes would be great scenes for a movie
|
Indeed. That's the kind of anecdotes which make me think that a book about the French band Barricades could be interesting...
Now, to make a movie about AD2... I still think it lacks some explosions and superpowers to appeal Hollywood.
|
Wim Wenders could do the Amon Düül 2 movie. he was part of the crew for the "Amon Düül 2 plays Phallus Dei" movie already
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Unnamed sources say that Michael Bay is the odds on favourite to direct the big explosive sequel to Amon Düül tentatively being called Amon Düül 2: the Wrath of Amon Düül. I'd personally prefer Wim Wenders, or even Tarantino. There may also be a comedy based on Amon Düül called Düül and Düüler.
WeepingElf wrote:
I can recommend two good ones I have read:
David Stubbs: Funny Days. Krautrock and the Building of Modern Germany. London: Faber & Faber, 2016.
Henning Dedekind: Krautrock. Underground, LSD und Kosmische Kuriere. Höfen: Hannibal, 2008. (In German.)
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Those sound interesting.
Edited by Logan - July 05 2016 at 13:47
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moshkito
Forum Senior Member
Joined: January 04 2007
Location: Grok City
Status: Offline
Points: 17511
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Posted: July 09 2016 at 19:25 |
BaldJean wrote:
Wim Wenders could do the Amon Düül 2 movie. he was part of the crew for the "Amon Düül 2 plays Phallus Dei" movie already
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I, personally, would rather have Werner Herzog, as Wenders is a bit too slow for my tastes and his tendency to take too long in a moment, might help the ear like "Yeti" and "Dance of the Lemmings", but it will make the whole thing prohibitive in a place like America or England. It's like watching the Grateful Dead do "Dark Star", or Pink Floyd do "Echoes" in the movie ... not many folks have the ability to close their eyes and enjoy "the trip" ... like some of us here can and do.
Film wise, of all the directors, there is one I think would be the best to make a film on AD2, but not many directors have the "trip quotient" down pat and so vivid that we sit here and go ... wow ... even 2001 was boring now, and this is the part that would make the film more original and exciting for me. I do not think, or believe, I will see this in my lifetime at all. Of all the names, the one I would love to see it done by, would have been Luis Bunuel, who would have matched up surrealistic moments well, and the other one would have been Jean Luc Godard, the most famous, roll the camera and let it happen ... until you wonder, what just happened. Very rock music in the days of getting really high! Just ask the Grateful Dead!
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Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
www.pedrosena.com
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moshkito
Forum Senior Member
Joined: January 04 2007
Location: Grok City
Status: Offline
Points: 17511
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Posted: July 09 2016 at 19:30 |
WeepingElf wrote:
I can recommend two good ones I have read:
David Stubbs: Funny Days. Krautrock and the Building of Modern Germany. London: Faber & Faber, 2016.
Henning Dedekind: Krautrock. Underground, LSD und Kosmische Kuriere. Höfen: Hannibal, 2008. (In German.)
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My biggest complaint ... no translation, and that means the writer is not interested in taking this further, and the book by Dedekind fits this mold. It is simply crazy to think that someone would write something and cut down its availability to a minimal number, specially when the stories and the articles referring to many of those bands, suffered horribly from not being available or extended beyond the mother country. This is documented in very tough and harsh detail in the "EUROCK" book and it fits many many many bands in many other countries. It is by far, the worst thing ... but lacking English, these days, pretty much makes one naive and make the work feel like just another college paper for the professor!
To me, the soul of the book is already lost as a limb has been cutoff. I would have loved to read this and review it, and there are a couple of other books on the same subject that also limited themselves to nothing!
But, maybe, the book is not meant to go beyond the borders of the Bardo, because no one will understand it or get it?
Edited by moshkito - July 09 2016 at 19:32
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Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
www.pedrosena.com
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Lewian
Prog Reviewer
Joined: August 09 2015
Location: Italy
Status: Online
Points: 14728
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Posted: July 10 2016 at 06:46 |
For starters, "Tanz der Lemminge" (the book) should be translated. It's a great read and one of my favourite books. PS: This thread made me google Ingeborg Schober, I didn't know that she died in 2010. RIP! 
Edited by Lewian - July 10 2016 at 06:48
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Mascodagama
Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: December 30 2006
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 5111
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Posted: July 10 2016 at 07:19 |
moshkito wrote:
WeepingElf wrote:
I can recommend two good ones I have read:
David Stubbs: Funny Days. Krautrock and the Building of Modern Germany. London: Faber & Faber, 2016.
Henning Dedekind: Krautrock. Underground, LSD und Kosmische Kuriere. Höfen: Hannibal, 2008. (In German.)
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My biggest complaint ... no translation, and that means the writer is not interested in taking this further, and the book by Dedekind fits this mold. It is simply crazy to think that someone would write something and cut down its availability to a minimal number, specially when the stories and the articles referring to many of those bands, suffered horribly from not being available or extended beyond the mother country. This is documented in very tough and harsh detail in the "EUROCK" book and it fits many many many bands in many other countries. It is by far, the worst thing ... but lacking English, these days, pretty much makes one naive and make the work feel like just another college paper for the professor!
To me, the soul of the book is already lost as a limb has been cutoff. I would have loved to read this and review it, and there are a couple of other books on the same subject that also limited themselves to nothing!
But, maybe, the book is not meant to go beyond the borders of the Bardo, because no one will understand it or get it?
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This isn't how it works in publishing. For there to be a translated edition an English language publisher would need to approach the original publisher, licence the rights from them and hire a translator. For that to happen they would need to think they had a decent chance of making some money or at least not losing money. In other words, don't blame the author - blame the lack of a market for this book in English, or the lack of an enterprising publisher willing to take the chance that there is a market.
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moshkito
Forum Senior Member
Joined: January 04 2007
Location: Grok City
Status: Offline
Points: 17511
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Posted: July 10 2016 at 21:29 |
Mascodagama wrote:
... This isn't how it works in publishing. For there to be a translated edition an English language publisher would need to approach the original publisher, licence the rights from them and hire a translator. For that to happen they would need to think they had a decent chance of making some money or at least not losing money. In other words, don't blame the author - blame the lack of a market for this book in English, or the lack of an enterprising publisher willing to take the chance that there is a market. |
You are writing this to the son of one of the best known translators in Portuguese Literature ... he brought a lot of American, English and French writers to Portugal, at a time, when it was not being done. I won't ask my mom (she's 95) how much money he made off those ... she'll tell you really good ... but I show you pictures of the shack we lived in in Brazil, when we left Portugal behind.
Translations, in my estimation is about how much you want to communicate to others and share your experience. With that said, there are many folks, that think that one's culture is more important than the rest, and they would not translate, because they feel the language is the important part of the culture. This was the case in many Portuguese departments in the UC system my own father was a part of. They confuse the content for the language itself ... instead of showing how clear and well meaning, many of those artists were and ARE, still.
If money, was the only thing that a publisher looked for ... most of them would be out of business, btw! The fact is that you try things without knowing the result and hope that things turn out ... a translation might have been done by many friends or academics, for nothing, but the credit for the value of the work. In general, it makes me think that some of the material in there is not true at all, and taking it further is counter productive.
There is a lot about that/this scene, that needs to be discussed, and the film/theater and music angle is being ignored, and sometimes, the only things one can read are the likes of Peter Michael Hamel's "From Music to the Self" which is a nice book, but it is also very harsh on a lot of music, because it does not have the academic feel that he wants for all of it. You can't dismiss the human spirit and its differences, and how some of these became a very valuable artistic scene.
The problem is, we do not have respect for the artistic feelings, and confuse those with pop music and its who cares quota, because it was not famous enough! I can list, easily enough, a lot more artistic "scenes" that died with less attention than what we give this one thread!
We, simply, do not believe in it! If we did, its value would magnify and the writers and musicians would extend it a bit more. Which many are doing, because too many of those folks were just getting stoned and partying and did not care about anything else.
While the "__autrock" is peculiar to the German tradition of music, in many ways, it is an artistic scene that spread with film and literature and theater, and as such, it would help a lot more to expand the knowledge and understanding of that artistic period, by allowing it to be heard, seen and appreciated in other places. This has helped the film and theater world in Germany, but in some ways, it has not helped the rock music as much ... and I find that sad, mainly because this is one style (if it can be called that!) that is very special to me, and my appreciation in music.
Edited by moshkito - July 12 2016 at 00:23
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Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
www.pedrosena.com
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Mascodagama
Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: December 30 2006
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 5111
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Posted: July 14 2016 at 14:53 |
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^ I hear you, but these days it's pretty much only the small presses that will put a book out even if they'll likely lose money on it. Mainstream publishing got like everything else, all about the dollar / euro. The Dedekind book is published by an imprint of Koch, one of the big European media conglomerates. That means nobody will get to do a foreign edition without fronting them coin. Hard proposition for a niche interest book like this. I wish it was different.
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moshkito
Forum Senior Member
Joined: January 04 2007
Location: Grok City
Status: Offline
Points: 17511
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Posted: July 15 2016 at 14:06 |
Mascodagama wrote:
^ I hear you, but these days it's pretty much only the small presses that will put a book out even if they'll likely lose money on it. Mainstream publishing got like everything else, all about the dollar / euro. The Dedekind book is published by an imprint of Koch, one of the big European media conglomerates.... |
And a worthless conglomerate that will be broke soon, because they do not know, understand or bother to take a look at who their audience is. Guess where the majority of the conversation about "__autrock" is happening ... yep, and it's in English.
It's not only naive, it's downright silly!
(PS: Reminds me of American TV ... ohh, let's do a new show ... blahblah crime, again this time with ...")
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Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
www.pedrosena.com
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Good Books On Krautrock?
